Re: Considering a new bullit......opinions
[Re: justinp61]
#1376416
01/26/13 05:24 PM
01/26/13 05:24 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 492
South Jersey, NJ
DragDart360
mopar
|
mopar
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 492
South Jersey, NJ
|
My small block is two years old. If I were doing it today it would be GEN III Hemi, Probably with a supercharger.
70 Dart Swinger, 2850 lbs
SB 408, Bullet roller 264/268 @50 .636 SSDS stage 2 Edelbrock heads, 1 7/8 Headmans, 1050 dominator by Dom, 9.867 @ 133
|
|
|
Re: Considering a new bullit......opinions
[Re: justinp61]
#1376417
01/26/13 05:26 PM
01/26/13 05:26 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,266
Renton Washington
Triple Threat
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,266
Renton Washington
|
I went through this same thing. I created the following, feel free to ignore the big block column. Prices in some cases are estimates ONLY! Also much of this doesn't fit your scenario. Either way I've included it. I ended up with a Tall deck R3 combo. I didn't feel like being the test dummy for the gen 3 hemi stuff in a bracket application. Drag pack cars run well, but there is nothing cheap about those. 750 HP on pump gas is going to take probably more head than the Indy -1 will provide, at least it will be near maxed out. An hemi head will flow plenty of air, but I worry about the stock block strength, and longevity. Most of the blocks all have very thin cylinder walls, which limits your future rebuild potential. http://www.popularhotrodding.com/tech/1103phr_bes_417ci_gen_iii_hemi/viewall.htmlThat was not a cheap engine to build I'm sure, and there are some internal tricks, light weight ring pack etc. If I was looking for 750 on pump gas, out of a small block/Hemi, and streetable, i'd be looking at BOOST 
Last edited by Triple Threat; 01/26/13 05:30 PM.
-Dustin
67 Dart, 9 second, 392" G3 Hemi
68 Barracuda 340 F/SA
|
|
|
Re: Considering a new bullit......opinions
[Re: justinp61]
#1376418
01/26/13 05:47 PM
01/26/13 05:47 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
You dont want much do you... 750 on pump gas.... either way (gen 3 or a R block will pretty much have to be pressurized... turbo or blower 
|
|
|
Re: Considering a new bullit......opinions
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1376419
01/26/13 06:36 PM
01/26/13 06:36 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,684
W. Kentucky
justinp61
OP
I Live Here
|
OP
I Live Here
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,684
W. Kentucky
|
Yeah 750 may be a stretch. Kyles (W5Duster436) 436 with w-5s made 713 on pump gas with 10.8-1 compression. I figured the Indys would make more steam  . I'd like to be in the 430-460" range. Thanks Dustin .
Last edited by justinp61; 01/26/13 06:46 PM.
|
|
|
Re: Considering a new bullit......opinions
[Re: DragDart360]
#1376421
01/26/13 11:55 PM
01/26/13 11:55 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,978
Hilltown Pa
1967dartgt
master
|
master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,978
Hilltown Pa
|
Factory hemis seem to be good till 1000 hp.
Brett Miller W9 cnc'd heads
STR Chassis fabraction
|
|
|
Re: Considering a new bullit......opinions
[Re: mshred]
#1376425
01/27/13 01:29 PM
01/27/13 01:29 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,711
Portage,michigan
B3422W5
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,711
Portage,michigan
|
I agree, with pump gas/low compression its likely going to take boost to reach 750 ponies. My old 422 W5 motor made 708 horsepower on dyno after Best Machine upgraded it from what it was when i had it. This is big roller, 14 to 1 compression, etc, etc. Might have a shot with a 245 rp indy head and a 48 degree R block, probably the best chance is doing something like that. The hemi might be challenged to get there, even though the heads are great. I am not aware of any hydralic cam profiles that are stout enough to make that kind of power at low compression. That 714 horse effort looks sweet, best NA power i have heard of. Cant wait to hear what you come up with...good luck ETA....i know Indy sells a 750 rated horsepower motor that is 48 degree, but i believe that package/motor has lots of compression.
Last edited by B3422W5; 01/27/13 01:31 PM.
69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8
|
|
|
Re: Considering a new bullit......opinions
[Re: justinp61]
#1376429
01/27/13 04:45 PM
01/27/13 04:45 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
mshred
master
|
master
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,415
Toronto
|
Quote:
Thanks guys. There was an article in CC where the stroked and boosted a Gen III, IIRC it made over 700 hp and torque with a small turbo and 8 or so pounda of boost. It made over 1000 hp with a larger turbo and 16 lbs of boost. But it is insane expensive, almost $6000 for the turbo kit alone  .
Those kits are expensive, BUT, you could probably fab one up yourself for a whole lot cheaper imo...and if we are talking street car here, imagine how much nicer it would be to cruise with 3.23 gears and a tight converter compared to a looser motor converter and steeper gears.
If I didn't have nitrous all ready to go and wired up in my car already I would have built my newest motor as a turbo one...just my 
|
|
|
Re: Considering a new bullit......opinions
[Re: mshred]
#1376430
01/27/13 08:06 PM
01/27/13 08:06 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,139
Melbourne , Australia
LA360
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,139
Melbourne , Australia
|
You need displacement to make that kind of power on pump gas. I would be looking at a boosted engine myself.
Alan Jones
|
|
|
Re: Considering a new bullit......opinions
[Re: justinp61]
#1376431
01/27/13 08:23 PM
01/27/13 08:23 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,776
Ontario Canada
MattW
master
|
master
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,776
Ontario Canada
|
Quote:
I'm considering building a new bullit for the Dart. NO big block....period. I'm trying to decide between another small block with a aftermarket block or a Gen III Hemi. I'm leaning toward the gen III but there is so much conflicting info out there it gets confusing in a hurry. I'd like to make around 750 hp on pump 93.
I'll have to buy everything reguardless of which way I go. If I go small block I'll have to buy a good tall deck block, Indy-1 heads, intake, headers, rotating assembly. The only thing I may be able to use of mine will be the distribuitor, carb and water pump.
A new Hemi would need everything except the carb. With the cost of a X or R block I think the new Hemi would be cheaper.
Opinions?
Thanks, Justin
My is build the G3. In the long run you wil be ahead. Plenty of 5.7 blocks available. Everybody has their preference BIG, SMALL it doesn't matter. IMO the only things that matters is replacement parts, and when thing go wrong it is cheaper to replace the G3 than anything else.
One thing that I have notice with this place is that IT IS HARD TEACHING AN OLD DOG NEW TRICKS. 
Whatever you choose good luck and keep us posted. Matt
|
|
|
|
|
