MT 33x10.5w vs Hoosier 33x10.5w for a 4-Speed NSS car.

Time to replace my slicks and I am looking for opinions between MT and Hoosier.

My slicks are old. Running the MT ones right now. Bought them during the build, and they sat for years before I ever went racing with them. I believe they are 8 or 9 years old.

Nostalgia Super Stock Car running NSS-A, but will probably move to FX-C once I complete my license requirements. Running the 10.0 class I am usually busting the 135mph limit so it is time to get legal... Best 1/4 was 9.98, 1/8 was 6.32. Mostly run 1/8 with the SHRA series.

68' Barracuda FB..Stick Car at just under 3k lbs race weight with me in it. Launch 5400 or so. 12"w 15" wheels. 4 Link with double adjustables. It does pull the wheels, but people watching the car have told me it does spin. Can't really feel it in the car.

I have been running the MT 33x10.5W on a 12" rim with tubes and screws. They are old, but only have 52 passes on them. Best 60' was a 1.41 but average is 1.5-1.6.

Looking to stay with the 33x10.5wx15 size and Summit only shows 3 tires that fit that bill.

MT 3069W M5 compound
Hoosier 18332C11 C11 compound
Phoenix PH103 F9 compound

Not sure which way to go, but I am leaning towards either sticking with the MT, or trying the Hoosier.

Have any of you run both of these tires and can you give me a comparison? Most if the cars I have looked at are running the MT.

-Dave

First of all that sure is a light car

I have tried the 33x10.5 tire and it was too much for my car. I run NSS 10.0 class and have also run the AFX/C class and my car weighs 3450 with me in it. I found the best tire for me is the 29.5x10.5 MT. I also think that tire you are using is killing your 60ft and you also would be better off with a shorter tire. Even the 30x10.5W would be better.

I did try the Hoosier 30x10.5 radial and it was not bad but the radial did not last long at all in that size for me.

In that tire size M/T all the way. They are the top of the heap in the "small tire" stuff for sure. My question is do you need that much tire?

Whats your RPM at the traps(1/4) and what gear
do you run

I have run my N/SS car on both M/T 10.5x29.5 and 10.5Wx31. My car runs A/FX with ladder bars. Its been 1.29 on the small ones, 1.25 on the big ones. Always run well over 100 passes per pair. I see no need for 10.5x33.
Doug

Yes the car is light, especially without me in it LOL. I am fluffy...
Front to rear bias last time I weighed it was 54.57%F 45.43% Rear.

Will try to answer the questions.

Running a 4:86 gear in the 9"
Jerico with 1st-2.93 2nd-1.84 3rd-1.33
Boninfante clutch.
AFCO Double adjustables.

Do not know my rpm at the top end of the 1/4 because last season I only made 2ea 1/4 mile passes. In the 1/8 I generally go through the traps just after I shift into 4th with the rpm at ~6300 at about 110mph. Normal shift point is 7400-7600

Generally run 10.5-11psi in the Mickeys.

-Dave

Do you have Afco doubles all the way around? I would bet with that much starting line ratio they need to be almost full stiff. If you video I'll bet it spins after the hit.
Doug

AFCO doubles only in the back. Fronts are the cheap Competition Engineering 3 ways..

-Dave

The CE's definitely should be set at full tight. Got any video?
Doug

Not sure if this will work. This is a FB link. I am the last one on this video. Probably the last 30 seconds. Watch it in HD if you can. Keep in mind my sister along with a couple of her friends were videoing this and they already had a few beers in them....

SHRA TT at Thunder Road Raceway 10/11/2015

-Dave

Nice looking and sounding car. I am following along with you on this one as I just got my car together and will be hitting the track soon with it, and I am trying to figure out what tire to use. Mine is a 69 Cuda fastback.

I ran Phoenix for 10yrs on my low 10sec 4 speed 68' Cuda. Last year I switched to M/T's stiff sidewall stick tire and I've been very happy with it. The car is .01-02 better in the 60ft but what I like best is they remain consistent.

I run quite a few UMTR stick races each year and probably 90% of guys run M/T. I'd say then followed by Phoenix and Good Year. You'll want to avoid a radial. Good luck. Nice car btw.

Hard to see whats happening from the far lane but this is what I see. The front end comes up and tops out too quick for my liking (loose front rebound on the shocks). The either it spins or bogs and then drops the front end like a like a rock. When this happens the rear tires unload and spin. There's plenty left in that combo. What is your starting line rpm? Sounds low. Close video taken from the side is your friend. Start first with just the rear tire, then go on to the entire car once you see what the rear is doing. Even though the rear and front are not separate adjustments they work together to provide the optimal set-up. Cell phones can take pretty decent video, or better yet Go-Pro. The starting line to 20-30 feet out is what you need to see. I had mine so far off last year my 60ft at one time was 1.45. I couldn't get the car past 330 safely. All in learning the adjustments. In this pic the car will rollout 6-7 feet before the front tires come off the ground and set down just before the 60 ft clocks.
Doug

Wow, I wouldn't have thought with that rear gear and low trans gear with the RPM's you are launching at you would get a bog of the line.

DVW,

This picture was taken on the same pass in the video. That pass I launched at 5400rpm. Went 1.418 60', 4.097 330ft, at a 6.32 1/8 110.06mph. Rear shocks were at 18comp, 20 rebound.

I was fighting a bog at that race due to an intake leak causing a lean launch. We jetted up just before that pass and it went its quickest 1/8th so far.

-Dave

Another Launch from a different track.

-Dave

I would agree with most all of what Doug said. Video is your friend when working on this stuff. Focus on rear tire from a 3/4 view. Get some new front shocks as well to control front rise better. Comes up fast for sure and car was not happy once it did

It sure looks like your unloading the tire, take a look at the picture of your car and the one above yours, look at how much more load is on his tire than yours.

I thought that I might be hitting the bars too hard and unloading.... for some reason I didn't write down my wheelie bar info at that race.

Just went to the garage and checked. The lower bar is 58.5" long and bottom of wheelie bar wheel is 7" as it sits right now in the garage. I believe that they were set at ~6" when that video was taken.

I know I need better front shocks, but if I go with a shorter tire, I need to changed my tubes as well. Looks like this winters upgrades are going to get expensive.

Unfortunately most of the races I went to last year I didn't have anyone that could video my car for me. I do it all the time for friends, but most of the video's they have taken for me captured everything but what I needed LOL.

-Dave

Are those screens on your carbs or those Edelbrock air filters.......hard to tell........

Like I said I can't see from that side, For sure the front end falls close to the same time I hear the rpm go flat. Could be a combination of things. We had some success this year tightening the comp 3 ways as tight as they would go on a buddy's car. Though it was a totally different combo. How about the 4 link settings? I/C and bar spread at the housing? Doesn't look like it hits the tire all that hard. It might like more tire load and lower weight transfer. As far as 4 link adjustments I'm no expert. What I do know is there is more to it than just I/C.
Doug

Thumper,

They are the old style sort of heart shaped air cleaners without filters. Also located under the air cleaner cover, I have some fine screens as an additional layer. No close up pics here at the office, but here are a couple of underhood pics.

Problem with mine is I am using an old Eddy STR cross ram intake. It is modified to make the carbs into an inline setup, but they are too close together for most filters. Setting these up back to back with some small mods, plus the additional screen inside gives me protection from debris, but it is still not as good as a regular filter. The extra screens underneath are fine veggie strainers with the handles cut of LOL.

-Dave

Thanks again for all the replies. Looks like I will probably drop down in tire size, and start shopping for new front shocks.

-Dave

Before you start throwing money at it I would move the bars up to get them out of the way, up high enough to keep it safe, sort out the bog off the hit and spend some time at a tnt playing with the front end settings loosing the shocks and playing with the limiters and see how it does, I bet you will find the sweet spot. The car looks like it is fairly close just hard to tell with the bog going on. To many people throw money at the problems and never really figure out the solutions, there are a lot of guys out there with those shocks and are running very good. A couple nights with the camera at tnt with the focus on the hit and I bet find the problem. Good luck.

Thanks Sky,

Just found an e-mail from 2007 and it looks like my slicks were purchased back in May or June of 2007! Time to change them, even though they only have 52 passes. I just don't trust them... So the slicks are getting chaged out for sure.

Still working on other upgrades as well. For us the racing season is just around the corner, and our local tracks appear to still be open with the exception of rain days...... Hope to get some TNT and video before the SHRA season kicks off again.

-Dave

Take em off, re tune and get back w/us cos those things SUCK big time and yes, I`ve tested em...........

Thumper,

Not trying to discount your advice and will keep it in mind.

Not sure you can see it in the pics, but there is no filter media/foam in them, just a secondary screen to keep rocks and tire bits out of the engine. Some tracks we run at have a short ramp up area and there are times when I get pelted with debris from cars in front of me in the burnout box. I have run with and without them and they made no difference whatsoever. Carb spacing is too close together to run anything off the shelf.

The video above was showing one of the passes after I started having trouble with a vacuum leak at a race. Jetted up some to keep going as the rounds were getting short. Made it to the finals that night at close to 2am on a greasy track only to red light at the big show LOL. But thats racing.

My 60' times were way off even before the bog and I believe it was a traction issue.

Looked through my log book and the fastest pass so far was 10.22/138.29 Terrible 60' with a big top end charge. Blew the tires off. So far the quickest pass was a 9.952/137.79 same track but a different race. Both were in St. Louis.

The only thing changed in my combo between those runs and the one in the video was an up size in the jetting because of the vacuum leak. You should have seen the pass before that one where it REALLY bogged! I have it on video somewhere. Will look for it.

-Dave

For what its worth, I've run those air filters on my blown small block street car (11.0@123). I also built a air filter base and top to run a 4"tall K&N. The triangle style with or w/o the foam and the K&N all run with in .05 of each other.
Doug

For what its worth, I've run those air filters on my blown small block street car (11.0@123). I also built a air filter base and top to run a 4"tall K&N. The triangle style with or w/o the foam and the K&N all run with in .05 of each other. Also for what it's worth my 1st pair of 10.5wx31M/T were 5 years old before I ever used them. 150 passes 60ft was still with in .05 best to worst at the end 2 years later.
Doug

dvw hit it earlier in the thread. Tighten up those front shocks. No, they are not ideal but will work. You will move the lift of the front down track a few feet and not as violent. It worked on my car for several years running 10.00 . I went to AFCO fronts and they are night and day better.
I also run a 10.5x29.5 W tire and have for years. It is plenty of tire for your combo. It worked great for me at 10.00 and even better with mine backed up to NSS/B

With a stick you need double adjustable up front. Even if it is a Viking or QA1's. There is no way I would just tighten up the shock on bump and rebound.

It looks like you may have a bit too much travel up front too. I can't see the video.

Very Nice Car

I haven't used tires the same tires but used MT29.5 x 10.5 stiff sidewall and Hoosier 29.0 x 10.5W (also stiff sidewall). Last year at the hot rod reunion (New England) I decided to put new hoosiers on since the MT had about 150 passes. My 60' times were way off. I also tried launching at 5500 and could not get better than 1.45 60'. So on the 2nd day I put the old MTs back on and the 60' dropped to 1.41. I tried it again at Lebanon Valley and saw the same thing. So just went back to the old MTs. Then dropped the launch to 4500 and the 60' dropped down to 1.34

Kind of interesting

I run close to your times, 10.30 at 130 . I just have stock Monro shocks up front, got tired of changing oil pans. Launches with the wheels up as pictured , shift before the 60 foot. 60 ft times are 1.47 . Launch at 4,700 shift at 6,800 3.25 low gear, 4.56 rear with 11.5 29.5 W Hoosiers. Low compression 505 pump gas engine.

On THIS car, with THIS combo...........you can adjust things until the cows come home and NONE of it is going to matter. GET SOME GOOD FRONT SHOCKS.

On the tire thing..........if that is a the size you want, the M/T has no equal

Ok,

I will be ordering new slicks within the next couple of days. Just dont trust these because they are so old. I will order the M/T.

Monty, your point on the shocks is well taken and several people off the board have told me the same thing.

So which shocks to you all recommend.

-Dave

A GOOD double adjustable front shock. Strange, Afco, Santhuff, or similar. Best shock you are willing to pay for