5.7 Top End Clatter

I have an 06 rebuilt long block 5.7 Gen3. First start and it has oil pressure, AMSOIL Synthetic. There was a lot of clatter coming from the motor, sounds a lot like lifter issues. The rebuilder says the lifters can take a long time to pump up and to run it for a while. Had it going for 30 minutes when I started it up again yesterday and it still sounds like every lifter is still empty. It runs smooth and has good response. My technical knowledge on the 5.7 is very limited. It sounds worse than a SBC with a solid cam and loose rockers that I had at one time. Sounds like a diesel when it idles.

MSD Hemi 6
MSD Atomic EFI on MP Intake
Non VVT
No EGR
Stock, used Ram Truck cam

Is this something easy to fix or does the engine need to come back out?

MDS lifters maybe? Are the solenoids still in the block?

How would I tell? When it was built he told me it was converted to non VVT and that is all that I know right now. If that is the problem, is it an easy fix?

Not sure how you can tell other then pull the lifters. VVT and MDS are 2 different things. Under the intake in the top of the block there are 3/4 -1 inch holes and either have plastic plugs or solenoids in the holes. It is not an "easy" fix you would have to pull the heads to change the lifters unfortunately.

There are not solenoids in the valley, there are plugs. There is no other electronics on the engine except for the Hemi 6.

Hopefully one of the guys well versed with MDS will chime in. If the engine had MDS lifters installed I am not sure how they operate without the solenoids. I am not sure of the strategy there. Have you pulled the valve covers to take a look at rockers and such? Another idea could be the rockers were installed incorrectly the shafts have to be orientated properly for the lifters to oil correctly.

I haven't pulled the VC yet. That is quite a project already in the car. I am continuing to research and have found that there are sometimes issues with the lifters taking a long time to "pump up". Something to do with the lifters getting oil from the top rather than through an oil galley. I want to make sure of all the options before I open up the engine prematurely. The valve train was a specific discussion the engine builder and I had prior to building.

You are going to have to pull the valve cover and see if it’s bent push rod or a bad lifter.
Bear with me here I know you don’t have solenoids.
Oiling on these G3s goes like this, Oil from the filter heads to the main galley, it feeds both the crank and Cam bears from there. There are 4 passages that head up to the heads from the main galley, each one of those passages has a branch that goes to a lifter valley , the lifter valley is divided up into 4 sperate sections.
When the solenoid is active it pushes a plunger down and blocks the oil from the head passages, at this point the lifters are only feed oil from the pushrods. Oil travels down the pushrod and bleeds out the BIG hole in the MDS lifter, allowing the lifter to collapse under the Valve spring pressure
When the lifters are getting oil feed from both sources there is enough pressure to over come the valve spring that is trying to collapse the MDS lifter.
With the Plugs installed the lifters get oil from both sources.

Now there could be MDS lifter in this engine and at idle the oil pressure is low enough now that it has some mile on it that the lifters are not “pumped” up at start.


But either way I hate being the bearer of bad news..it’ go to be opened up.

I am afraid of that. It won't be just one though, it clatters like an orchestra. The guy that built it seemed to know his Hemis, but everything is suspect now. He said the lifters needed to pump up and it would not take over 30 minutes and most are just a few minutes. I passed that time though. Would it be advisable to run at a higher rpm to provide more oil to the lifters?

I bought a truck once that had just had the valve springs replaced and would not quiet down, turns out they had installed the rocker shafts wrong and no oil was getting to the lifters.

When you run an MDS engine with just the plastic plugs in it will shut off those 4 cylinders and it will have 4 cyl power but the lifters will not be noisy.

with mds lifters and you remove the solenoids and put plugs on. it would not run on 4 cylinders but no noises. i have done that mistake once.

Are the pushrods the correct length? What about the lifters,OEM or aftermarket? The lifter and pushrod part numbers change for the '09 up maybe they were used vs the early parts(I'm not exactly sure of the differences between the two).What about head gasket orientation/year will this block oil flow? Just some ideas,maybe add to the confusion!
RT

there are few different lengths pushrods, the pre 5.7s being the shortest,.

My next question would be , "are the heads milled " the oil travels thru slot in the bottom of the head from the block passage to the head bolt hole that feeds the rocker arms. I've seen pre eagle heads mill enough to effect the flow.

My knowledge on the 5.7 is very beginner, so can't offer much in the way of info. The builder won't look at it and I won't pull the heads in the car, it was just painted. Ordered an ATK crate motor and it will be here in 3 weeks. So back out the bottom it comes. There is too much to do to just pull the valve covers, so I am eliminating the problem completely. I will have someone check out the old motor when I strip it and after I find what is messed up I will decide what to do.

Link for video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIN2lfFoJPM

Listen for when it shuts off.

no need to pull the head just the valve covers, I would almost bet money a rocker shaft is upside down or switched end to end

I removed the valve covers and found that the rockers were moving from side to side and making noise. Don't know what the problem is, but all the rockers have side play. Any ideas why?

they always have a little side play when they are not opening the valve. When the lifter pumps up it makes it not an issue. I would still check to see if the shafts are flipped upside down.

Is that indicated by a notch on each end of the tube? All four are up.

Just bump a thread for you.
Matt
Shaft orientation.

Thanks, read it and the notches are up, so that is not the culprit. It was run long enough for lifters to pump up, but still loose.

Intake to the front notches up.
exhaust to the back notches up.

How loose? I just replaced the lifters on my 6.1 as one was really lose... had a lifter plunger that wouldn't come all the way back up to the top. You could lift it up off the valve a lot. With the new lifters in, not ran yet, they will slide a little side to side, but not too far.

Even pumped up the rockers had slight clearances to the valves and toward the pedestals, My first thought is the pushrods are all a hair short.