1939 Dodge 4 dr

Hello, everyone. My name is Adam and this is my first post. I just got a 39 dodge 4dr that is in good shape. I would like to turn it into a rat rod, without cutting it up. I have a few questions about different topics. Does anyone make fiberglass rear fenders? Can I replace the frame with a newer year? I would love to keep this a low budget build nothing extreme, just safe. Any help or information would be great. Thanks in advance.

Hi Adam. and welcome....

the term Rat rod can be interpreted many different ways/
when i hear that term I think of a car that was put together with parts you have laying around or budget built.
but most Rat rods are crudely built and look unsafe to drive.

by your question I would think that you are looking at building a full fendered "streetrod" that you want to run in primer or unfinished till a later date

not trying to get picky but rat rod means different things to different people. I think yours would still be a street rod, just my opinion




anyways here is a place that lists fenders for a 39 dodge
http://www.rrfiberglass.net/dodge_plymouth.htm


a dodge dakota chassis could be made to fit but you "WILL" have to modify the floor quite a bit but the ride would be worth it.


a mustang II frontend is also a good choice for that car and a 8 3/4 rear from a "B" body fits great too.

I would go that way if your frame is in good condition
it takes a little work but you can trim and fit a stock must II cross member and save the $$$$ on the cross member,

but an after market cross member is the faster way to go, just put it on and weld it up, where with the stock mustang cross member you will have some time invested in trimming it down to fit.

I am sure Gene will give you some good info Too. Ron....



does it look something like this???

You are right it does mean something different to everyone. The pic looks the same as mine, that one just looks better. Where can I get the headlight trim? Thanks for the link for the fenders I will be ordering them soon.

I agree, "rat rod" means to me something put together to look junky and most likely is junky. The term comes from a misconception of what the original '40s to '50s rodders' cars looked like. Most of them were neatly done. It was the rare exception to have a rod built out of mismatched parts with rusty tractor sheetmetal on the nose. If they couldn't afford paint they used primer. Now for engines they WERE all over the map, mostly whatever V8 was in the wrecking yard, but Cad and Olds OHV V8s were in demand.

Ron is 100% where I'd be on the car, a nice driveable streetrod with a decent smallblock, MII front end, 8 3/4 rear, and some creature comforts inside. It isn't fun to drive if no one will go with you!

Good Luck,
R.

hi adam ! welcome to the board ! don't be afraid to ask questions here ! if we can help, it will be a pleasure. ron & gene have a ton of experiance and know what a good driving rod is all about. rat rod is a term that means different things to different people. some, however, are really unsafe - even for a fairground cruiser. there are many ways to build a rod within a budget and in the process, you will undoughtably learn many new skills. but above all, use practical build techniques and you will be happy with the results, as it will be fun and safe to drive.

Welcome Adam!
I've posted this before, but it's been a while.
It's about a later year, but should get your head going on the build.

http://www.nicksgarage.com/jh/rodarticle/

Hi Adam,
We clipped a 39 Plymouth with a Dakota frame. The two frames are the same width right at the firewall. The 39 frame gets wider as it nears the center of the car (about the post the rear doors hang on is the widest point) while the Dakota frame is straight after it turns out after the front tires. We trimmed out 39 frame so the Dakota slipped right inside it. We never finished the car, it belonged to my son and his interest changed. Sure looked like it was going to be a nice setup. Someone on here bought the 39, but I don't know if it has been finished yet.

Also, if your front suspension is still complete, consider doing a disc brake conversion and mounting a rack & pinoin steering and upper shock relocation to your existing frame. The 39 suspension was a good design, except for the shock setup. My son's 39 was missing many parts. At the same time, I had a 39 Plymouth business coupe. My coupe retained the original suspension and I installed a disc brake conversion and also added a power rack & pinoin steering. My shocks were still in the original location (they were new when I bought the car) The car drove great but had that "soft" ride most old cars had, I think becuse of the shock location. Relocating the shocks was on the top of the list of things to do, but ended up selling the car.

I have some pictures of the frame swap around here someplace. Of the options available, the Dakota swap is probably the cheapest way to go until you figuire in rebuilding the front suspension, then all options come out about the same money.

Really, it comes down to your ability and equipment available to you. If I were doing it again, I would probably go the Dakota route, but then, I run a welding shop.

Check www.rustyhope.com for a disc brake conversion. Gene

Thank you for the web site, my dad was telling me it could be done also but he couldn't remember the site. All the front suspension is there so I will be looking into the idea you gave me. Where can i get the parts?
Thanks again for all the help and insight.

Also look at www.fatmanfab.com
R.

If you are interested Adam I can get you photos of Gene's work on the 39 his son formerly owned. I haven't had a chance to get anything done to the frame because I am still working on another project at this time. pm me an email address if you are interested and I can send you some photos.

Adam, the "kit" from rustyhope has the brackets, spacers, bolts, directions, and a list of parts with numbers required to convert to disc brakes. Then you pick up the parts (rotors, bearings, hoses, seals & calipers) at your favorite local parts house. The worst part of the hole deal is when you have to drill & tap 2 holes per side to 5/8 fine thread. I think you can send him your spindles and he will drill & tap for a fee.

I also installed a rack & pinoin steering on my 39 Plymouth. I used a rack from a Chevy Calivere. Worked out pretty slick. Gene

Welcome to the site, I'm from Kenosha too.  I have a 49 dodge, was going to go the Plydo route with the dropped spindles, disk brake conversion, and fatman r&p, bought added up the cost and knew I couldn't swing it.  I got the whole front frame of a 88 dakota for $38 at the pick-n-pull on half price Weds.  It was my 1st time doing a subframe but it was pretty easy.  Check out the P15 D24 website, I got my help from a guy named Tim Adams there.  

Bigmel, where are the pictures???

Can I still get the pictures that you have of the frame swap?

What steering box did you use? What other mods did you have to do? Can you send me a pic of that?

Adam

Heres a pic

Hi Adam,

I just came acroos your post from last September and wondered how you were doing on your project? I'm building a '39 Dodge D-11 rod too, using the original frame, a Heidt SuperRide II front end and a Ford 9" in back ( a lot cheaper to build than an 8 3/4" Mopar). Power is from a 2006 5.7 Hemi through a 545RFE tranny. Chassis is fully boxed including the X member, and we've added some new material to the back to make things a little more rigid. I'll try to post a couple pictures (never posted a pic) so you can see what we're doing.

Let me know how you're doing on yours.

Regards,

Bob

That frame looks great, but unless your changing the floor pan, whatever is laying on top of the center X frame will be squished by the floor pan. Gene

That's the E-brake cables, and yes, we are tweaking the floors as we're going to have to move the firewall back to accomodate the Hemi.

We're replacing the front floor/toe board as part of that process, and building a new tunnel to accomodate the tranny/Lokar shifter and E-brake cables.

I'll post more pictures as we get further along.

hey all im new here too i myself have a problem with collecting mopars and never can seem to start workign on them.. anyways i just picked up a 39 plymouth myself... that im actually gonna start on asap the 48 club coupe and the 48 business coupe gonna have to wait... ive been reading and contemplating several diff things with mine i think im gonna use fatman fab dropped uprights with a disc brake conversion and air bags in the front and c notch the rear and use a 9" and disc bags in the rear... i plan to power it with either a 331 hemi or a 440 w a 727 behind it.. i see other guys here are in washington id love th chat more with you guys.. thanks in advance for the help and anybody have any questions id love to assist in helping you too..

rob in tacoma

2005 Dodge Neon
1998 Dodge Ram
1948 Dodge Club Coupe
1948 Dodge Bus coupe
1939 Plymouth 4 Door

Hello, I am still relatively new to the forum and have been searching tirelessly for information for my 39 dodge. I stumbled across this thread because I am looking to update my frame so I can update my brakes. I know it has been several years since this thread originated, however; the link was a plethora of information. Do you have any knowledge of what this book/magazine is? I did a search in google and cane up empty handed. Thank you in advance.

what exactly are you looking for ?
and welcome to the board !

If you are talking about the link RodStRace posted the article says it's courtesy of Street Rod Action magazine, no longer around.

I know at one time I had the magazine in my collection, but the last time I remember seeing that it was last millennia, probably when it was the current issue.

I may even still have it but the article linked is the extent of what was in the magazine.

If you are looking for the V8 swap kit talked about in the article, well it's not really available any more. I don't think Mr. Street Rod is in business anymore. Nor is PlyDo which was the hot rod place for older Mopars.

Butch's lists a kit though

https://butchscoolstuff.com/eng-trans-mounting-kits-4/

Rachel4291, welcome to the board.
There really has not been much stuff that has changed in all the years since the original post, except maybe some of the original suppliers have closed up shop, and most of the few pictures that were here are long gone. At the same time, a few new suppliers have stepped up, but for the most part, Street rod Mopars haven't changed much.

The story is still the same. Before we can give you any worthwhile advice, we really need to know a little about your abilities, about the condition of your car, and most important what you expect the car to be able to do when you get doe with it. Having an idea what your build budget looks like is also helpful.
Please understand, there is a world of difference between building a really nice highway driver and a 1/4 mile terror, trying to do both becomes a build with a long list of compromises and often results with an unhappy builder.
Budget is a huge concern. These toys are not a cheap undertaking. The hard cold reality is that unless you have a big pile of parts laying around and have a ton of building skills, tools and equipment, its nearly impossible to get one of these old rides on the street safely for less the $5,000, and then it won't look pretty. Expecting to be able to build one for less often results in another unfinished project. I'm not going to sat it can't be done, but the odds are not with you.

So lets lay down a few basics. Your 39 Dodge started life with a boxed frame a semi modern independent front suspension. This suspension was used with very minor changes up through the early 50s. The original brake system was ahead of its time and were among the best available, in 1939. As good as both the suspension and the brake were, they are painfully inadequate for modern times, unless you live in an extreme rural location where sudden stops are never required. Both can be upgraded to acceptable standards unless you intend to daily drive in heavy city traffic. The original flathead 6 or flathead 8 actually moved the car fairly well, but were not high performance. Don't even think about adding more power without upgrading both the front and rear brakes.
The original cars came with really big steering wheels. If the greasing of the front suspension was kept up with, they really did not drive bad without power steering. One worthwhile note here, the original steering column is part of the steering box, that shaft that holds the steering wheel is a 4' long 1" diameter steel shaft inside a 4' long 3" diameter tube that will not collapse in a crash, it can go right through you. You can cut both shafts and add a modern top 1/2 of a collapsible column with modern turn signals for a huge improvement in safety. Adding power steering is a pain with these cars. The Cavalier rack and pinion with (or without) power steering can work, but it requires effort to make work.If power steering is a must, upgrading the entire front suspension with a modern clip, or a Mustang II front suspension is a better move.

I've only built about a dozen 39-48 Plymouth/Dodge cars in the last 20 years. I've discovered several places where parts can be had, and some stuff (like sheet metal) is very hard to find. If your looking for parts, we need to know specifically what parts you are looking for. If your changing all the suspension and brakes, telling you where you can get those parts is wasting both our, and your time. It is amazing how many mechanical parts are still available, but if your looking for floor pans, you need to learn how to form sheet metal. Gene

to add to what gene said about one's building, fabricating, and engineering skills, plus one's tool and equipment collection, i will offer this.
it MAY be a better idea to purchase a "built" car than to attempt to build one yourself, especially if a person is lacking in several of the above skills, and only owns a basic socket set.
however, when purchasing a "built" car, make SURE it is of QUALITY ! if you are not positive you can see this [other than the excitement of the find] take someone along you can trust that knows these kind of vehicles inside and out, and will be up front with you, even if it turns out to be a "pig in lipstick", and strongly advises you AGAINST the purchase.

the reason i suggest this, in today's world, there are bargains galore out there with sellers needing cash for the next build or personal reasons. these built cars are almost ALWAYS pennies on the dollar spent, plus you will be WAY ahead on the build time, which can often be years and years, which can discourage even the most skilled among us.

i'm not in any way suggesting anyone lacks talent, the desire, or resolve to build a car, just offering up a way that could be a SIGNIFICANT way to save a ton of time and money.