AV GAS

Just curious if any of you folks run it and how it compares to race gas.

Ran it for years in a 12.5:1 440 and never had any problems. Ran as good as VP 110 in that motor.

That's what I have been hearing. .......Thankxx

Been running it for years. Car runs the same as it did on Sunoco 110 . 11.2:1 engine . I always mix in a little Lucas top end lube with it .

Back before I could afford a HEMI, I built like, 12 BB Chevys. Always used the "Bible", How to Build a Big Block Chevy. I wore out the first one. It often quoted Chevy engineers. They RECOMMENDED AV gas if racing gas was not available. I ran it for years, (worked at the airport and took flying lessons). Never had a problem in 12:1 L-88 and LS7s.

I always use to put it in the challenger when I was racing the car. A guy that works on lawnmowers just told me to use it whenever possible instead of pump gas

Should be in Vegas next month and don't want to mess with E 85 so figured I'd try some.

Aviation gas is formulated for low rpm engines at higher altitudes and does not have the BTUs race gas can produce. It sure is better than pump 93 octane that's for sure. It has very different specific gravity also that must be accounted for when tuning. [url=http://www.automotiveu.com/racevsav.htm][/url]
Anyone know what this is?

I'm turning 2300 rpm and it's almost redlined on 100LL!
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b260/challenger19711/After%2012-8-14/IMG_52541.jpg

you are wasting your time

What's the purpose on the upper lube?

AV gas is all I use . Since 95 I have not used anything else . No issues at all . Gary

To be honest , I really dont know. When I made the switch , it was at the recommendation of friends that had been running it for years . They told me to add the lube ,so as a matter of practice, I have always used it .

AV is the only gas that's been in my Hemi.

So do you guy's know someone at the airport? the air ports I've been to have the area all fenced in and you have to go through the building , then through a locked door. If you don't have a plane, you don't get passed that door.

That's what it's like over here now. I used to use it in a 282ci hemi 6 with 12.9 comp, solid lifter engine. Ran Best with 50/50 mix 98pump (your 93) and Av Gas. The motor felt slightly less responsive with straight Av Gas probably because it's a slower burning fuel.

I am calling BS on that, if you look at the piston velocities of a Pratt 4360, its equivalent to a SBC at 8000+ rpms. Its not about RPM's it about piston speed.....and at 4500 foot above sea level altitude, our regular gas is only 85 octane...oh and 130-145 octane avgas burns slower than 100 low lead. Your continental or Lycoming engine with a 5" stroke has a lot of velocity and is running at 85% power for hours on end, not something that a car engine typically does. Tim

Bring some cans and tell them you want to buy some gas, the fuel sellers at the airport need to sell fuel to pay their insurance...Tim

I've been using LL forever.

30% Av to 87 Octane has been working perfect for me.

Why am I using 87 to blend with LL instead of 91? I don't trust that Premium at the pumps is fresh or really premium at all when you hear about the little stories told from guys at the refineries and Truckers that haul it, so I don't bother with it.

The sell E85 at the Rebel stations in Vegas. Tony (70aarcuda) has three race cars running on it. Al might even have a 4500 E85 carb he might sell..... just a thought.

No desire to run E 85 at this point or I would build my own carb but who knows down the road.

Av gas is no problem, I would run it up to about 13 to 1 as is. Add any one of a number of octane boosters with MMT and I might even try it at 15 to 1. Av gas is rated different, it's 100 octane lean, 130 rich. For those that don't believe you really have no understanding of fuel properties. If you look at the characteristics it is almost identical to most 110 fuels. It has to burn very clean so it doesn't leave deposits that could foul plugs, don't want that at 10,000 ft. And that 10,000 ft thing, it as to operate correctly from 0 ft up. Wake up and smell the BS the fuel companies want you to believe...

I agree w/ Mark. I know too many people running it exclusively in some stout motors and they never have any trouble. One even runs it in a 13:1 BB chevy w/ nitrous. Would I do that? No, but he has for years.

As far as getting it...I walk into my local airport carrying my gas jugs. Tell the lady I want some fuel and she walks me out the back door onto the "boarding" area of the pavement where the pump is and asks me how much I want. They won't let you pull your car in there and fill up, but don't mind if you empty your jug into the car right outside the gate, lol.

for taking fuel samples out of wing tanks to look at color and to check for water

As stated aircraft engines hardest job is during take-off so its not a high altitude only fuel, 100ll is very clean and dry and probably qa better than race fuels, 100ll can be found in outside areas of big towns at smaller community airports were you can usually drive up to the pump insert your credit card and buy what you want and is usually couple dollars cheaper than the regional airports, we have it for 4.50/gal and the city airport is about 6.00+ i think you can google av gas prices in your area and it should show the airports around you who have it.

In years gone by, different octanes of AV gas was a different color. So according to the requirement of your engine, you checked to make sure you had the right gas. Now a days, all that is available is 100LL, and as far as top end lube goes, that LL means low lead. Us in the aviation world call it lots of lead. It already lubs the top end, so I don't see the need for any extra lube. But it also causes a lot of problems also, like stuck valves, and leaded up plugs. They are working on a unleaded AV gas so they can get rid of the lead.

The 100LL I've gotten for the last 15 years is a light blue color. NEVER ran any sort of lube or oil w/ it.

Used to be easy to get av gas in vegas, the county took over all the small airports in Clark County. ...and they will not sell it to you

I've used it straight for at least 18 years in everything from a 13.2 to 1 iron headed Max Wedge motor to a 15 to 1 Indy -1 headed 572 that ran 10.0's (tested it back to back at the track and ran EXACTLY the same)...

Good info and that takes care of that since I don't own a plane. Where do you get your race gas from? Thankxxx.......

Don't you own an ultralight? You need to buy fuel for your ultralight (wink wink)

Right on...dusturbd340W5. I am just learning to fly, so you may know more than I do I bet. I have only logged 4.5 hours in the air so far, so I am really "green"

I believe you guys who have used it and have found no difference between it and race fuel. I can't say I have used both back to back to say for sure one way or another.
I do know 100LL is currently at $5.24 gallon around here which is 2.45 cents cheaper than 110 Sunoco leaded.

Thumper I believe a lot guys rent planes and don't own them. I'd call local fuel/oil company's in your area, that who sells race fuel around here.

Or an airboat with a Lycoming or Continental engine, right?

E 85 from the pump from Terrible Herbts...some Terrible Herbst sell 100 unleaded at them..but it is 7.99999 a gallon..

they also have a bulk station at I-15 and Sahara that used to sell 110 leaded cheaper then the 100 unlead...but you have to pump it into a can since it is a "off highway" fuel..no taxes on it..

Mark Hedrix here in town has a very good maghine shop and very good reputation for building top of the line engines here in the northeast Florida area. I talked to him about AV gas two years back as my buddy Michael Williams insited on running it in his pro street 434 stroker s-10. Mark said he also had some customers who swore by the av gas and decided to test it against C16 on his engine dyno. The engine was a 14.5:1 632 big cheif BBC he was building for a customer wanting to run the gas in his mud truck. He tested both fuels in this motor on his engine dyno and told me the c16 only made 5hp more than the av gas and the av gas had no signs of detonation or funny burn patterns. He was surprised how well the fuel actually performaed. He said the only thing he recommends with av gas is add a bottle of lead additive as the av gas is "Low Lead" whihc is what the LL stands for. Also the 100LL here at Herlong airport and that he tested with is more around 110-112 octane. Ran it for two years in buddy S-10 which was a 14.0:1 motor with two stage 400shot of nitrous and never had any issues. As stated you just drive up to the pump with jugs or a drum and fill up with a credit card. Just don't try to fill a car with it at the pump, legally that isn't allowed and will ask you to leave and come back with fuel jugs for your airplane or offroad equipment you are putting it in "wink,wink"

I have taken table spoons of lead out of the plugs when cleaning them, Low Lead is a misnomer, there is about 3 times as much lead in 100LL than what car gas used to contain. I run 10-25% 100LL with alcohol free gas to keep from lead fouling plugs. Tim

You want to use additives with MMT, MMT will actually enhance the leads octane suppression more than adding more lead.

What is MMT?

I've been using 100 unleaded since I freshened up my motor over 3 years ago and love it but it's pricey but whatever I trust it more than pump junk. My Ranger pings on that crap so no way it's going in my Dart. I'll see if I can get some av gas and if not then back to100 it is for now.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methylcyclopentadienyl_manganese_tricarbonyl

NOS, Turbo 108, Lucas, as well as others all have octane booster products with MMT in it.

My Old Girl



Have never ran AV GAS in any vehicle.....just the Luscombe Tail Dragger, But I did discuss it with my engine builder and he advised against it...can't exactly remember why...???

Now my buddy uses his AV Gas in all his lawn equipment to keep the ethanol from eating them up....he lives in an Air Park Community and can get it no problem.....I just get non-ethanol from Sunoco for my Chit

Rickster

That Luscombe will fly on 80/87 octane, almost diesel fuel by todays standards....