Stroker cranks available for the 400B block

I have found 3 4.150 cranks with 2.200 rod journal for the 400 block. Eagle,440source and molnar. Are there any other brands available for 400?

Ohio Crank. They will grind whatever you want.

I'm in the same boat. I thought Scat made one also but it may be Mopar journal. I'm going with the Molnar myself.

ok. Ill give them a call.

thats not too cost effective. They tell me $669 for the crank. $100 to turn rod journals to 2.200 and $175 to turn mains to fit 400 block. I see 440source has a light weight crank for $900. 4.250 only thou.

Do Like I did and wait for a 4.15 that has a spun bearing, offset grind it to 4.25 or 4.30" with the 2.200 pins and Bob's your uncle

just may do that.

SCAT has a variety of Mopar BB cranks in their new catalog. I went with SCAT for my last 470 engine.

Callies may or may not have low deck stroker cranks available. Just have to check to see what they have posted.

Also

X2

i think i only seen 2 on their site. None with chevy rod journals. Ill have to call them.

just spoke with scat. They have 2 cranks for 400 block. Both with mopar rod journals. To have it turned by them it would be pricey at $1900.

I thought the 440 source 4.15 crank was only the Mopar rod end size (2.375"?)
4.25" is 2.20 rod size. Just noticed they have a light weight 4.25 crank too

yes and no. They have an ultra light 4.250 with 2.200 rod journal . if i can go that stroke i will be looking harder at it.

The 2.2 rod size has a nice selection of bearings

FWIW I am happy with my std rod journal 4.15" B engine crank. Decent rods and tri-metal bearings are readily available... mine was just freshened. I would not spend extra time or money to go 2.2" personally.

FWIW I have a brand new Mopar Performance crank in the classifieds. American made, 3.900" stroke, 2.200" rod journals and all work done by a highly reputable crank specialist.

PM me if interested as I'm going a different direction

if i were building a 470 i would be interesred but im going longer stroke. Thanks for the offer.

I ordered narrow king bearings for that 2.200 journal.

Did everyone suggest using Clevites when you ran a thread on bearings?

yes and i ordered clevit main bearings which are gonna need chamfering. I thought they were a narrow bearing like the kings.

Why do they need Chamfering? I recently bought a Source crank expecting that to need bearing chamfering but it didn't, all the Clevite bearings fitted perfect with 0.0025 clearence on all journals. Couldn't ask for better.

Maybe I'm missing something but why would you order bearing before crank....just because they say it's so don't mean it is..or am I thinking wrong order bearing get crank go from there ..I would think check block order crank then get bearing and machine to spec..am I wrong in my thinking..

i want to make sure the bearings especially the thrust bearing fit the aluminum caps while i have the block at the shop. i have been told sometimes the thrust bearing doesn't properly fit these caps. really doesn't matter either way as it sounds like i will have to have the crank machined for clearance anyway.

well, thats good to hear. i talked to source today and they told me the clevite ms876p main would have to be chamfered. they sell the chamfered bearing for something crazy like $179 a set. ouch!

When I was chamfering bearings for an early Source crank it was only the rod bearings that needed attention. The new crank I bought was fitted up with HN bearings & they fitted up fine with no clearencing issues.

I have the MS 876P bearings and the info says they are narrow for clearance on all aftermarket cranks.
Mick

Why are people still making the Mopar size journals...???

IMO no reason NOT to go 4.25", with a 6.535" (BBC +.500") you can use the same 1.32" CH piston they make for any 451 B low deck 6.76" rod combo, everybody makes that piston. a 4.25" with 2.200 journals has BETTER block clearance than a 4.15" stroke with the B/RB mopar journals.

FWIW....the 4.15" stroke came about because it mathematically allowed any RB owner to bump to 493 cubes by boring to 4.342" reusing his 6.76" rods and using an off-the-shelf 400B piston.

yeah, hn. the n is for narrow. thats how king does it. would have bought the king mains but they dont offer a full groove.

i hope that is correct. my save me alittle

The 4.15 piston is only 468g though.

I just had Ohio crank take a 440 4.250 stroke crank and make me a 400 4.375 stroke with 2.2 rod journals. When it was all said and done I have around $700 in the crank. I started off with a new k1 crank

ohio crank will do what ever you want,i have a 4.500 stoke,chevy rod 2.20,,400 mains,knife edge,counter weights cut down,lighten,in a 400

Which type, steel or aluminum, H beam or I beam rods did you use in that motor? How much block grinding for rod clearances was needed with that stroke? I haven't ran a 4.375 stroke in a 400 yet, much less a 4.500 Thanks in adavnce for the answers

Are you using the Mahle pistons?

the mahles i would like to use are 512g. these are 1.350x4.375

If you plan on purchasing Mahles, price check a few sources. JEGS was $100 less than Summit when I ordered mine.

i found them for 607 . not sure if that price is still current.

BIG BLOCK MOPAR (B) / 383, 400 Flat Top
1.5, 1.5, 3.0mm File Fit Performance Ring Set included 72cc 80cc 84cc
499 4.375 4.150 6.760 1.120R 0.990 -8cc 467 12.4 11.4 11.0 4032 0.350 0.0041 0.0049 BBM120375F08
Compression Heights with "R" INCLUDE Oil Support Rails

These are what I was looking at...

i looked at those too. I was told may not be a good choice for a street/strip deal.

I'm using the 99497 ross pistons Eric and sorry but i got it wrong they're 486g but they're still the lightest of all the mopar BB pistons on their web page.
Mick

Strip only?

i will call mahle and ask, but been told buy several builders not to run those short pistons in a street engine if ya want longevity.

Have you ever looked at the piston CH on an LS motor or 3G Hemi?

CH for a 6.1 piston: 1.225

CH for LS1 piston: 1.328

Just food for thought. Personally one of the last thing I'd worry about is the 1.32 CH.

correction: I called mahle about the short piston on the street deal and they tell me that it is a myth that you will not get longevity out of a short piston such as their 1.120 pin height. so that changes things for my plan. i will try a 4.150/6.760/1.120 combo if i go the 499 deal. less weight and better rod stroke ratio. looks like a good combo

My ross pistons, 1.12 ch.

i took another look at the mahle 1.120x4.375 and they weight the same as the ross. should make a nice lite combo with good rod stroker ratio.

Do you know if ross makes a dish piston in same specs? my compression will be alittle high at 11.6 with the flat top.

I know they do/did for a 440 based 4.15 stroke 493. Mine are IIRC 34cc.

When I ordered my kit, Ross was the supplier for 440Source and that dish was a custom order. There were enough orders after mine that they became a shelf stocking piston and they (Ross) were so late delivering my pistons that I got a rebate on the custom upcharge. Don't know if they are still a shelf stock or not.

With zero deck and 84 CC RPM's my CR measured 8.97:1.

Kevin

Off the shelf dish nope. Just custom order. Ross 99497 is 10.5.

Have you looked at Diamond... if they have the
piston for the bore you can have them dished for
$35-$40 for the set

yes diamond has one as well. Dont know the weight or ring size yet. They are more money for the diamond vs the mahle.

Not if they wont had your dish.. you need to look at
big picture

mike the dish sizes are -12.5 what i need -20 and -24. Glad im finding more options.

On my 416.. I used their flat top pistons and had
them add a 22cc dish to give me my compression of
10.4 with a .039 gasket.. that cost me $35 for the
set.. a lot of companies wont do anything and just
say... custom pistons... and if they are a few grams
heavier big deal.. your not gonna turn high revs

Check with Icon (silvolite) they have quite a few selections. 775-882-7790

I have a set of new , never used Ross pistons with a 17cc dish, I believe they would work out to around 10.2-1 compression with the edlrobrock heads I used. .30 for a 400ci, .55 over for 440ci. if intrested

thats good to know . thanks Mike

I did look at those awhile back. Ill take another look.

What the comp. Height and bore size?

i wish it was a myth, i bought 2x sets of 1.120ch pistons, both sets suffered from premature wear on the skirts & due to the piston rocking, i had to change rings every year on my race engine just to get the cranking pressure #'s back up.
We learn from our mistakes & I will never run a short piston like this again, they were costing me too much in maintenance. The 1.32ch piston is so much better for long term ring seal. Personally Dave, i think you'd be doing better to build yourself a 512. I've done a couple of 451's with great success, a 470 that was ok but a rod bolt failure cut that motors life short, a 499 stroker was my most expensive to maintain & a 512 which seems to be as good as the 451, but theyre the same piston so not surprised.

what brand of pistons did you have that issue with? Thanks for the heads up about this possible issue. Mahle told me its the way they build their piston that prevents the worn ring skirt issue. If you want the specifics youll have to give them a call but they told me no issues such as these with their piston.

http://s85.photobucket.com/user/caper_2006/media/HPIM0312.jpg.html?filters[user]=26741373&filters[recent]=1&sort=1&o=1

How do you post a pic? Why does somebody have a site that is very hard to post a pic?

I don't think it is the pin height that allows them to rock in the bore but skirt bottom to piston crown height that keeps the rocking down.

HERE IS WHATS ON THE BOX FROM ROSS

bore size 4.375
C.H. 1.865
Ring Groves .0640 .0640 .1880
Ring Lands .220 .155 .080
Pin .990 2.930 DBL
Net Dome CC's -17
Dish Depth .140
INT. V.P> Dia 2.300
Ext V.P. Dia 2.000 depth .300
Net Dia 4.370 depth .260
Total seal rings
Send PM if interested. Going out for evening for a few beers.

Will try to post pics in for sale section tomorrow.

On my first 400 block low deck pump gas 4.250 stroke stroker motor I had Ross custom make the pistons with a 22.0 CC dish, they weighed 452 grams without the pins and with the oil ring spacers. I used a forged steel BB Chevy type H beam 6.800 long CAT brand rod and had Ross make the pistons with the tight alloy aluminum to reduce the piston rock in the bores, I don't remeber the exact C.H. but they where real short. I changed the crank to a 4.300 stroke to move the pistons up from .025 down to zero deck when I put the eddy aluminum heads on it two years later to increase the compression ratio. Dram use to call them hockey pucks once I posted a picture of them, the bottom of the skirts would come 1/2 way out of the bores and the pistons skirts look bad,they had visible wear marks from rocking, but measure good It turns out that alloy is very delicate and mars and marks up easily I don't use a compression gauge but the motor did leak down good with a FFA certified aircraft dual gauge leakdown gauge I put a lot of laps on that motor at the track and drove it on the street some also, probally less than 4000 street miles
Lots of choices out there, think and check out many things and times before buying, act once

exactly. I ask on here to get different opinions and that gives me a better idea of which way to go.

Go to the botton of the box where to type your reply. Click on file manager.

I agree. I don't see why wrist pin height factors into overall piston height. It seems to me the max skirt length is determined by stroke, counterweight radius and deck height. I expect the 'hockey puck' pistons are for those who want to brag about their low bob weight.

i Thought the shorter the pin height the shorter the over all piston height as well?

not nessacarily

ok, just seems when i see shorter pin height the piston is lighter as well.

I would contact Diamond. They are less than 80 miles from you and will make the piston however you want it. Talk to Ron Beaubien.. I had my custom pistons for one of my builds in less than a week

ill ask Dwayne Welder about them, he is a dealer for Diamond. He's on 11m and 75.

👍

I expect the 'hockey puck' pistons are for those who want to brag about their low bob weight.

[/quote]
Some of us on here share information based on past expereinces to help others on here make decisions I order those pistons for a iron headed pump gas motor with those rods and stroke. I hadn't built any other low deck strokers motor from scratch at that time, the pistons are what Ross made for me for that application. When I posted the original dyno results a bunch of the "experts" on here doubted the results without having a clue on what they could do with the same parts, I ended pointed out making 1.19 HP per C.I. on pump gas was no big deal
If you don't experiment and try new things you will always be behind on the HP curve Lead, follow or get out of the WAY

Will offsetting the 4.15 get you into the oil pickup? What's the point of the build? Street? Some strip? What heads? Where I'm going is if you have heads that will only support 500hp maybe a bit more... On a milder build why get into reworking a crank and custom pistons. 451 or 470 would get you there just as easy with less chasing .02

470 was what i wanted to do first. 499/511 costs about the same. I just bought a pickup from source for stroker cranks to fit the pan cab sold me. Mostly street and to track couple times a season. Edelbrock vics cnc flow 359@600 on up. 11-11.5 comp.

Gotcha. My only real thought is build around the heads and theres a lot to be had with your Vic's ... Max it out. I just see 500+" and stealths for street use and it seems odd to use hockey puck pistons on a street build to make 500hp obviously not your direction

no, the goal is to break into the 9's on pump gas with 3300#. drive most any where.