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67 Belvedere

Posted By: DLewis

67 Belvedere - 10/14/14 04:10 AM

I'm not sure how much I'll put here but maybe I'll get some help or help someone else.

This is my 1967 Belvedere. After traveling the US last year to find a clean 70 Road Runner with no luck this car popped up on Craigslist locally and is a really clean car. There are two small holes behind the wheel wells I can't fit my little finger in. The paint is 20+ years old and cracking but I like it the way it is with all the redneck stickers. Somewhere during it's life someone decided to take just about everything off a GTX that makes it a GTX and put it onto this car including the fender tag, but the VIN and the paint underneath the blue doesn't match the tag. I'm not sure if I'll keep the GTX stuff on it or not.

The plan is to do a mini tub, leaf relocation, 440, and 4 speed. I'm currently reading up to decide what to do with frame stiffening. It'll get subframe connectors for sure. Any advice on the US Tool frame kits? No luck yet finding a suitable rear end and I'm tempted to put in a 9" just to keep it easy. I also plan to put it all together and running before stripping it back down for new paint.


Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/14/14 04:24 AM

A suitable rear end? Nothing wrong with the 8.75 that's in it. They are plenty tough up to 500-600HP, especially on the street. If anything add a Dana 60, but no need to put a Ford 9" in it! I am a vendor for US Cartool, their frame connectors and other stiffening kits are outstanding. You can't do much better IMO.
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/14/14 04:50 AM

Thanks Scott, I'm currently looking at 600-700hp just because I've found an engine already built at a more reasonable price. I've been watching for a Dana and 4 speed but no luck locally yet. Ill admit I'm not sure what my options are outside of the 60's built for cars. I've been focusing on the frame and tubs but some say I should have the engine and driveline in before doing the frame.
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/14/14 06:34 AM

If you are going to a Dana I'd recommend just buying a brand new one with the gears you want. Dr.Diff would be the vendor I'd choose. Try Wayne Brewer for a 4 speed, or go to Jamie Passon for one of his awesome 5 speeds (you'll have to wait for one, long time backorder).
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/22/14 10:32 PM

I have a 67 Belvedere with the GTX badges they look good so I left them. I used the U S Cartool connectors and the torque box's LOVE them.These cars are truly unappreciated. Keep us in the loop it looks good. I have a dana under mine heavy but very dependable.
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/23/14 12:34 AM

Thanks! I've already been in contact with Dr. Diff and Passon. I'm thinking I'll stick with a 4 speed. I went for the overdrive in my last car and never really took advantage of it going to local car shows and stomping the throttle as often as possible. The US Car Tool Chassis stiffening and leaf relocation kits arrived yesterday (Purchased from Scott at Harms Auto. Super fast service and shipping!) I have a rotisserie here but hearing mixed reviews on how much welding should be done with it on the rotisserie and how much should be done before and after the drive train is in place. .. Just another excuse to scour the pages here.
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/23/14 10:14 AM

My car is a 4-speed I took an over-drive out and replaced it with a 4-sp d allot more fun now.
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/29/14 12:49 AM

I agree hemirdrnnr, Looking forward to really banging gears.

Shiny block came back mag checked good in stock bore. Both frame ties are cut to fit and tacked into place. Next will be the rest of the stiffening pack followed by the leaf relocation and mini tub.

Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/01/14 02:28 AM

Any more progress on the Belvedere.
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/01/14 04:24 AM

Quote:

Any more progress on the Belvedere.



One frame tie is done. Hope to get the other side done and box stiffeners done this weekend. Works getting in the way of my fun!
Posted By: Copper Dart

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/01/14 01:14 PM

Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/04/14 09:30 PM

Don't you guys hybernate in the winter?
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/06/14 06:13 AM

This is how we hybernate (if the shop's heated). I usually don't do much out there in the warm months. Hope to be driving my car to shows

Didn't get as far as I'd hoped over the weekend. We got the cab on my buddies truck and the torque boxes cut to fit and those areas sandblasted. The boxes are about 1/2" from the floor so I need to weld on some extensions before installation. Also completed the frame ties.
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/06/14 04:05 PM

Looks like you are making good progress, you will love the way it feels when you are done!
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/14/14 05:31 PM

Has the cold weather given you opportunity to do anymore work?
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/14/14 06:47 PM

Quote:

Has the cold weather given you opportunity to do anymore work?



My parents have been in town this week so I didn't get too far. I did learn that no matter what you read on some forums Rustoleum cold galv is NOT a good weld thru primer! I also learned to wear both gloves and full leather sleeves when laying on my back under the car. After grinding off the Rustoleum I was able to finish the torque boxes. The front end gets taken apart this weekend to start on the front end stiffening with the core support.

I'm sorry if these pictures are too big. I don't know how to shrink them down from photobucket to here.




Posted By: booger

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/14/14 08:09 PM

Quote:

I did learn that no matter what you read on some forums Rustoleum cold galv is NOT a good weld thru primer!



Galvanized means zinc, and I've always heard not to weld on galvanized metal without grinding it off because the fumes can cause the shakes?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_fume_fever

Anyway, nice looking car
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/14/14 09:52 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I did learn that no matter what you read on some forums Rustoleum cold galv is NOT a good weld thru primer!



Galvanized means zinc, and I've always heard not to weld on galvanized metal without grinding it off because the fumes can cause the shakes?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_fume_fever

Anyway, nice looking car



Haha.. trust me. As the owner of a fence co. that welds chain link gates I know about what galv. can be like and should have known better. Welding that cold galv stuff is WAAY worse than welding galv pipe. I think my buddy thought I was break dancing rather than shaking trying to get out from under the car with gooey slag rolling around inside my sweatshirt. I never got a chance to sniff it. Scarred for life? Sure, but I learned a valuable lesson
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/14/14 10:41 PM

I hope you weren't to badly injured, I am putting a lift in so I don't have to brake dance on the concrete.The car looks good!
Posted By: clemul

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/15/14 09:00 PM

Nice project, just did floors in mine. I used the rubberseal etch weld 512 weld through primer, it is great stuff. Welds like it not there, I wouldn't use any other.

http://www.medallionrefinish.com/Editor/assets/tds/rs-512_tech.pdf
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/15/14 10:48 PM

Quote:

Nice project, just did floors in mine. I used the rubberseal etch weld 512 weld through primer, it is great stuff. Welds like it not there, I wouldn't use any other.

http://www.medallionrefinish.com/Editor/assets/tds/rs-512_tech.pdf



Thanks! I'll try and find it locally.
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/28/14 01:28 AM

Any progress on the Belvedere?
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/28/14 02:32 AM

Slow and steady. Got the core support stiffener in this week. Next is the inner fender stiffeners, but the fit is a bit off. Hope to get to it Sunday if I don't have to work. Next will be mini tub and spring relocation.
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/29/14 11:50 AM

Looks like slow and steady is working well, when you say fitment problems is it the car or the parts you are having problems with? Has the car been hit?
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/29/14 05:00 PM

If you haven't welded the torque boxes in yet you might want to add the torque box reinforcement plates first (I carry them). They beef up the bulk head that the leaf spring bolts pass through so that torque won't twist them up. Factory Hemi cars came with them.

Attached picture 8345352-20141106_114931_zpsudopz67a.jpg
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/29/14 05:02 PM

Here's what they look like

Attached picture 8345355-B-Hemi-Plates-Snubber-Button-21.jpg
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/30/14 04:39 PM

Quote:

Looks like slow and steady is working well, when you say fitment problems is it the car or the parts you are having problems with? Has the car been hit?



Nothing serious, and I'm sure it's impossible to make products like this that will fit every car. I can't find any signs of being hit and everything is measuring square. If you look at the last picture I posted of the core support stiffener I cut the welds on the outer lower lips to clear the outside of the core support then clamped it all back up. The fender braces (starting on them today) look like they'll need the most cutting and bending. The shock tower braces are about 1/2" away from the slots in the stiffener. Again, these are made to fit 66-70 B bodies and I doubt they're all truly the same.

Thanks Scott, Everything else is welded in place and hopefully good to go I can see how those would have been useful!
Posted By: Bill_T

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/01/14 12:31 AM

Could you post another pic or two of that support stiffener from a different angle(s)? Did you remove the factory, or?
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/01/14 12:41 AM

I'll try to take more pictures. Is there something in particular you're trying to see?
check out the pictures section at US car tool.

Posted By: Bill_T

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/01/14 12:55 AM

US Tool pics answered my question. There is actually a dead link there, but a search found the pics. Thanks.
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/01/14 04:13 AM



Finished the stiffening kit today. Mini tub or leaf relocation next?
Posted By: clemul

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/01/14 04:48 AM

Quote:

Here's what they look like



I ordered these from Harms Auto for my 67 Belvedere... Perfect fit, top quality and a gentleman to deal with...highly recommended.

http://harmsauto.com/hemi-snubber-plates/
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/17/14 03:59 PM

Have you been able to work on the car any?
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/17/14 04:13 PM

I haven't this week. My air compressor locked up. Just found a used one on craigslist and hope to be back up and running soon.

Anything happening in your shop?
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/19/14 02:36 PM

Just got my new building finished and trying to get the house done. Man if I had the money I owed I would be a rich man LOL.I am going to try to move my cars and tools over the holidays.
Posted By: Youngblood

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/27/14 10:43 PM

I am really jonesin for some updates on this one. About * years ago my 67 needed a ball joint. My oldest son wanted to help. We decide to pull the k-frame and add some other stuff I had on the shelf. It's been sitting since. All I have time for (and money) is customer cars. Never should have taken it apart. Your car is inspiring me to get back. Thanks for sharing!
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/31/14 04:33 AM

Get back on it and we can get them done together! Air compressor is back up and running but I haven't done much more than head scratching since. I'm planning on the mini tub first but want to be sure I can still use the stock tank using the USTool relocation kit. Haven't got a reply from them on it. Started a thread here asking if anyone knew and couldn't get a response from someone that's used the US Tool version.
Posted By: Jamey

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/31/14 06:17 AM

What size exhaust are you going to use? I think if you mini tub it, you won't get the exhaust through there. I ran 3" on my belvedere and it barely fit with everything in the stock location.
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/31/14 01:43 PM

I'm not sure what size yet, but had planned on the exhaust not fitting out the back.
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 01/12/15 01:37 AM

I ran my exhaust just to the front of the axle and turned it where it will bounce off the ground. I bought an under dash harness from Y.O. and believe it or not it was in stock. Any of you had any experience putting one in with the dash in?
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 01/22/15 03:41 PM

Scott do you sell the front inner fender braces?
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 02/02/15 11:38 PM

Any more progress on the Belvedere? Just starting to move into my new shop hope to get back on mine soon.
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 02/20/15 11:02 PM

I just ordered a set of the inner fender braces for my 67.
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 03/11/15 10:00 PM

Got my fender braces in from Scott, just have to find time to put them in. Have you done anymore to your car?
Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 04/03/15 09:30 PM

Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 09/21/15 02:50 AM

Well, it's been awhile! Forced to stay busy elsewhere but have a short hiatus and I'm going to try and get the car back on the ground at least. Started the relocation kit earlier this week and got it finished up this afternoon. Fairly easy to install kit. A friend left his plasma cutter here and I need one! Makes those hard to reach cuts a breeze. Next up is the mini tub, and plan on making a dent in that this week.





Once happy with the location and width of the rear mounts they were tacked to the right width on the tubing then removed from the frame to be welded completely. (It's hard to reach above them when installed)

Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 09/21/15 02:56 AM

After the tubing is welded it slides snugly into place. Final check alignment then make it permanent. Expecting to use Calvert springs with Caltracs. Wanting the old super stock stance and vibe.


Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 09/28/15 06:51 PM

Started on the mini tub this weekend. Decided to come inboard to the frame rail. I had done this once before and had to cut the tub to fit the trunk hinge (on a different car). This hinge only hits on the very end where the spring presses to open. It was suggested to go to a pneumatic hinge and cut the tail off rather than fabricate the pocket, so thats the plan.

Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 09/28/15 07:12 PM

While the inner tub was out I drilled a hole through the ridge inside the outer tub to see how much room could be gained by pushing that ridge in. We gained 3/4" along that ridge point with a few hammer hits. There's plenty of room between the quarter and the tub along that line, but not much if you go lower than that line.



Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/06/15 11:47 PM

Left side getting close. Ordered wheels and tires today. Springs tomorrow, and the Dana when they all get here.

Posted By: hemirdrnnr

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/22/15 01:54 AM

Looks good I am going to tear mine apart for winter maintenance and will try to get some pictures to post. Everything looks tight on your car good work.
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/27/15 03:03 AM

Originally Posted By hemirdrnnr
Looks good I am going to tear mine apart for winter maintenance and will try to get some pictures to post. Everything looks tight on your car good work.


Thanks! Trying to get as much done as possible before the Holidays take over. I'd love to see yours.

The tubs are done except some cleanup and I suppose I should include the deck lid hinges since they will need to be changed.



Ordered the 4:10 Dana from Doctor Diff and have a 3 week wait. Caltrac mono leafs arrived today. I'm tempted to have the steel wheels powder coated in satin clear with the raw steel. Fish scales arrive Wednesday to measure the weight of push needed on the deck lid for gas struts.
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 10/27/15 03:11 AM



Could probably fit 2 more inches of tire inboard comfortably. These are 315-60/15s
Posted By: Youngblood

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/07/15 06:38 PM

MORE. PLEASE
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/09/15 03:52 AM

The last car I mini tubbed I recessed and boxed off a section of the wheel house to clear the deck lid hinge. This one was close but would have needed to get the same treatment. A friend of mine suggested if we cut off the pocket on the back of the hinge for the spring it would clear the wheel house and we could put a gas spring on as a replacement. We thought it could be mounted and hidden above the wheel house. I picked up a couple of 110 lb. fish scales on Amazon for $7 and hooked some small chains to the side of the hinge to pull on and figure what force was needed to lift the lid. The scales maxed out and it was obvious there wasn't enough arm to push from that point. After some head scratching we decided this would be the cleanest route to take. With 2 80 lb springs the lid will stay up on it's own, but I'm going to order 2 more similar units with 100 lb so the lid will lift on it's own and stay up in a breeze. It's not as cool as fat tires, but kind of fun to make it work with crap laying around the shop. The springs are $25 for the pair.





Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/09/15 03:56 AM

No need to critique the crappy welds. Still have grinding to do. Today we decided to start a fabrication company and hire James Earl Jones to say, "At Lewis Fabrication we strive for good enough".




Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/27/15 07:08 AM

Got my big pallet from Dr. Diff with the Dana, Disc Brakes, and emergency cable. The mini tub is officially complete until the car is disassembled someday and put on the rotisserie. Not going to bother smoothing things out til then. Planning to pull the Strange cover off and sandblast it prior to clear or aluminum powder coat.







Next up is getting the leafs mounted and perches temporarily tacked in. Rear shock upper mounts, then going through the front suspension. The Trick Flow Heads arrived this week also, so I've been visiting several local engine builders looking for guidance.
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/29/15 07:14 PM



Been awhile since it was on the ground.
Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/30/15 07:55 PM

You keeping it a GTX or going to change it back?
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/30/15 08:26 PM

Originally Posted By GTX MATT
You keeping it a GTX or going to change it back?


Hey Matt, As of right now I'm keeping some of it GTX. Planning on the GTX gas cap. I don't have the deck lid badge but only have the GTX fender and interior badges and none of the Belvedere badges. I've already found a flat hood to cut up for a Super Stock scoop so the GTX hood will go up for sale. The car came with a complete Legendary GTX interior still NIB.

Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: 67 Belvedere - 11/30/15 10:34 PM

Nice score on the interior. My car is a Satellite, haven't decided what I wanted to do with it. My last car was a '67 X though, originally EE-1 which is the color your car looks like, with blue interior. It was actually missing all of the GTX specific stuff, and the fender tag. Is your tag for an EE-1 car? Anyway, seeing yours makes me want to GTX mine up and paint it EE-1. Ironically I've got the gas cap, and the trunk emblem!
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/01/15 03:50 AM

Originally Posted By GTX MATT
Nice score on the interior. My car is a Satellite, haven't decided what I wanted to do with it. My last car was a '67 X though, originally EE-1 which is the color your car looks like, with blue interior. It was actually missing all of the GTX specific stuff, and the fender tag. Is your tag for an EE-1 car? Anyway, seeing yours makes me want to GTX mine up and paint it EE-1. Ironically I've got the gas cap, and the trunk emblem!


I'm not sure if it's EE-1. Breaking down the fender tag it's shown as Bright Blue Metallic. Definitely not the one that goes with my VIN. I honestly think someone stripped down a junk X but got some great parts. Not planning on using the A/C dash and duct work either that appears on this fender tag.

Posted By: GTX MATT

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/01/15 06:29 AM

Yeah wouldn't have been my car then, since mine didn't have AC but had to ask. I like the paint on your car more than the EE1. Peg leg 3.23 and black stripes too.
Posted By: booger

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/02/15 12:13 AM

Originally Posted By DLewis
While the inner tub was out I drilled a hole through the ridge inside the outer tub to see how much room could be gained by pushing that ridge in. We gained 3/4" along that ridge point with a few hammer hits. There's plenty of room between the quarter and the tub along that line, but not much if you go lower than that line.


Did you do anything else toward expanding that outer tub? FWIW I took a left side outer and a right side inner and compared them and it sure looks like the inner could be used to get rid of that hump if a person was so inclined. Not sure if it could be done working from the inside with the quarter on though.
Posted By: DLewis

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/02/15 04:22 AM

Originally Posted By booger
Originally Posted By DLewis
While the inner tub was out I drilled a hole through the ridge inside the outer tub to see how much room could be gained by pushing that ridge in. We gained 3/4" along that ridge point with a few hammer hits. There's plenty of room between the quarter and the tub along that line, but not much if you go lower than that line.


Did you do anything else toward expanding that outer tub? FWIW I took a left side outer and a right side inner and compared them and it sure looks like the inner could be used to get rid of that hump if a person was so inclined. Not sure if it could be done working from the inside with the quarter on though.


I didn't do anything besides swing a big hammer. I've also heard you can swap housings but not sure how much more there is to gain. Definitely easier without the quarter.
Posted By: booger

Re: 67 Belvedere - 12/02/15 08:29 PM

I think it's less that you gain space and more that the car doesn't have to sit up high to get big tires to fit. My quarter is off and I'm redoing the mini-tub from scratch so I'm giving it serious consideration.
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