557 BBM Dyno Pull

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7mjI9yj128&t=623s

This looks like a great build! Any comments/opinions/ideas? I'm impressed!

The amount of fuel being pulled out of the squirters is impressive. Guess he could just change the squirters rather than changing the jets.

I wouldn't expect 1000 hp from a set of Victor heads. Be interesting to see some details on that engine.

Very impressive, stump puller.

No details?

The details they give are not very detailed: Victor heads CNC ported by Hughes, 15.3 compression, 60mm camshaft, T&D rockers, 1450 CFM carb. Surprising to me is the HP being made at 6700 RPM. And those squirters--what's going on there, and what would it take to fix that?

Heavier check valves, maybe two of them in the hole under the squirters
Make sure and keep in mind that extra fuel is contributing to the overall air fuel ratio so fixing that leak may mean bigger main jets to make the same power or more power

FWIW- we film the carbs during our dyno sessions, from above the carb and, thats pretty normal "pull over" from the squirters for us. At the track, if data is dirty on the hit with footbrake cars and i need to change squirters, i know its going to effect upper rpm afr , one pass is usually enough to know if i need a bleed change or, a a jet change. Have not played with double shot to stop pull over, might be interesting .
Have you tried it Andy? Anyone else ?

861trq, out of 557ci NA almost seems impossible...

I remember seeing this video years ago and not believing the #s. There is another video of his "peter willie" Cuda on Youtube and i saw a few 156 and then a 157+ MPH passes. This was supposed to be a 'lesser' HP version of this motor, and in context, I think it's believable. At least in the ways I correlate HP to track performance. I'd WAG this Cuda has to be at least 3200lbs with driver?

Not to be a Debbie Downer but I wouldn't think 1000 horsepower worth of N/A flow would even move through a Victor or similar MW head, The general target (within about 10%) rule of thumb for an efficient race engine is Intake port flow is ~4.1 cfm per HP per cylinder. It's not a "end all" formula but it certainly will put you in very close in the ball park as far as N/A head HP potential.

so for a very good but "achievable 380CFM MW head, 380/4.1 ~ 93hp x 8 = 744 HP so maybe (+ 10%) 825 MAX, so how much can a Victor flow at MAX? maybe 400-410? That would be 800 to 880 ish.

So I would expect about 880 hp at most would be the max you could get....without a moved centerline wedge head like a B1. I'd love to see the heads and intake on that puppy if indeed that is the real number. I'm sure the vaccuum pump helps but still that a lot of molecules to burn

Peter's Cuda has a chassis that is legal for Super Stock, it just needs a Shaker hood, instead of the 6 Pack scoop. It's probably closer to 3400lbs, with driver.

Thank you! Respectfully Streetwise, what would you estimate the 'older/lesser HP' to be considering the MPH and weight?

Respectfully, I'm just stating I've just never seen that kind of HP out of a Victor or Similar (non moved centerline) head.

But 156 mph at 3400 pounds in a super stock legal E body chassis (not very aerodynamic) is very impressive....regardless of the motor.

Like some of the others have expressed it would be interesting to see the heads on that motor.

One thing that may be helping if it's a 4.500 (or larger) bore the vs the typical B/RB 4.375" as far as intake flow. I'm guessing the motor is 4.5" B x 4.375" S ?

I would just think you'd need more like 470+ CFM of intake flow to get to 1000 HP which is typically more like Hemi/B1 territory.

Just be aware, that Non Moved centerline heads can become moved centerline, IF the right people know what they doing .....Guides and seats can be moved, especially in aluminum heads ......Just saying

a lot depends on the combo. Maxed out 440-1 heads, 15/1 compression, .868 lift roller, methanol fuel injection, thin rings, very good headers, coated pistons, 550cubes, i made 926 hp and track performance was there. But 1,000?

Greg has another example of a GOOD HP low-port motor. Dwayne did a 572 that wasn't fancy years ago and it showed over 900HP. DVW is over 900. Chuck did a B1BS stock block motor in 2005? made over 875 on dyno and in car. Scott Brown has built -1 motors over 900+. AndyF made over 900 with an SR head on dyno. I feel that in consideration of the changes made to that motor based on what it runs in the car is representative. Few are willing to go thru the expense of running a big cam and I think that opens the door to more power that you typically don't see. Q fuel adds some power as well.

I did push my 514 over 900 hp a few times with EZ heads. They were heavily reworked EZ heads, but still a low port, non-moved centerline type of head. However, I was using custom built dyno headers as well as a dry sump, Jesel belt drive distributor, a high dollar intake manifold, high dollar rocker arms, special race fuel, etc.

The engine in this video has passenger car headers on it. I'm not sure what is going on in the video, but I just don't see how a non-power adder engine is going to make 1000 hp with that set of headers and Victor heads.

Another thing to consider, is Peter races at Mission Raceway in the Pacific Northwest. I believe that track is near sea level.

They're at sea level and the day they dynoed the motor it was in the low 40's for air temp. Correction factors can only do so much to bring that back to standard temp and pressure. It's gotta be up 15% on power compared to a normal day here in the midwest, as an example.

Yessir...this was one thing i factored into my consideration way back when I saw the videos. Has the car run any better? Those don't look like 'perfect' runs to me bouncing and spinning. I also saw an 8.58 ET so that would hint that there is more to be had. Manuals typically MPH better than autos ad their ET doesn't reflect it typically. Wallace calls the old motor about 925 OR SO. As stated, we don't know the air on those days and who's saying the combo is sorted out completely IN THE CAR. I'm saying that it's probable his numbers are 'close-enough' for me to believe.

The car is fast, no doubt about that. So regardless of the dyno numbers it is a stout combination.

Exactly my point of mentioning Frans motor with the different pieces than it was dynoed with. Those pieces could add the '50HP' that it appears to be lacking from your dyno. Again to me this is validation. And that is not considering that it is well-sorted out in the car so, there could be even more.

Being a stick might help the mph. And if it truly weighs 3400. It's pretty impressive. Never seen another Victor headed motor run even close to that.The track video shows it runs better than most any BB inline wedge Mopar I've seen period. Centainly much better than mine.
Doug

The Moroso chart shows 980hp for 157mph and 3300lbs.

That’s uncorrected, as it sits in the car.

That's about what Wallace said but i was fudging the numbers to allow for the weight possibly being 3200ish and the DA correcting below sea level. Stout is the word for me.

There is no doubt the car puts a great number up on the board.......however I am doubtful it would make 861ft/lbs on the dyno here.
At 557”, that’s 1.545/ci........ which I have never seen on the dyno here, N/A, on gasoline.

I’m not saying it’s “impossible”, but I am skeptical.

Same Bore and Stroke as my engine, yet it makes 130trq more than mine, and the combos aren't THAT different...

Be curious to know the actual weight of the car for sure. If it was trult ever a Super Stocker in the last couple of decades you would be surprised wat how light they can get. As for racing at MIssion it is as good as air gets on the west coast. Barometer is usually always at over 30 and always cool. I have seen DA in the summer there in the -300'-400' range. It is THE place for hero runs on the west coast for sure.

As for the 4.1 per cfm deal, that's quite antiquated way of assessing CFM these days. I have three engines of my own that are well outside that by quite a bit and none of them are anything special.

As for the dyno numbers as I always say it is just a tool. The car and combo certainly run well and thats undeniable. I am sure it is a very well sorted out combo and by the looks of the shop the owner has been a long time SS guy, So I am sure he gets everything out of a car.

The car was run in SS/D with a hemi in it previously(the car is a natural E car).
The weight break for SS/D is 7.50, and the factored HP is 455.
So, 455 x 7.50 = 3412.5, plus 170 for driver allowance, and you’re at 3582.5 minimum in D(in E the min weight with driver would be 3810).

3300-3400 sounds pretty reasonable to me for swapping in an aluminum headed wedge.

Al,

I agree on the 4.1 but for me as far as being outdated but for Mopar's and other wedges it's typically a reasonably good measure of attainable power potential. For me It's always been a good "practical" rule of thumb. Usually someone has a Head in mind

I would say 90-95% of 4.1 is pretty easy to attain (and not break the bank) but Greater than 110% of 4.1...GENERALLY there's a better/bigger head/combo available to get you there for less.

From what I’ve seen, 350-360 cfm Indy heads on a high CR stroker build are a pretty straightforward way to get to 800+ HP.
Using the 4.1 theory shows that’s only 700hp worth of flow.

That’s more like what you’d see from a hot street/strip type of build.

The EZ heads on my 514 were in the 360 to 365 range on Dwayne's bench and that engine went over 900 hp a few times. Somewhere along the way I stopped trying to correlate cylinder head flow with power output. The two things are loosely correlated but so many other things can upset the apple cart that airflow kind becomes a rough guide at best.

I still don't think I'd ever recommend starting with Victor heads if a customer asked for 1000 hp. Victor heads would not be my first choice, or my second choice or even my third choice for that kind of build.