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Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable #1122730
11/27/11 11:44 PM
11/27/11 11:44 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 442
NRH, TX
BeBeep Offline OP
super street
BeBeep  Offline OP
super street

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 442
NRH, TX
I have a 383 with M/T and a mini starter. The car is fresh out of resto and has 56 miles on it. I went to start the car today and even after the car started th starter stayed engaged. I turned the key off and then on and it still stayed engaged.

I disconnected the neg battery cable which stopped the starter. In the meanwhile the positive battery cable fried so bad it will have to be replaced.

One fella said it could be the mini starter. He said some have metal shaving left in the case due to poor manufacturing and the shaving short out and cause problems such as I had.

Any thoughts, advice, etc? I was wondering if anyone else has had this issue.

Thank You,
Bob

Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: BeBeep] #1122731
11/27/11 11:51 PM
11/27/11 11:51 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
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RapidRobert Offline
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Lincoln Nebraska
before you take it off see if you can see if the tooth engagement is too close so you'll know if the prob is there or a mechanical or electrical prob inside the starter


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Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: BeBeep] #1122732
11/28/11 12:10 AM
11/28/11 12:10 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
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Romeo MI
For the positive cable to fry, the solenoid (relay)
had to be engaged to pass power... change the relay

Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 11/28/11 12:11 AM.
Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: MR_P_BODY] #1122733
11/28/11 12:16 AM
11/28/11 12:16 AM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,157
Mass
DAYCLONA Offline
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DAYCLONA  Offline
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Mass
Quote:

For the positive cable to fry, the solenoid (relay)
had to be engaged to pass power... change the relay







Being a "mini", the OP might want to check the POS stud on the starter as well, it may be contacting the block, esp if the starter is loose, it may be torquing over and touching the block, or may have "welded" the POS stud to the block?

Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: DAYCLONA] #1122734
11/28/11 12:44 AM
11/28/11 12:44 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
MR_P_BODY  Offline
Master

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
Quote:

Quote:

For the positive cable to fry, the solenoid (relay)
had to be engaged to pass power... change the relay







Being a "mini", the OP might want to check the POS stud on the starter as well, it may be contacting the block, esp if the starter is loose, it may be torquing over and touching the block, or may have "welded" the POS stud to the block?




Thats true with the mini... I run the same one on all
my stuff so it has power directly to it and the pos
post is close to the block

Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: BeBeep] #1122735
11/28/11 01:07 AM
11/28/11 01:07 AM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,555
Rittman Ohio
fourgearsavoy Offline
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Posts: 10,555
Rittman Ohio
Seen it a dozen times with Denso starters in the Toyota shop,mainly cheap reman starters from volume distributors,parts houses etc...
There are two contacts in the starter and when the coil(solenoid)is energized the plunger ring makes contact with them.In some cases I have seen the wrong contact installed and it catches the plunger ring and it cant release it.When you get the starter out pull the steel cover with the three screws off.When you look at the plunger and contacts it should be evident what type of failure has occurred.I can get you the correct factory Denso contacts if you need them just drop me a PM
Gus

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Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: fourgearsavoy] #1122736
11/28/11 02:14 AM
11/28/11 02:14 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,551
baldwinsville new york
A
a493demon Offline
pro stock
a493demon  Offline
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Posts: 1,551
baldwinsville new york
a bad ground on your neg. battery cable to the block will also keep the starter going.but like said check to see if the starter stud is hitting the block. brad

Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: a493demon] #1122737
11/28/11 09:40 AM
11/28/11 09:40 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 442
NRH, TX
BeBeep Offline OP
super street
BeBeep  Offline OP
super street

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 442
NRH, TX
Thank you all for the advice, I very much appreciate it.

Happy Holidays!!

Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: BeBeep] #1122738
11/28/11 10:37 AM
11/28/11 10:37 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,968
Hampton, Ga.
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70dart360 Offline
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Hampton, Ga.
I'm betting its the starter relay too.


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Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: BeBeep] #1122739
11/28/11 05:25 PM
11/28/11 05:25 PM
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,822
Colorado
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denfireguy Offline
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Colorado
Robert has you on the right trail, the relay shorted or the drive not releasing will cause your problem. It is easy to check the relay with a light or ohmeter. There should be no connection between the B post (bolt) to the SOL post (to the solenoid). If the starter is jammed, it probably still is jammed with the Bendix drive still extended. Drop the starter and check.
Craig


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Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: denfireguy] #1122740
11/28/11 07:06 PM
11/28/11 07:06 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,533
Indiana
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Fury Fan Offline
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Indiana
Unless the battery cable is really undersized, a fried cable would have me looking for a mild-contact short to ground, like could happen with the extra terminal connections that the ones for the Magnum engines have.

A quick head-poke under the car might give a conclusive answer on that one.

Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: Fury Fan] #1122741
11/28/11 10:56 PM
11/28/11 10:56 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 480
templeton,ma
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coro500net Offline
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templeton,ma
Friend had same problem on his 383,was ign switch

Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: 70dart360] #1122742
11/28/11 11:10 PM
11/28/11 11:10 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 13,200
aZLiViN
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J_BODY Offline
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Quote:

I'm betting its the starter relay too.




My money is on the contacts in the starter.

Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: J_BODY] #1122743
11/29/11 09:58 AM
11/29/11 09:58 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 442
NRH, TX
BeBeep Offline OP
super street
BeBeep  Offline OP
super street

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 442
NRH, TX
As soon as I get a chance to work on the car I will post what I find. Working my holiday "honey do" list so it may be awhile.

Thank you all for your input.

Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: BeBeep] #1122744
12/12/11 10:01 AM
12/12/11 10:01 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 442
NRH, TX
BeBeep Offline OP
super street
BeBeep  Offline OP
super street

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 442
NRH, TX
I just wanted to provide and update to this issue.

I found what it was that made the starter stay engaged. Turns out the positive cable where it connects to the starter was in contact with the headers.

So basically the headers melted the plastic casing which ended with the pos wire grounding out and melting the red cable which then melted the starter relay wire which caused the relay not to shut off.

So there was nothing actually wrong with the starter or the relay, it was poor installation of the cable to the starter.

I replaced the starter, cable and the relay since I had everything and she is running like a champ now.

Thanks everyone!!

Last edited by BeBeep; 12/12/11 10:01 AM.
Re: Need advice - Starter stays engaged burned pos cable [Re: BeBeep] #1122745
12/12/11 10:40 AM
12/12/11 10:40 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
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RapidRobert Offline
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Quote:

she is running like a champ now.




live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth






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