Bought some stage 6 heads...w/ BIG PICS

because they were cheap, and are unmachined and unscrewed up by Mopar.There's not alot of info out there on these heads, I did find the recent post here and the mopar muscle article on them. It seems they were nice heads when finished by Chapman,mainly because they didn't cut the spring pockets so deep and they used longer valves. Apparently they are gone now. I wanted to show everyone the pics and I'm also looking for a porter who can bring them up to Chapman specs.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that if "got them cheap" means: "I guy gave them to me along with a bag of money".... then MAYBE you might have done ok. I guess if you had the equipment/knowledge to do it yourself then you'd be ok, but to pay to have those bare castings made into a "Chapman like" head??? I'm thinking you could have bought alot better head for the impending expense you are about to venture into.

BTW Dwayne Porter did my Stage VI's. Slightly larger than stock port and work well for my low 10 desires. They work well and I don't have to twist the engine to run the number. Mech cam and 5600 shift point keeps parts alive for a long time.

Hello,

Those heads are nice when done correctly. You should have a great time with them. Not sure that you can get them to Chapman specs. I thought that a casting change was made for the Chapman CNC heads. Streetwize or Zippy will know if this is correct or not. Have fun!

Damon

I disagree with J. I think you can turn those into a great set of heads. After all, the problems with the spring seats being cut too low into the casting prevented raising the port roof for better flow, valve seats falling out and the guides being wrong size will not be your problem. The only thing I see wrong, is they are already cut for pushrod clearance, too bad they did not leave that alone. The other issue is having to run intake spacers on a RB block.
Good luck and keep the rest of us posted on your progress.

two key issues w the Stage VI casring and the Chapman 'Zeus Foundry" castings. Chapman found the MP casting to be too porous and recast theirs to accompodate a longer 5.40" valve in order to raise the roof/bowl transition and to avoid the valve seat plunge cut. With a raw casting you may consider a longer valve too but I fear the bowl is still very shallow with your heads regardless.

This is the main reason the Chapman flows so much better is because although the port is good the bolw had to bew squeezed way down in order to use the short oem length 4.86" valve...so with the old VI's the 'compromise' is very likely cast-in to the original design.

FWIW, I ran ferrea 11/32" BBC valves (2.25" & 1.81") which are slightly shorter 5.35" than Chapman recommended but the geometry (BTW Chaps use billet block W2 style pedestals as yours are) is dead-on.

what is the casting number? the Chaps have a Zeus logo cast on top of one of the intake ports

The only other Stage VI casting I've ever seen that came w/ the rocker pedestals milled off was the one used by Chapman. But I don't see the "ZEUS" logo on yours where I see it on the picture of the Chapman 260 I have.

Even if those are the same castings, the main problem I see is that only Chapman ever used them... so Chapman's the only person who ever had a CNC program designed for that special casting. Anybody else who works on those is going to be designing the ports from scratch, which sounds REALLY expensive to me.

"Quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten"
Going to be costly to get those heads up to quality.

Talk to Jeff at Modern... he should have a CNC program

I've become a student of foundry marks over time...I have alot to learn yet but am picking info up wherever I can.

The heads in the picture were cast by the PCI foundry, and are some of the most recent Stage VIs. I haven't been able to get a solid year range for when PCI started because the guys at MP who set that up aren't around to ask anymore, though.

I'm not sure whether Chapman ever used PCI or not, but I don't think so...I believe they always used Zeus as posted above.

The most trouble prone Stage 6s are the ones cast by the Winters foundry (snowflake symbol with a "W" inside the snowflake), but not all of them are bad....

It's a shame there were issues, because Winters actually did alot of good work for a long time...They cast aluminum BBC heads for GM....I also have an old Holley St. Dominator with the Winters foundry mark on it also, and there's nothing wrong with it.

Anyway being PCI heads you're pretty well off with them...
personally I would be surprised to find any major casting issues. They should be plenty workable....however as posted above I don't think they can be made into Chapman clones because of differences in the tooling.

I've got 2 sets of stage VI heads, and they have a circle with a W or M in it depending on how you look at it. Are they Winters as well
Thanks for your help.

Yes.

It usually looks like this:
http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=18402
There are minor variations of that mark, but it's roughly the same on most anything. Snowflake with a W inside it.

Also look here for more info. The Winters mark is a big deal to alot of GM guys because they did tons of casting for GM (as well as others), and in general have a great reputation...

DF with a backwards "D" and interlocking "BB" are other common foundry marks

Mine looks nothing like that example. I will take a pic and post it.

I was told it stood for a World casting...



Chris..

On a scale of 1-10 on knowing what the expense is to get a set of heads like that "worked"..... I rate a strong 1. I'm guessing it's going to be quite a bit. Can anyone shed some light on what it would take dollar wise to make those heads ready to bolt on?

My Stage V1's were in much better shape than that, out of the box, and I had more than a set of -1's, both ready to bolt on.

I would guess it will take at least $3,000.00 to get those as good as a 440-1 or even an EZ head.

They aren't worth the $$$$ to get them right..

Don Studley, who did mine, said they were the biggest POS Mopar ever had sold. But he did them for me and he never did another set.. However mine worked well after several tweaks. I could have paid for my B1's for the cash I spent on these things. Studley's work was of an artist though..

They haven't even had rockers for these for years. All aftermarket stuff.


Chris..

Hey Chris, I have a set of Chapman 285's you can look at. Give me a at work

....Louis

That's a Winters foundry mark. There are a few variations of the snowflake, and there is also a nondescript plain circle like yours.

World Products had nothing to do with making Chrysler parts until post 2007.

Thanks for the info Zippy

Quote:

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Mine looks nothing like that example. I will take a pic and post it.

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Yours were born in the same year as mine and I haven't had a bit of trouble, other than countless hours with the die grinder. I've probable picked up ET just from the weight loss. Even with the short valve and stock PR location mine are at 270cc in the intake. I sure would like to raise the roof though. I like the B engine with RB intake and crankshaft combo.