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Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408
Posted By: JC Childress
Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/17/10 04:07 PM
Anyone have any comparisons ? I know the Super Victor doesnt do as well, but I'm talking about the ole Victor 340. This would be on a street 408, with RHS heads , hydraulic cam engine.
Thanks for the replies.
Posted By: FlyFish
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/17/10 06:52 PM
I will have a comparison in ~30 days. I currently run an Airgap, and I’m buying a Victor next week. My next race is July 17th….so, it might be hard to make a good comparison if the air is hot and humid. I’ll post the results when I run it.
I’m not much help now, but here’s a
Posted By: JC Childress
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/17/10 07:41 PM
Whats your current combo , as far as heads, comp ratio and camshaft ?
Thanks for the reply
Posted By: FlyFish
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/17/10 07:57 PM
410, ported eddys, 10.8:1 comp, pump gas, small solid roller (248/254, .576/.582), Air-gap, 750dp, 8” PTC vert, 4.10 gear.
Posted By: Scamp408
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/17/10 08:02 PM
I like the Victor
Posted By: MR_P_BODY
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/17/10 08:07 PM
Quote:
Anyone have any comparisons ? I know the Super Victor doesnt do as well, but I'm talking about the ole Victor 340. This would be on a street 408, with RHS heads , hydraulic cam engine.
Thanks for the replies.
For a street car you would be better with the air gap
cause you would be spending most of the time in lower
rpms
Posted By: Crizila
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/18/10 03:39 AM
Quote:
I like the Victor
Me too. IMO, it will out perform the Air Gap on a 408 in almost every instance. I run a slightly modified 340 with a 1" spacer on a moderate 408 in a very heavy car with no problems.
Posted By: Dragula
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/18/10 11:06 AM
We also had the older Victor on our 416 pump gas bracket motor, also with a .560" cam, and that worked super well with awesome bottom end and really great mid range. The upper end wasn't so good, but we had nearly stock heads on it, and it would fall off in the upper ranges. Based on my experience with the AG on my 360, the AG would be a restriction on the larger motors.
Posted By: AndyF
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/18/10 02:38 PM
I'd run the RPM intake on the street, especially with a hyd cam. If you take both intakes to a chassis dyno session you'll see that the RPM will make more power all the way up to at least 5000 rpm. Keep your eye on the tach as you drive around town and I bet you rarely spin the motor past 5000 rpm.
Posted By: G-Money1320
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/19/10 12:42 AM
I was also wondering if this would be a good move as I now run the air gap. So a couple years ago I asked some Edelbrock reps and they said that the air gap was/is made off the same principle as the victor and that the change would be very minute and wouldnt warrant spending the extra money for the victor. I even told them I could have gotten a new one from a friend for $100 he wasnt using and they still said dont waste the money. Now maybe a nice big stroker with a serious cam and head work might benefit from the victor but who knows without some dyno time.
Posted By: Crizila
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/19/10 03:51 AM
Quote:
I was also wondering if this would be a good move as I now run the air gap. So a couple years ago I asked some Edelbrock reps and they said that the air gap was/is made off the same principle as the victor and that the change would be very minute and wouldnt warrant spending the extra money for the victor. I even told them I could have gotten a new one from a friend for $100 he wasnt using and they still said dont waste the money. Now maybe a nice big stroker with a serious cam and head work might benefit from the victor but who knows without some dyno time.
Totally different manifolds. I have run them both on my 408, and if you are running a decent flowing pair of heads and a cam in the 250* / .600" range, the 340 will beat the air gap at any rpm. Trust me, I'm a mechanic 
Posted By: topbrent
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 06/19/10 06:44 AM
Not to be a fanboi of other folks cars or speak for them, but
(in addition to crizila's big 300) a good car that defies logic is qwkmopardan's
4100lb 1979 300.
He is running a single plane intake and a big cam in a very heavy car street car.
- Victor 340 intake on his pump-gas 408 with a 262 @.050 flat tappet cam.
- Runs 11.60's.
- Ported junkyard 587 iron heads, too...
Quote:
qwkmopardan
This one is a 408 with similar heads as the Demon but car weighs Over 4100lbs and has a full exh with 4 mufflers. Cam has only .527 lift and 262 at .050. It has near 15000 miles on it now and still going strong. Best 1/4 mile pass on this car is 11.600 at 116mph. ... cars have nicely ported Victor 340 intakes. The "300" has a 9" J converter
Although most folks would initially recommend a RPM Air Gap and a much smaller cam profile for this plus-sized car.
...Dan sure seems to run just dandy with the victor 340 and healthy cam, though.
Posted By: FlyFish
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 12:36 PM
***UPDATE***
Got a chance to run my car with the Victor intake (see 2nd & 4th post on this thread)…looks like I paid good money to slow the car down. The car was running 7.08 in the heat with tire spinning 60’ time in the 1.55’s. I now have new tires and the Victor intake on and the car ran 7.16 in the heat with a dead hook 60’ of 1.59. The car won’t pull the front end off the ground anymore…definitely lost a lot of torque…the converter was flashing to ~5100 now its ~ 4800. I tried many different shift points over the course of 2 days and it ran the fastest when I wound it up to 6500 on every shift. With the Air-gap it ran faster shifting @ ~6000. I will be switching back to the Air-gap when time permits and keeping the Victor for future upgrades.
So, at least for my combo, the Victor was not the better intake.
Posted By: 540challenger
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 12:40 PM
Quote:
***UPDATE***
Got a chance to run my car with the Victor intake (see 2nd & 4th post on this thread)…looks like I paid good money to slow the car down. The car was running 7.08 in the heat with tire spinning 60’ time in the 1.55’s. I now have new tires and the Victor intake on and the car ran 7.16 in the heat with a dead hook 60’ of 1.59. The car won’t pull the front end off the ground anymore…definitely lost a lot of torque…the converter was flashing to ~5100 now its ~ 4800. I tried many different shift points over the course of 2 days and it ran the fastest when I wound it up to 6500 on every shift. With the Air-gap it ran faster shifting @ ~6000. I will be switching back to the Air-gap when time permits and keeping the Victor for future upgrades.
So, at least for my combo, the Victor was not the better intake.
great info, Thanks for taking your time to post.
Posted By: bigsbigelow
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 12:49 PM
Quote:
Quote:
***UPDATE***
Got a chance to run my car with the Victor intake (see 2nd & 4th post on this thread)…looks like I paid good money to slow the car down. The car was running 7.08 in the heat with tire spinning 60’ time in the 1.55’s. I now have new tires and the Victor intake on and the car ran 7.16 in the heat with a dead hook 60’ of 1.59. The car won’t pull the front end off the ground anymore…definitely lost a lot of torque…the converter was flashing to ~5100 now its ~ 4800. I tried many different shift points over the course of 2 days and it ran the fastest when I wound it up to 6500 on every shift. With the Air-gap it ran faster shifting @ ~6000. I will be switching back to the Air-gap when time permits and keeping the Victor for future upgrades.
So, at least for my combo, the Victor was not the better intake.
great info, Thanks for taking your time to post.
The intake was all that you changed? I would assume that some carb tuning and / or timing adjustments would be in store after the swap.
Posted By: Challenger 1
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 07/19/10 12:54 PM
I have both and can say the Victor 340 is heads above the RPM manifold.
My Victor equipped 340 with Eldebrock heads runs way better than it did with the RPM manifold. I did real world testing where I changed it out in my driveway and drove both the same day, same motor same carb.
There's plenty of bottem end torque for me and runs my AC non stop during the summer. I've driven my 340 at least 3000 miles this summer alone. She screams and barks the tires harshly, was not that aggresive with the RPM manifold.
With a 408, I'd have to say the RPM would get beat all to heck by the Victor.
Checkout this threead from last week:
web page 
Posted By: FlyFish
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 02:01 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
***UPDATE***
Got a chance to run my car with the Victor intake (see 2nd & 4th post on this thread)…looks like I paid good money to slow the car down. The car was running 7.08 in the heat with tire spinning 60’ time in the 1.55’s. I now have new tires and the Victor intake on and the car ran 7.16 in the heat with a dead hook 60’ of 1.59. The car won’t pull the front end off the ground anymore…definitely lost a lot of torque…the converter was flashing to ~5100 now its ~ 4800. I tried many different shift points over the course of 2 days and it ran the fastest when I wound it up to 6500 on every shift. With the Air-gap it ran faster shifting @ ~6000. I will be switching back to the Air-gap when time permits and keeping the Victor for future upgrades.
So, at least for my combo, the Victor was not the better intake.
great info, Thanks for taking your time to post.
The intake was all that you changed? I would assume that some carb tuning and / or timing adjustments would be in store after the swap.
I also put on new tires because the old ones were DEAD...same size and type as before (28x11.5 Hoosier QTP)
Posted By: Challenger 1
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 02:06 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
***UPDATE***
Got a chance to run my car with the Victor intake (see 2nd & 4th post on this thread)…looks like I paid good money to slow the car down. The car was running 7.08 in the heat with tire spinning 60’ time in the 1.55’s. I now have new tires and the Victor intake on and the car ran 7.16 in the heat with a dead hook 60’ of 1.59. The car won’t pull the front end off the ground anymore…definitely lost a lot of torque…the converter was flashing to ~5100 now its ~ 4800. I tried many different shift points over the course of 2 days and it ran the fastest when I wound it up to 6500 on every shift. With the Air-gap it ran faster shifting @ ~6000. I will be switching back to the Air-gap when time permits and keeping the Victor for future upgrades.
So, at least for my combo, the Victor was not the better intake.
great info, Thanks for taking your time to post.
The intake was all that you changed? I would assume that some carb tuning and / or timing adjustments would be in store after the swap.
I also put on new tires because the old ones were DEAD...same size and type as before (28x11.5 Hoosier QTP)
What was the density alitiude on the before and after runs?
Posted By: FlyFish
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 03:04 PM
One of the guys near my pit said the DA was ~ 4000 feet (about 92° F). The previous run was the same temp, but I don't know what the DA was. What I do know is with the old intake the worst 60’ times ever were 1.56-1.57, on “normal” hot summer days it would run 1.53’s. Also, the MPH was close to normal…down just a little. Normal in the heat, ~96.0-96.5…with the Victor it ran 95.6-95.9.
I think with a bigger cam, this intake would be great, but apparently my cam is just a little too small….or if I was running ¼ mile it would probably be faster since I would be spending more time above 6000 RPM…just thinking out loud.
Posted By: emarine01
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 03:18 PM
I would think for the victor to prove its self you would need to turn to @ least 7k, If your heads and cam an support the RPM, The air gap is a over all grate intake but usually wont go past 6500
Posted By: Streetwize
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 03:29 PM
Need a lot of Head/GEAR/RPM/stall for a Vic to show an improvement over an RPM or AG, especially in a heavier car and almost never in an 1/8th mile, motors just not in the sweet spot (above the flash and torque peak RPM)for enough of the time for it to pay off....if you don't have enough cam and head the Vic will never pay off becaue the extra airflow potential it has can never get past the valve.
Does a Victor have more HP potential?....you bet....but only when you got enough motor/rpm to need it. The M1 or old Strip Dominator makes better mid range than a Victor but not as good at the very top of the scale.
With an auto in a 3100 or so pound street car the RPM or Ag is tough to beat, as you get lighter or deeper geared the choice really depends on how much time the motor is over the torque peak.
Posted By: Locomotion
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 03:49 PM
If you are just swapping manifolds without tuning on the jetting and especially the accellerator pump circuit, you are not making a valid comparison. A richer carb set-up will favor the single plane and a leaner carb set-up will favor the dual plane. The question is how is the carb is in relationship to the rest of your engine to start with.
Posted By: bigsbigelow
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 04:11 PM
Quote:
If you are just swapping manifolds without tuning on the jetting and especially the accellerator pump circuit, you are not making a valid comparison. A richer carb set-up will favor the single plane and a leaner carb set-up will favor the dual plane. The question is how is the carb is in relationship to the rest of your engine to start with.
I don't think you are giving the Victor a fair shot with out tuning the carb.
Posted By: FlyFish
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 05:11 PM
Quote:
If you are just swapping manifolds without tuning on the jetting and especially the accellerator pump circuit, you are not making a valid comparison. A richer carb set-up will favor the single plane and a leaner carb set-up will favor the dual plane. The question is how is the carb is in relationship to the rest of your engine to start with.
I may leave the intake on for another go, but…being the skeptic that I am, I don’t think I will be able to get the 60’ times down to the same level as the Air-gap. I would need to pickup ~7 hundredths just to equal the Air-gap. The launch just feels too soft…throttle response is great, it just feels like it is down on torque.
The carb is currently tuned perfectly for the Air-gap, I assume the Victor will want a little more Jet and squirter?
Posted By: Challenger 1
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 05:19 PM
Quote:
Quote:
If you are just swapping manifolds without tuning on the jetting and especially the accellerator pump circuit, you are not making a valid comparison. A richer carb set-up will favor the single plane and a leaner carb set-up will favor the dual plane. The question is how is the carb is in relationship to the rest of your engine to start with.
I may leave the intake on for another go, but…being the skeptic that I am, I don’t think I will be able to get the 60’ times down to the same level as the Air-gap. I would need to pickup ~7 hundredths just to equal the Air-gap. The launch just feels too soft…throttle response is great, it just feels like it is down on torque.
The carb is currently tuned perfectly for the Air-gap, I assume the Victor will want a little more Jet and squirter?
I'm thinking with a DA of +4000 feet that is where your missing power and torque went. Probally needed to lean it down a little because of the bad air.
Too bad you don't know what the DA was the last time you ran the AG.
Posted By: viperblue72
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 05:57 PM
Some may think these results are flawed but I know quite a few people that have been amazed by the results with an rpm intake. I know greendart408 was running 10.8s with a very mild 408 with rpm intake. If I remember right it was 10.2 compression, ootb indybrocks,mp557 cam and 3050 pound dart.
Posted By: ademon
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 06:12 PM
Now i wonder if the hated torker II would be the ticket for a mild stroker?
Posted By: bigsbigelow
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 06:19 PM
Quote:
Quote:
If you are just swapping manifolds without tuning on the jetting and especially the accellerator pump circuit, you are not making a valid comparison. A richer carb set-up will favor the single plane and a leaner carb set-up will favor the dual plane. The question is how is the carb is in relationship to the rest of your engine to start with.
I may leave the intake on for another go, but…being the skeptic that I am, I don’t think I will be able to get the 60’ times down to the same level as the Air-gap. I would need to pickup ~7 hundredths just to equal the Air-gap. The launch just feels too soft…throttle response is great, it just feels like it is down on torque.
The carb is currently tuned perfectly for the Air-gap, I assume the Victor will want a little more Jet and squirter?
Did you swap for a Super Victor or Victor 340?
Posted By: FlyFish
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 06:29 PM
Victor 340
Posted By: bigsbigelow
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408****UPDATE**** - 07/19/10 06:38 PM
Quote:
Victor 340
Hmmm ok. I have one on my 340 and the motor really seems to like it. I haven't had it to the track but it pulls really hard all the way through the rpm range.
Posted By: justinp61
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 07/19/10 06:42 PM
What was your normal 60' in the heat with the Air Gap? My Dart with a pump gas 340, hydraulic cam, ported Edelbrocks, Weiand X-Celerator, 4.30 gears, at 3300# went a best 1.530 60' and would go 1.55-56 in the heat.
The 10.9-1 408 in it now with the same heads, flat solid cam has gone 1.41 untuned with a Victor on it.
IMHO the X-Celerator is a very underated intake, I've seen them run hard on 340/360s and strokers too.
Posted By: B3422W5
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 07/19/10 07:05 PM
Quote:
What was your normal 60' in the heat with the Air Gap? My Dart with a pump gas 340, hydraulic cam, ported Edelbrocks, Weiand X-Celerator, 4.30 gears, at 3300# went a best 1.530 60' and would go 1.55-56 in the heat.
The 10.9-1 408 in it now with the same heads, flat solid cam has gone 1.41 untuned with a Victor on it.
IMHO the X-Celerator is a very underated intake, I've seen them run hard on 340/360s and strokers too.
Couldnt agree more about the excellerator, great intake that is way underated
Posted By: FlyFish
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 07/19/10 07:17 PM
Quote:
What was your normal 60' in the heat with the Air Gap? My Dart with a pump gas 340, hydraulic cam, ported Edelbrocks, Weiand X-Celerator, 4.30 gears, at 3300# went a best 1.530 60' and would go 1.55-56 in the heat.
The 10.9-1 408 in it now with the same heads, flat solid cam has gone 1.41 untuned with a Victor on it.
IMHO the X-Celerator is a very underated intake, I've seen them run hard on 340/360s and strokers too.
On “normal” hot summer days it would run 1.53’s in the 60’ with the Air-gap….also, your car has a very similar combo (except a bigger cam and carb), but it goes ~3 tenths faster than my best (6.61 IIRC)…..weird huh?
Posted By: Scamp408
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 07/19/10 08:02 PM
Was any porting done on the victor?
Mine needed work right off the bat.The ports were smaller than a 318. I picked up 3 tenths switching a torker 2 to a victor and the torker had work on it also.
Posted By: FlyFish
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 07/20/10 01:55 PM
Quote:
Was any porting done on the victor?
Mine needed work right off the bat.The ports were smaller than a 318. I picked up 3 tenths switching a torker 2 to a victor and the torker had work on it also.
Yes, I port matched both the Air-gap and the Victor...The Victor needed more work, but looked good when I finished up.
I think I'll leave this intake on till fall, but if it doesn't pick up a LOT in the cool weather, it's coming off.
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: Victor 340 vs. RPM Air Gap on a 408 - 07/20/10 06:14 PM
Not to high jack this thread but whats everyones opinion on the M-1 single plain??