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904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? #136823 10/15/08 12:27 PM 10/15/08 12:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,586 Tampa, FL tpabayflyer OP pro stock
tpabayflyer OP pro stock Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,586 Tampa, FL	I actually have an A-999 lockup trans freshly rebuilt. It has the low first gear and new alto clutches. I have had the pan off twice in 300miles and both times noticed black sediment in the bottom of the pan??? Trans fluid looks great (synthetic) with no burning smell. Trans pan is stock. I did have a problem with slippage and tightened up the low gear band and it hits nice and hard now. While I had the pan off I also tightened up the other band to spec......... I did install a transgo shift kit per instructions and have no slippage but the 1-2 shift gets weird at full throttle only. At 6,000rpm it made a couple of bangs and the trans was momentarily dis-engaging?? 2-3 shift is fine and since I changed the pan gasket yesterday it seems to not be as bad but it still is not right. Fluid level shows about 1/2 quart on the high side and I am using a nice plate style trans cooler..... Anybody know what this is?? TIA TBF

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: tpabayflyer] #136824 10/15/08 01:20 PM 10/15/08 01:20 PM
Joined: May 2004 Posts: 12,385 Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY Dragula I Live Here
Dragula I Live Here Joined: May 2004 Posts: 12,385 Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY	If you don't put a deep pan and sump on it, you will starve high gear.....Trust me. You must put a deep pan out of it, because it sucks up all the fluid under hard accel, and there's nothting left for the 2nd to 3rd shift...You will kill high gear without it. '70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9) '66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage '71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: tpabayflyer] #136825 10/15/08 01:54 PM 10/15/08 01:54 PM
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	I don,t know exactly what you mean by disengages,is it like it goes to neutral or feels like it drags. If it drags, back the front band screw out a little.

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: tpabayflyer] #136826 10/15/08 02:54 PM 10/15/08 02:54 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 74,979 U.S.S.A. JohnRR I Win
JohnRR I Win Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 74,979 U.S.S.A.	did you take out the accumlator spring and block the piston ? also disengaging in 2nd ? rpm jumping up like a downshift ? front band is slipping or rpm jumping like its in neutral ? rear clutch is slipping/disengaging

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? #136827 10/15/08 03:05 PM 10/15/08 03:05 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,586 Tampa, FL tpabayflyer OP pro stock
tpabayflyer OP pro stock Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,586 Tampa, FL	It is not disengaging completely or dragging at all.... It seems like it disengages for a split second and when it does, it makes a huge bang under the car which may be due to shocking the driveline. I do have brand new u joints..... This only happens on the 1-2 shift... 2-3 is fine... FWIW I did tighten the band in the trans (high gear?) as it was set up a bit loose, I tightened it to 2 1/2 turns out from snug and it seems that maybe it helped a bit but the 1-2 shift is rough.. not a clean bang/chirp upshift but more like a split second roughness during the 1-2 upshift.... TBF

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: tpabayflyer] #136828 10/15/08 03:06 PM 10/15/08 03:06 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,586 Tampa, FL tpabayflyer OP pro stock
tpabayflyer OP pro stock Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,586 Tampa, FL	Am I running the pan dry maybe??? I am shifting at 6,200rpm.... TBF

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: tpabayflyer] #136829 10/15/08 04:25 PM 10/15/08 04:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 74,979 U.S.S.A. JohnRR I Win
JohnRR I Win Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 74,979 U.S.S.A.	what do you have for a pan on it ? As far as the 1-2 , it might be slipping a bit before it grabs firmly , what ratio apply lever did you use ?

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: JohnRR] #136830 10/15/08 04:27 PM 10/15/08 04:27 PM
Joined: May 2004 Posts: 12,385 Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY Dragula I Live Here
Dragula I Live Here Joined: May 2004 Posts: 12,385 Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY	Quote: what do you have for a pan on it ? As far as the 1-2 , it might be slipping a bit before it grabs firmly , what ratio apply lever did you use ? http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=tci-127900 '70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9) '66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage '71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: JohnRR] #136831 10/15/08 08:11 PM 10/15/08 08:11 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,586 Tampa, FL tpabayflyer OP pro stock
tpabayflyer OP pro stock Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,586 Tampa, FL	I am using the stock pan and a 5.0 lever..... fwiw the 2-3 shift is fine thanks TBF

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: tpabayflyer] #136832 10/15/08 08:50 PM 10/15/08 08:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,616 Kissimmee Fl. D dusturbd340W5 master
dusturbd340W5 master D Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,616 Kissimmee Fl.	my experiance is 5.0 don't work too well in a 904 I would use a 3.8 or 4.2 70 duster full chassis super pro 416 CNC Indybrock heads 727 w/brake best so far 1.212 60 6.219 in 1/8 at 110.88 9.768 at 137.81 1/4

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: tpabayflyer] #136833 10/15/08 08:52 PM 10/15/08 08:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 3,699 Newport, Mi Evil Spirit master
Evil Spirit master Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 3,699 Newport, Mi	1-2 shift is accomplished by the low-reverse band releasing (if applied) and the front (also called 2nd gear or kickdown band) being applied by the servo and over-running the rear roller clutch. It doesn't sound like the band is applying fast enough to cleanly clear the rear roller. I usually set my front band to 72 in.lbs., then back off 2 turns. I don't know what you had it set at before, but I think you mentioned that it got better when you reduced it to 2 1/2 turns. Free advice and worth every penny... Factory trained Slinky rewinder.........

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: Evil Spirit] #136834 10/18/08 01:29 AM 10/18/08 01:29 AM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 3,699 Newport, Mi Evil Spirit master
Evil Spirit master Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 3,699 Newport, Mi	Free advice and worth every penny... Factory trained Slinky rewinder.........

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: Evil Spirit] #136835 10/18/08 09:12 AM 10/18/08 09:12 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,982 Ansonia, CT C CJK440 master
CJK440 master C Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,982 Ansonia, CT	Hardly an expert but know enough to be dangerous. If his VB has low band apply and there is black sediment is there too much overlap in 1-2??? If thats the case the 5.0 lever would apply slower and limit the apply. Could the low-rev band been too tight?? 2017 Contusion Blue Challenger T/A 392 M6 "BLKNBLU"

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: CJK440] #136836 10/18/08 09:35 AM 10/18/08 09:35 AM
Joined: May 2006 Posts: 2,046 ky. K kenworth_goose top fuel
kenworth_goose top fuel K Joined: May 2006 Posts: 2,046 ky.	Do you have the kickdown properly adjusted? If not it will eat the front band out of it. I had a 360, 904 in a dakota a few years ago and learned the hard way. After rebuilding it 3 times because of the front band I learned. I'd say the material you are finding and the flash you are talking about in the 1-2 shift is the front band. You will likely need a new band and front drum as well.

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: tpabayflyer] #136837 10/18/08 03:45 PM 10/18/08 03:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,757 Rio Linda, CA John_Kunkel Too Many Posts
John_Kunkel Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,757 Rio Linda, CA	If the "momentarily dis-engaging" happens on a manual 1-2 upshift it's probably a case of severe overlap; on a manual upshift the rear band is slow to disengage and the trans is momentarily "in two gears" at once. The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: John_Kunkel] #136838 10/18/08 03:53 PM 10/18/08 03:53 PM
Joined: Sep 2003 Posts: 7,512 Lebanon ,PA in the Susquehanna... 70Challengerse master
70Challengerse master Joined: Sep 2003 Posts: 7,512 Lebanon ,PA in the Susquehanna...	Quote: If the "momentarily dis-engaging" happens on a manual 1-2 upshift it's probably a case of severe overlap; on a manual upshift the rear band is slow to disengage and the trans is momentarily "in two gears" at once. [/quoteExactly was I was thinking,I have in the past used a spring from a t-35 trans and install it in the rear band...works great and no over lap.

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: CJK440] #136839 10/19/08 10:50 AM 10/19/08 10:50 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 74,979 U.S.S.A. JohnRR I Win
JohnRR I Win Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 74,979 U.S.S.A.	Quote: Hardly an expert but know enough to be dangerous. If his VB has low band apply and there is black sediment is there too much overlap in 1-2??? If thats the case the 5.0 lever would apply slower and limit the apply. Could the low-rev band been too tight?? the 5.0 applys a little faster and has more leverage to hold the drum , but it releases slower .

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: JohnRR] #136840 10/20/08 12:51 AM 10/20/08 12:51 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,586 Tampa, FL tpabayflyer OP pro stock
tpabayflyer OP pro stock Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,586 Tampa, FL	Well, today while driving the car the trans finally let go... 1-2 shift let out a nice big bang and that was all she wrote.... no forward gears or reverse..... but PARK still works O.K. now what... do I look for a small block 727 to build or do I try and fix this 904 (999)??????? I do like having the 2.74 low gear but maybe I should just settle for the 727 and get a higher stqall converter??? TBF

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: tpabayflyer] #136841 10/20/08 01:01 AM 10/20/08 01:01 AM
Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 4,501 Gainesville,FL G goldmember master
goldmember master G Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 4,501 Gainesville,FL	Let me know if the tranny needs a new home,sorry I just sold a SB 727 or I'd offer it in trade.

Re: 904 trans banging full throttle 1-2 upshift?? [Re: tpabayflyer] #136842 10/20/08 08:28 AM 10/20/08 08:28 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 74,979 U.S.S.A. JohnRR I Win
JohnRR I Win Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 74,979 U.S.S.A.	Quote: Well, today while driving the car the trans finally let go... 1-2 shift let out a nice big bang and that was all she wrote.... no forward gears or reverse..... but PARK still works O.K. now what... do I look for a small block 727 to build or do I try and fix this 904 (999)??????? I do like having the 2.74 low gear but maybe I should just settle for the 727 and get a higher stqall converter??? TBF No forward tells me something inside the trans broke ( obviously ) , but no reverse ? it's either a broken input shaft , the splines on the front of the output shaft or the pump , drop the pan and see whats in there ...

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