12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
#1387371
02/14/13 02:50 PM
02/14/13 02:50 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,094 Sunnyvale, CA
Jeepmon
OP
master
|
OP
master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,094
Sunnyvale, CA
|
I see everybody jumping on the 16V band wagon.. Spending hundreds of dollars to convert their batteries and chargers and alternator over to 16V.. which got me to thinking about this and other than being the hip.. popular thing to do.. I just dont understand why people will want to fork over the money for something that isnt needed.
During my recent upgrade to a larger motor with 15:1 compression.. it was obvious my little 12V system wasnt going to cut it, specially when the batteries become weak.. My car, as will many other racers.. has two 12V batteries, each paralleled together.. I started pulling wires.. relocating solenoids and turned my system into a 24V system.. but the 24V is only to spin the starter motor over and is not used for anything else..
The first 12V battery still runs the lights, fan, pump and all the electronics.. the second battery is completely isolated and is only used on the starter circuit... at 24VDC, it spins the motor over mighty good too... almost too good.
Knowing that it wont.. but fearing that it might.. I went ahead and lowered the voltage for the starter, I have since swapped the second 12V battery for an old Volkswagon 6V battery.. which makes the voltage to the starter now an 18V system.
The first 12V battery will still be charged by the alternator and will still get a "top off" with the battery charger in between rounds.. But according to my math.. I will have to charge up the second 6V battery once.. maybe twice thru out the year, since the starter motor only spins over for a matter of a few seconds each time.
I'm not suggesting this mod for everyone.. but if you have the knowledge to draw up a schematic on how to isolate and run the 2nd battery.. think about it and see if you can come up with any flaws..
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1387373
02/14/13 04:02 PM
02/14/13 04:02 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,008 Sweet Home Alabama
MRMOPAR622
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,008
Sweet Home Alabama
|
We are running 2 red-top 12 volts in both cars and the black dragster,and one 16 volt in the red dragster,no alternator's on any of them.We will be replacing the 2 red-tops in each to 1 16 volt for the weight savings.1 good 16 volt will do the job,but don't last as long and the 16 volt chargers don't charge the battery back up as fast as the 12 volt chargers. Would really like to know which is the best battery for a race car.Everyone seems to think one is better than the other or it does not matter at all which battery you run.The new $1200.00+ batteries are out of the question. What about using something like a motorcycle battery as the 2nd one in place of a 6 volt? There are a lot of good mind's here on Moparts maybe if we put all our minds together we can come up with what's best!
"To Be The Man'You Have Got To Beat The Man"
"T/D and Pro-Bracket Racer"
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: mokid]
#1387376
02/14/13 09:54 PM
02/14/13 09:54 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,008 Sweet Home Alabama
MRMOPAR622
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,008
Sweet Home Alabama
|
No alternators.....the battery going below 12 volts during the run is my reason at the present for running the 16 volt battery.Running alcohol in both the dragsters and the faster the engine turns the better they crank on alcohol.But if someone has a better idea,better choice in batteries I'm all for it.
"To Be The Man'You Have Got To Beat The Man"
"T/D and Pro-Bracket Racer"
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: MRMOPAR622]
#1387377
02/14/13 10:23 PM
02/14/13 10:23 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,330 Lynchburg, VA
Leon441
master
|
master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,330
Lynchburg, VA
|
12 volts works fine until the voltage drops below 10.5 during cranking and your MSD quits due to low voltage. Under normal circumstances this never happens. But, have you ever forgot to turn the fuel pump on or anything stupid in a late round and spun the motor over and the car did not start. Well it happens.
My reasons for going to 16 volts were simple. I liked the way new cars light the highway. My old bulbs do with 16 volts. I like the fans, water pump, and fuel pump spinning harder. I also noticed a battery voltage drop when turning high RPM with 6 large nitrous soleniods open. With a 16 volt system your battery is basically dead at 13.5 volts. So little things like MSD never get low enough to quit.
I had considered switching back to 12 volts. Then some things changed at work that made me rethink this.
We have many 12 volts systems at work that were simply giving us a fit. DATA radios eat battery like crazy. They have surge protection that eats .7 volts. So you loose .3 volts and people go crazy. Electronic guys will quickly catch on to why that would be. So when you are on backup you quickly can be under 11.8 volts and declining fast. 11.5 and the Radio quits. We loose power quite often in storms and just normal power company service work. We can't have the safe passage of our freight stopped because we are hard headed and stuck in a 12 volt world. We now run 16 volts on these systems. Just like race cars we have to be careful and not overcharge our batteries. Not due to the battery health but the equipment they feed.
Leon
Career best 8.02 @ 169 at 3050# and 10" tires small block power.
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: MRMOPAR622]
#1387378
02/14/13 10:33 PM
02/14/13 10:33 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,174 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,174
PA.
|
According to my racepak my voltage never went below 12.6 volts during a quarter-mile pass with a 60 amp alternator.
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1387379
02/15/13 11:22 AM
02/15/13 11:22 AM
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 21,345 Marysville, O-H-I-O
70Cuda383
Too Many Posts
|
Too Many Posts
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 21,345
Marysville, O-H-I-O
|
what about weight savings? are 16 volt batteries lighter than "standard" 12v car batteries?
in a vehicle with an alternator, is there a lightweight 12v battery that you can run instead of going 16v?
what's the cheapest, lightest battery out there? the guy I'm helping is NOT going to be spending hundreds of dollars on a battery.
**Photobucket sucks**
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#1387382
02/15/13 12:39 PM
02/15/13 12:39 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
Most guys I know have the battery in the rear of the car so the weight isnt really a bad thing(but yes, weight is weight).. I've never had any issue with the 12v system and I dont plan on going to the 16v... I've tried multiple things when it comes to the charging system over the years, no alt, alt with a switch on the field to turn it off and it never made any difference... I havent even put a charger on my car in years... the last time I did was when I unplugged my alt output to plug my timing light in and I forgot to plug it back on... now I use the Flaming River light so it has its own power NOTE that same battery has been in the car for at least 8 years
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1387383
02/15/13 01:23 PM
02/15/13 01:23 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,008 Sweet Home Alabama
MRMOPAR622
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,008
Sweet Home Alabama
|
But what is the most powerful of all batteries?Most of us may can get by with out the strongest battery,but all of us really need the strongest & best battery that's made.Lets start with a clean sheet and focus on only the battery nothing(not voltage,charging system,using or not using alt.) else and see which volt and name battery we end up with.
"To Be The Man'You Have Got To Beat The Man"
"T/D and Pro-Bracket Racer"
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: Jeepmon]
#1387384
02/15/13 01:27 PM
02/15/13 01:27 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,366
Las Vegas
|
Well still happy with my boring plain old 16V XS Power batteries...They work great for me but maybe I need more compression.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: MRMOPAR622]
#1387385
02/15/13 01:38 PM
02/15/13 01:38 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
Quote:
But what is the most powerful of all batteries?Most of us may can get by with out the strongest battery,but all of us really need the strongest & best battery that's made.Lets start with a clean sheet and focus on only the battery nothing(not voltage,charging system,using or not using alt.) else and see which volt and name battery we end up with.
.... I cant even say if the gell is better than the conventional.... all I know is that Chrysler looked at the gell for the production cars and they decided to stay with the conventional style for some reason
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: MRMOPAR622]
#1387386
02/15/13 01:53 PM
02/15/13 01:53 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 341 Highland beach Fl
poisondart2
enthusiast
|
enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 341
Highland beach Fl
|
Quote:
But what is the most powerful of all batteries?Most of us may can get by with out the strongest battery,but all of us really need the strongest & best battery that's made.Lets start with a clean sheet and focus on only the battery nothing(not voltage,charging system,using or not using alt.) else and see which volt and name battery we end up with.
Billy the battery that has the most CCA and Reserve is the strongest like the Braille which has 1115 CCA 150 Reserve but with that said I use yellow tops and I have two that are 10 years old and still dont charge them
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1387387
02/15/13 02:06 PM
02/15/13 02:06 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,174 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,174
PA.
|
If Mopar guys would get out and race and test more instead of constantly looking for that next TRICK part out on the market we as a group would be a lot better off. I've done it too but probably the most stupid thing that we as racers do is remove the alternator in hopes of going faster. Sorry folks, it doesn't work. Here's a list of what I am running during a pass with a 12 volt battery and maintaining 12.6 volts. (60 amp one wire alt) starting engine electronic ign with MSD 7 and misc. rpm boxes Racepak and electronic dash electric water pump electric radiator fan (left on during pass) electric tranny fan (left on during pass) electronic shifter BG400 fuel pump rear taillights (at night) tranny brake delay box line-loc I think that's all.
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: 12V.... 16V... 18V.... 24V
[Re: poisondart2]
#1387388
02/15/13 02:13 PM
02/15/13 02:13 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,502 SOUTH JERSEY
HEMIFRED
master
|
master
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,502
SOUTH JERSEY
|
I could not decide 12v or 16v and at the time my 12v were ok . So I went and bought a 12v/16v alterntor that way I can make the choice later
home of the Sox and Martin Hemi Duster
|
|
|
|
|