Drag Pak Engines

Posted By: wldtm

Drag Pak Engines - 03/08/11 01:16 AM

For those of you in the know... need some engine particulars

what heads are on a 5.7 drag pak engine?

Are they new eagle heads or a 6.1 head, or what?

What pistons are used in a stock drag pack? Diamond? JE?

Do they come with a solid or hydraulic roller? If solid what rocker gear?

Would a 96 dakota with a 5.7 hemi be able to fit in SS/TA or GT class?

thanks in advance...Justin

Posted By: Adrielp

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/08/11 02:32 AM

Quote:

For those of you in the know... need some engine particulars

what heads are on a 5.7 drag pak engine?

Are they new eagle heads or a 6.1 head, or what?

What pistons are used in a stock drag pack? Diamond? JE?

Do they come with a solid or hydraulic roller? If solid what rocker gear?

Would a 96 dakota with a 5.7 hemi be able to fit in SS/TA or GT class?

thanks in advance...Justin

I don't much about the specifics of the engine but I can tell you that these engines are legal for the TA and GT truck classes. With the minimum weight in TA I would think this engine would be better suited for TB which is a SB only designation if my memory serves me right. The downside to TA and TB is that they are carb only classes. TA mandates an 850cfm carb and TB mandates a 750cfm carb and both classes have an 8.5lbs per cube weight factor. I forget what the minimum weights are but other than the carbs, you can pretty much run whatever else you want. No rotating assembly restraints or head restraints but you will have to kick some rpms and make some good power in these classes to run well as the current standard for both of those is 9.00 and faster for the most part(at least 9.20's). In the GT truck classes you would run the engine according to stock specs within NHRA guidelines except that you aren't limited in vavletrain or intake manifold. You will however have certain restrictions to maintain. C.R., a certain port volume, stock sized valves, standard efi system, spec rods, and spec pistons, all of which have to mach certain specs and weight. It sounds more technical than it is but those are just some of things you have to face in putting together the engine. On the bright side of things though, the GT HP ratings for the 5.7 and 6.1 are untouched and both ratings are softer than a brownie, especially the 5.7. 305 HP rating would put you on the minimum weight for most of the class designations. You could probably run GT/TC or TD and still run on the minimum weight. Its definitely got some potential and wish you nothing but blessing going forward. I personally hope you decide to run TA as I would like to see what these engine could do when transformed into a high winding rpm all out modified style engine.

NHRA Accepted product list:
http://www.nhra.com/userfiles/file/NHRAAcceptedProducts.pdf

NHRA 09 and 10 Blueprint Specs:
http://www.nhra.net/tech_specs/engine/blueprints/CHRY-09.rtf

http://www.nhra.net/tech_specs/engine/blueprints/CHRY-10.rtf

Current GT factors:
305 for the 5.7
385 for the 6.1
275 for the 360

Posted By: wldtm

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/08/11 03:20 AM

Thanks for an informative post. I think I like the idea of the GT class for now. I personally like the 5.7 for the hp factor.

So lets say the 5.7 gets factored because of a drag pack car blows away the index (as we have seen in the past). This will then raise the factor for my engine in GT too? Correct?

thanks again for the input...justin

Posted By: Stewart

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/08/11 04:08 AM

I am going to build a 5.7 for GT and can offer the following. I have been told by NHRA that if an engine has fresh air (scoop) in its normal class then it has to be used in a fresh air car in GT. The opposite is also true, a non fresh air car can't be used in a fresh air car. So the Drag Pak engines in GT has to be in a scooped car such as a 68 hemi Cuda or Dart. Since the rule book says that the GT truck class has the same rules as the GT car rules with the exceptions listed in the GT truck section it would look like the Drag Pak is not legal in a truck. Don't know of any truck with fresh air. I'm using a 68 AH type Cuda.
As for the 5.7 and 6.1 engine, the 2009 engines both came with the 6.1 SRT8 heads with slightly larger valves, casting#5037369AA. 2.10 and 1.60 valves. The pistons are 12.7-1 Diamond #46191. Has a hyd roller with .584 and .552 lift. Non adjustable rockers.
I haven't started my engine yet. Have had some shocks on parts. Jesel drop in roller lifters for $3200 and rockers for $4800. Harland Sharp does have a set of rockers for $1800 that are adjustable. Think the rods are Scat with ARP bolts. Manley and K1 make approved rods.
As for the HP factors, the SS and GT factors are seperate so it would take a GT car to hit the GT factor, not a SS car.
Good luck with whatever direction you go.

Posted By: Adrielp

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/08/11 04:12 AM

Quote:

Thanks for an informative post. I think I like the idea of the GT class for now. I personally like the 5.7 for the hp factor.

So lets say the 5.7 gets factored because of a drag pack car blows away the index (as we have seen in the past). This will then raise the factor for my engine in GT too? Correct?

thanks again for the input...justin

Actually you don't. If you look at the classification guide you will see that the GT factors are separate from the other SS categories so until you or someone with your combo in GT bust up the index, you don't have to worry. I think the 360 has been hit a couple times as Mark Nowicki in the Northeast upgraded his 360 to the dragpak version and has been loving it. The stock cars are the only ones having factoring trouble right now any way. No Super Stock DragPaks have been to the track yet. MR2Performance built a couple of Super Stock versions and one of those cars is teamed with Rock Haas and they have been doing to some engine development but it has yet to hit the track. I think their searching for more ways to make power.

Posted By: Locomotion

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/08/11 05:06 AM

Quote:

I am going to build a 5.7 for GT and can offer the following. I have been told by NHRA that if an engine has fresh air (scoop) in its normal class then it has to be used in a fresh air car in GT. The opposite is also true, a non fresh air car can't be used in a fresh air car. So the Drag Pak engines in GT has to be in a scooped car such as a 68 hemi Cuda or Dart. Since the rule book says that the GT truck class has the same rules as the GT car rules with the exceptions listed in the GT truck section it would look like the Drag Pak is not legal in a truck. Don't know of any truck with fresh air. I'm using a 68 AH type Cuda.

Do some more research. Neither Mark Nowicki and his Avenger nor the '70 Duster that is run out of the Teuton stable have fresh air scoops. They both have the 5.9 Magnum Drag Pak engines in SS/GT. I know of other non-air combos being built also.

Posted By: mr2performance

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/08/11 12:35 PM

Mike Wagner has a 6.1 MPR built challenger superstocker. I'm building a 5.7 DRAG PAK challenger superstocker right now as well as dropping a 5.7 Superstock dragpak engine in a SS/AH Cuda. Mike

Posted By: slantzilla

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/08/11 11:43 PM

Steve Couch debuted his 5.9 Drag Pak last year in SS/JA, but I think he is really going to run it as a Stocker.

Posted By: SC304

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:01 AM

Quote:

Mike Wagner has a 6.1 MPR built challenger superstocker. I'm building a 5.7 DRAG PAK challenger superstocker right now as well as dropping a 5.7 Superstock dragpak engine in a SS/AH Cuda. Mike

Mike wagners 6.1 is ready for dyno this week

Here are some progress photos.

Stock Drag Pak head versus preparing for Jesel rockers and lifters

Attached picture 6519291-asdelivered.jpg

Attached picture 6519291-asdelivered.jpg

Posted By: SC304

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:02 AM

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Mike Wagner has a 6.1 MPR built challenger superstocker. I'm building a 5.7 DRAG PAK challenger superstocker right now as well as dropping a 5.7 Superstock dragpak engine in a SS/AH Cuda. Mike

Mike wagners 6.1 is ready for dyno this week

Here are some progress photos.

Stock Drag Pak head versus preparing for Jesel rockers and lifters

next phase is clearing head for jesel rocker base plate

Attached picture 6519296-Machinedheadforjesel.jpg

Posted By: SC304

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:05 AM

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Mike Wagner has a 6.1 MPR built challenger superstocker. I'm building a 5.7 DRAG PAK challenger superstocker right now as well as dropping a 5.7 Superstock dragpak engine in a SS/AH Cuda. Mike

Mike wagners 6.1 is ready for dyno this week

Here are some progress photos.

Stock Drag Pak head versus preparing for Jesel rockers and lifters

next phase is clearing head for jesel rocker base plate

Jesel rockers installed with Trend double taper 7/16 push rods.

Attached picture 6519306-JeselRockers.jpg

Posted By: SC304

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:06 AM

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Mike Wagner has a 6.1 MPR built challenger superstocker. I'm building a 5.7 DRAG PAK challenger superstocker right now as well as dropping a 5.7 Superstock dragpak engine in a SS/AH Cuda. Mike

Mike wagners 6.1 is ready for dyno this week

Here are some progress photos.

Stock Drag Pak head versus preparing for Jesel rockers and lifters

next phase is clearing head for jesel rocker base plate

Jesel rockers installed with Trend double taper 7/16 push rods.

Assembled motor

Attached picture 6519308-engineassembled.jpg

Posted By: SC304

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:11 AM

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Mike Wagner has a 6.1 MPR built challenger superstocker. I'm building a 5.7 DRAG PAK challenger superstocker right now as well as dropping a 5.7 Superstock dragpak engine in a SS/AH Cuda. Mike

Mike wagners 6.1 is ready for dyno this week

Here are some progress photos.

Stock Drag Pak head versus preparing for Jesel rockers and lifters

next phase is clearing head for jesel rocker base plate

Jesel rockers installed with Trend double taper 7/16 push rods.

Assembled motor

Assembled motor with Billet Moroso Valve covers

Attached picture 6519324-Assembeldwithvlavecovers.jpg

Posted By: 340RICK

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:17 AM

WOW..... Mike that is a really a sweet piece.

Posted By: SC304

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:24 AM

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Mike Wagner has a 6.1 MPR built challenger superstocker. I'm building a 5.7 DRAG PAK challenger superstocker right now as well as dropping a 5.7 Superstock dragpak engine in a SS/AH Cuda. Mike

Mike wagners 6.1 is ready for dyno this week

Here are some progress photos.

Stock Drag Pak head versus preparing for Jesel rockers and lifters

next phase is clearing head for jesel rocker base plate

Jesel rockers installed with Trend double taper 7/16 push rods.

Assembled motor

Assembled motor with Billet Moroso Valve covers

Next we need to build 5.7 and 6.4 just in case. LOL
Gonna change a few things after lessons learned building 6.1.

This project has been a long time coming and would not have been possible without my partners Dave,Kyle and Rock. Their dedication to this engine program and this entire Super Stock Challenger Project while I am on the road working is unsurpassed.
" In Case Your Wondering"

They know what it means.

Thanks Guys

Posted By: sixpackgut

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:40 AM

how does the jessel oil the valvetrain?

is jessel the only one making a solid lifter?

looks very nice and expensive

Posted By: SC304

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:41 AM

Thanks Rick

Posted By: SC304

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:44 AM

Quote:

how does the jessel oil the valvetrain?

is that a solid roller cam motor?

looks very nice and expensive

We oil thru the Push Rods as expected.

Yes to Solid Roller by Comp Cams, Jesel Dog Bone Lifters modified by Kyle to oil properly.

Expensive ? Oh hell yeah, but be quiet my wife might be watching??
Im afraid to add up the cost.

Posted By: STEFF

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 03:59 AM

Nice Bullet!!!!

I assume the Jesel allows you to use longer valves & have more installed height for valve springs?

Posted By: Adrielp

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 04:43 AM

Quote:

Quote:

how does the jessel oil the valvetrain?

is that a solid roller cam motor?

looks very nice and expensive

We oil thru the Push Rods as expected.

Yes to Solid Roller by Comp Cams, Jesel Dog Bone Lifters modified by Kyle to oil properly.

Expensive ? Oh hell yeah, but be quiet my wife might be watching??
Im afraid to add up the cost.

Mr. Mike, I've been waiting to see what this car can do for while and the hard work that you guys have done is very impressive. Look forward to seeing it at the track and hopefully, you guys can make it to Belle Rose(my fingers are crossed lol).

And in regards to the cost, we all know the exact number, we just remain in denial to make ourselves fill better. But at the end of the day its about having fun and learning knew things. You never stop learning lol.

PS: I pray nothing but many blessings over the project going forward.

Posted By: ZIPPY

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/09/11 07:57 PM

Quote:

Nice Bullet!!!!

BLING BLING

Posted By: wldtm

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/10/11 03:39 AM

GT/TB index is 10.85
10.5 X 305HP = 3202 + 170 driver = 3372 at the scales after a run

so it needs to run 9.60-9.80s to be competitive. Currently an A/SA runs 10.0s (some faster) out of most chally stockers with a 6.1

so i think a 5.7 rated at 305hp Superstocker can get it done at 3372.

any takers?

Posted By: Stewart

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/11/11 03:51 PM

I have seen both Mark and Jeffs cars and realize that they are running the drag pak engines. Even talked to Jeff about this at Indy. My info came from Bruce Bachelder, NHRA Tech services, at the Southerns. As I understood it, the rule was put in place because there were some late model LS1 or LT1 firebirds that ran with the same motor and the Formula scooped hood with different HP rating so they ruled that the hood and engines could not be mixed. Looks like they have at least changed to allowing air engines in non air cars in SSGT, maybe both ways by now.
I would still check with NHRA before I built an engine/body combo for SSGT.

Posted By: Blusmbl

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/11/11 07:10 PM

Quote:

This project has been a long time coming and would not have been possible without my partners Dave,Kyle and Rock.

You need to light a fire under Dave's butt so he finishes his Mustang!

Can't wait to see the Challenger completed at the track.

Posted By: dvw

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 03/11/11 10:38 PM

Personally I can't wait to make a pass in it.
Doug

Posted By: wldtm

Re: Drag Pak Engines - 08/19/11 10:40 PM

Bump