Timing gear marks

Couple problems installing timing chain on my 440.
The marks don't exactly line up, the 2 pics show where they are when moved one link off of the other.
Also, at tdc the crank mark is a little off.

Pic one looks right to me, but I degree everything, so I’d know exactly where it was before the timing cover went on.

find true piston TDC with the piston stop & remark the dampener slit as needed. take those timing gears into your parts house & compare em to another set (not that you would be buying a parts house cheapie but you are comparing dot locations (mistakes happen). Then yes I would degree it. Holler back with any news. EDIT you could count the teeth on the crank sprocket & divide that # into 360 to find the # of degrees that is between the CL of one tooth to the CL of the next tooth to do some guestimation but it would still need to be degreed to see where you are at. MORE EDIT iirc 25 teeth so 14.4 degrees tooth to tooth.

Ok so I found TDC using the dial indicator by marking it on the degree wheel and going back one revolution and marking at 0 again then dividing by 2 and setting the degree wheel at that number.
Then I mocked up my damper and timing tab and found this. Shouldn't it be lined up at zero?

It should read zero when the piston is at TDC. If it doesn't then you have a problem. Most likely the damper but could be the timing tab. Swap parts until you figure it out or else take more measurements. At TDC the crank key should be pointed at 45 degrees (towards #1 TDC). The zero mark on the damper and timing cover is at 42 degrees on the passenger side head. It isn't 45 degrees as most people assume. It can be hard to measure those angles with out special tools so that information might not help you. The zero mark on the damper is supposed to be 92 degrees from the crank key slot. Your damper appears to be 10 degrees off so you might be able to see that with your eye or with a carpenter square.

Not sure I'm following your method. Is your dial indicator's "0" at TDC?

You should pick some distance down from TDC, like 0.050" down, then approach that value turning the motor over clockwise, then counter clockwise.

Yes I did .050 down and then one revolution to .050 down, ended up with 24 degrees difference so I split the difference on the degree wheel (actually was 10 btdc and 14 atdc so I set at 2 atdc)
That should be true TDC?

use a dial indicator and get your piston at true TDC, your dot on the crank gear should be straight up, if your cam is to be installed at heads up, no advance or retard, rotate your camshaft until both lifters are at the same height. When the two dots are together that is the overlap period of the cam, one lifter should be falling one should be rising. If the cam is advanced the intake lifter will be slightly higher, if the cam timing is retarded the exhaust lifter will be slightly higher. I use a thick feeler gauge blade as a straight edge.

Are you using a degree wheel with a pointer?

I go farther down than .050 myself, I want there to be pretty swift piston movement, so each degree really shows up on the indicator.
I use .200 down, but in theory, if you’re careful it shouldn’t matter.

After you find the split between the two sides, it needs to be verified against the (adjusted to true “zero”) pointer.

I go thru it a couple times to make sure that zero is zero on the wheel.

With the wheel on zero, and without moving the crank, remove the degree wheel and slide the damper on until it catches the key.

That will show you how far you’re off.
If it’s more than a couple of degrees........ I’d be figuring out which piece had the big error........ and get rid of it.

you need to slip a couple of feeler gauges between the piston and cylinder as your bringing the piston up. usually .012"-.013" will do. one to the inside of the cylinder and one to the outside to prevent piston rock. if you don't do that then TDC readings probably aren't accurate. looks like bubba got to the dampner. got another dampner? also look for an offset key at the crank.

with the degree wheel on I would eyeball the piston as close to TDC as you can guess. zero the dial indicator. On the dampener go back CCW till the needle goes back .100". note the degrees. On the dampener go back CW till the dial goes back to zero then goes down the other way to .100". note the degrees. add the 2 readings & divide in half & move the dampener to that halfway # on the wheel to get you to true TDC. (I hope I didn't miss a step there). Assuming a 7&1/4 dampener, 42 degrees is 2.657" and 92 degrees is 5.821" & you can measure a strip of paper with your calipers then cut it & use it as a flexible ruler around the dampener circumference to confirm those 2 readings. On the 92 degrees see if the keyway slot is that far away around from the TDC slit & not sure on the 42, one end of the strip of paper lined up with the zero of the timing tab, not sure on the other end. Just me I think it is a mismatched timing gear set cuz you cant get dot to dot (if I am reading/seeing this right) no matter what is going on with piston actual TDC showing zero on the tab/slit, that being correct or not. Holler back when you can. EDIT I relooked at the first pic & I was turned around, it appears that if you hand bumped the crank a bit CW that the cam dot would line up dead on

The problem with the offset crank key is it also moves the cam.

On the dampers I’ve installed where the zero was off a bit, I just make a small notch with a hacksaw in the timing tab that lines up with the zero on the damper.
I’ve never had one that was more than 2-3deg off.

I'm pretty sure there's something wrong with my crank sprocket and possibly the damper,
I'm pickingup a new timing chain gear set tomorrow and start over with that.

The timing cover you have is a early one, zero at the top. Do you know if that dampener is the matching dampener for it?(it isn't ) If not then you need one to match it or change the timing cover to match the dampener Your not the first Mopar guy to run into this, that mismatched combination is right at 10 degrees off
As far as the timing gear and crank gear marks don't worry about them when degreeing the cam, they won't change once you get the cam timed where you want it, correct Dang them Cloyes timing sets with the bad marks

or at least make a mental note (or write down) for when you get there where the dots are on the old one compared to the new one. What Cab said on the tab, I ain't a big block guy but I thought something was odd about that one!, I coulda swore I had seen some with numbers on both sides. Update us when you can.

Thanks for the help guys. I do in fact have the wrong cover, it's for the early 60-65 big blocks.
It looks like 0 degrees is nearly 10 degrees off of where it should be according to this...
http://www.440source.com/timingcovers.htm

Alright, I would find true TDC with the piston stop tool & make a black sharpie mark on the tab for true zero. If you are all together it'd be the easiest way out. EDIT I forgot that you have already confirmed TDC with the dial indicator

Do you need a different cover? I have some used ones sitting on the shelf.

I use an adjustable timing light so I'm either going to just mark tdc on the tab that's there or buy a bolt on timing tab but thanks for offering

You can cut off part of that early tab off at the top to make zero at the top instead of marking it or replacing it

Ok I have a new timing chain and gears and everything is lining up as it should, must have been the wrong gears also.
My question is when degreeing this cam it looks like at has 4 degrees advance built in, should I install straight up or 4 degrees retarded?

I would check the cam timing with the degree wheel, and adjust it as necessary to have it installed where I wanted it.

Which is the same thing I would have done with the other timing set.

Without checking it, you have no idea where it is.

Degree it so it is advance 4 degrees on the intake lobe like Comp wants it
Advancing it will give you more tire spinning bottom end also

With the multiple keyways get it to 106 or as close to that as you can & do check piston to valve clearance. As said a lesser # is advancing it & moves the powerband RPM range lower & retarding it (a higher #) raises it. Start with 106 & go from there.