Pocket Porting Pics Please

Posted By: Sb Valiant

Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/19/13 04:09 PM

I would like to see some before and after pictures on pocket porting heads. I have some extra time on my hands and since I am inexperienced I'll even just use steel wool and do it by hand if I have too! I've done alittle bit of pocket porting on a junk set of stock heads just to experiment but probaly went over board. It can be any kind of heads but if someone either has small block heads like X,J or W2's that would be even better yet since that's what I run!

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/19/13 04:28 PM

LOL... your never gonna do it with steel wool... your
gonna need a die grinder... I have both electric and
air... I dont think I have any pics of my econo W-2s
but I'll look

Posted By: Cheatham

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/19/13 04:41 PM

go to a machine shop and see if they will give you some old unused heads and use them to practice with

Posted By: Sb Valiant

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/19/13 04:43 PM

LOL thanks Mr P Body I have a little electric die grinder!

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/19/13 06:37 PM

Quote:

LOL thanks Mr P Body I have a little electric die grinder!

I dont mean a Dremel... I have a Dewalt DW660 with
a variable speed adjuster(that unit is a 1/4" shank)...
plus you need burrs to cut with... I have about 20
but I tend to use about 4 the most.... as said...
practice on a JUNK head

Posted By: MPerry

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/19/13 09:23 PM

I'd like to see some pics as well. I plan on getting the porting template kit and doing some big block heads.

I agree your going to be there forever with a dremel.
I have a nice craftsman electric die grinder(1hp if memory serves me). I'll post a picture of it when I get a chance.

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/19/13 09:46 PM

I looked through all my pics... I dont have any of
port work... I guess I forget to take pics(if it wasnt
for my wife I dont know if I would have many pics)

Posted By: sixpackgut

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/19/13 11:43 PM

you need on of these

Attached picture 7553445-398711_572792056068160_72666240_n.jpg

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 12:11 AM

Quote:

you need on of these

Yeah I could use a assistant like that in the shop...
two things would happen... 1... I wouldnt get any
work done.. 2.... I'd be divorced ... LOL

Posted By: LA360

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 12:57 AM

You will need a grinder with a 1/4" shank, a Dremel with a 1/8" shank isn't going to do squat.
Do your port work before you have the valve job finished.
One of the most important thing for a beginner is being able to control the grinder and burr. I have sold heads to a few guys now that tried porting their heads themselves and made a complete mess. It's very easy to ruin a perfectly good head if you're not careful.
As everyone has said, try on a junk W2 before you start. Pictures only show so much, they don't give a true insight into the actual shape

Posted By: Quicksilver440

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 03:08 AM

Quote:

you need on of these

I have one of those

...she doesn't work in the garage with me anymore. 5 Kids has really cut down on how often she can clean my garage too...

Posted By: HotRodDave

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 03:20 AM

I started with a dremell, I think it was a good idea for a beginner as you don't remove material as fast (too fast if your not careful). Now I mostly use carbide bits in my 1/4 inch air grinder. It has a max speed adjuster as well as variable speed depending on how hard you squeeze it. I do still use a Dremmel for polishing the ex port.

Posted By: Sixpak

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 03:36 AM

Go to Harbor Freight and for $15 - $20 get a cheapo air powered die grinder. I'm sure any local flea market will have one too. Or for a couple more bucks get an electric one from Harbor Freight. And then get some carbide cutting bits. Then get a porting template kit.

Posted By: Quicksilver440

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 03:52 AM

If you are going to run an air grinder...make sure you have a good compressor.

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 03:58 AM

Quote:

If you are going to run an air grinder...make sure you have a good compressor.

I have a BIG compressor but I prefer the electric
die grinder.. its a bit heavier but eats less power
and the compressor is noisy when it fires up

Posted By: 67_Satellite

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 02:40 PM

http://www.ebay.com/itm/42-Electric-Flex...=item2a27f0774d I use the Dremel version of one of these. Gives great speed control and a great feel and control. I use an air powered one for the rough "hogging"first. When it comes to the pocket porting less is more would be good advice for a beginner.

Posted By: pittsburghracer

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 02:55 PM

Quote:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/42-Electric-Flex...=item2a27f0774d I use the Dremel version of one of these. Gives great speed control and a great feel and control. I use an air powered one for the rough "hogging"first. When it comes to the pocket porting less is more would be good advice for a beginner.

I use one of those every day in my shop porting heads but I use the one with the higher amp motor and the 44T hand piece (1/4 collet). If you are buying one do some research and piece together the right kit. I never us my air grinders or electric any longer. Plenty of power from start to finish, nice and small to let you get in the tight spots, and way less vibration on the hands. Right now on ebay you can pick up a new hand piece for about 45 dollars plus 6 dollars shipping then wait for a GOOD deal on a used heavy duty woodworking motor.

Posted By: Dean_Kuzluzski

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 03:20 PM

When I used the porting template kit, I used a "thimble sized" carbide cutter to make a cut for each template as it should be clocked. Thimble sized, meaning it's about the size of your pinky and shaped about the same. Another cutter a little smaller gets down between the guide and port wall to run that trough.

After the templates are sunk, I break out the biggest/roundest stone that will fit into the bowl. The law of averages, as I say, will take out metal from the bowl as you keep moving it around to get down to where the template cuts were made.

Some blending of the bowl to the port entry (I just roll the short turn and minimize material removal) and an intake gasket match/blend later.........

Probably not the best approach but it gained me 3 mph through the traps and had more low end grunt too!

Posted By: MrSixpack

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 04:02 PM

A bigger and heavier electric diegrinder eats up a lot of the bad vibrations to.

Posted By: pittsburghracer

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 04:21 PM

Quote:

A bigger and heavier electric diegrinder eats up a lot of the bad vibrations to.

Yaa but its bigger, heavier, and you can't control the speed like the Foredom grinder. When you do this almost every day for hours it makes a big difference. I have both air and a bigger grinder like you use and haven't touched them in several years and don't plan to again.

Posted By: moparguy7074

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 04:28 PM

And still no pics like he wanted...

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 04:39 PM

Quote:

Quote:

A bigger and heavier electric diegrinder eats up a lot of the bad vibrations to.

Yaa but its bigger, heavier, and you can't control the speed like the Foredom grinder. When you do this almost every day for hours it makes a big difference. I have both air and a bigger grinder like you use and haven't touched them in several years and don't plan to again.

I looked at what the guys in the "head lab" at work
used... 95% of it was done with a electrical grinder
that was actually longer than the one I bought...
which was real close to what they used... they had
some cable driven stuff but didnt use it much...
they had controllers to vary speed(usually foot controlled)
but each guy had his preference

Posted By: pittsburghracer

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 04:47 PM

Quote:

And still no pics like he wanted...

I would post some but it may cause him to do more harm than good.

If he uses a stock set of W2's every untouched set that I have had on my flowbench will flow around 260cfm between 500-550 lift and then drop off. In comparison a stock edelbrock small block head maxes out at 243 cfm. They both will flow over 300 cfm but it sure helps to have a bench so you know were and how much to remove. Pictures can help or they can really screw you up. In a 2800# car like he has 260 cfm in the right combo will go 10's.

Posted By: Sb Valiant

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 05:02 PM

Yea I am not going to touch the heads. Like you said it could bring more harm then good. I don't want to chance it and really be screwed!! I would like to learn sometime because it can save me alot of money some day. We most likely weren't going to make the 10's with 2 cylinders having major leakage, headers, carb, and a few other things. But under the right combination like you said it should go in the 10's.

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 05:19 PM

Quote:

Quote:

And still no pics like he wanted...

I would post some but it may cause him to do more harm than good.
If he uses a stock set of W2's every untouched set that I have had on my flowbench will flow around 260cfm between 500-550 lift and then drop off. In comparison a stock edelbrock small block head maxes out at 243 cfm. They both will flow over 300 cfm but it sure helps to have a bench so you know were and how much to remove. Pictures can help or they can really screw you up. In a 2800# car like he has 260 cfm in the right combo will go 10's.

If you can show him some minor bowl work it should
help him alot(I dont have an pics) and we know that
most of the HP increase is done right in the bowl
so if he can just touch up some of the bowl it would
help him alot.... the cast W-2s were pretty bad with
casting crap in the bowls and in the runners... all
he needs to do is knock off the tree limbs to help alot

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 05:39 PM

Let me try to explain some simple characteristics here
first.. water and air have ALOT of the same flow
characteristics.... they dont like to turn... look at
a flowing river and where the deep water is in a curve
in the river... its the outer radius... this is the
reason all these new heads have raised ports, its
trying to make a straighter run.... the short turn in
the head has water under it so you cant eliminate
that corner... then the air makes the big turn in
the bowl and if you look at the area near the seat
(just below it) there is usually a lip there.. thats
the a damn which hurts.... also understand that the
air is going into the cyl because the piston created
a NEGATIVE pressure(some call it a vacuum) but the
atmospheric pressure it pushing into the negative
pressure zone.... ok that class 101

Posted By: Sb Valiant

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 06:00 PM

That's a very good explanation that I can deffiently understand! Thanks Mr P Body

Posted By: Clanton

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 07:10 PM

I just took my iron heads off and will post some pics in a few minutes no problem.I need to take the springs off so you can see the bowls.

Attached picture 7554490-Picture659.jpg

Posted By: Adobedude

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 07:41 PM

I'll bite. My Magnum R/T heads, I did not do the porting.

Posted By: Clanton

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 07:42 PM

exh

Posted By: Clanton

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 07:52 PM

int

Posted By: Clanton

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 07:55 PM

exh exit

Posted By: 451Mopar

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 08:05 PM

Here is a side-by-side photo of bowl ported (left) and unported (right) 360 heads. The heads were just 360 heads from Aerohead (unported) with the 2.02"/1.60" valves.
You can see alot of material was removed. Wear gloves, a dust mask and grinding shield as it makes a huge mess. Other mods done to the heads was to cut the seats for dual springs, enlarge the bolt hole where the oil comes up to the rockers (used head studs), and clearance the pushrod holes for 1.6:1 rocker arms.

Attached picture 7554551-360heads_1.jpg

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 08:10 PM

I found 1 pic but this is my W-9 not the W-2 I was
hoping I had.. this was done by a very well know
head porter... if you notice the lead into the stem
and the back of it is well tapered... back to class
101... think of a sail boat moving through the water...
it doesnt create a wake... it moves the water out of
the way then lets it slip back into place... no turbulence
like on the stern of a power boat

Attached picture 7554557-cylinderHead003Small.jpg

Posted By: Sb Valiant

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 08:10 PM

Thank you guys so much for all of the info and great pictures!!

Posted By: VernMotor

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 09:25 PM

Click on this link there are 40 pictures of ports and heads. all Big block stuff but you will get the idea.

http://s241.photobucket.com/albums/ff92/vernmotor/Cy%20heads/

Posted By: pittsburghracer

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 09:37 PM

Not sure why but I can't load photos on my photobucket account today but here are some Chevy Dart Platinum heads I did a couple of years ago.

This is a set of Chevy AFR small block heads I just finished and my son (whiskeyrunner) just installed on a S 10 truck.

Those heads came to me after a customer bought them CNC'd and was disappointed in the flow numbers. I picked him up about 20-25cfm.

Posted By: pittsburghracer

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 09:43 PM

Sorry I don't have any finished pictures of the set of econo Ws's I had on my car but here are some during the porting stages.

Attached picture 7554690-John'sW2heads001.JPG

Attached picture 7554690-John'sW2heads001.JPG

Posted By: pittsburghracer

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 09:44 PM

Attached picture 7554691-John'sW2heads002.JPG

Posted By: pittsburghracer

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 09:50 PM

Attached picture 7554698-John'sW2heads003.JPG

Posted By: pittsburghracer

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 09:52 PM

Attached picture 7554699-John'sW2heads007.JPG

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 09:58 PM

At least now he has a idea of what they should look
like instead of guessing at it.... thanks guys for
posting some pics... I'm SURE it'll help him....
we gotta help out the kids...... same as when we were
young and learning

Posted By: Hot 340

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 10:03 PM

Posted By: Hot 340

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 10:04 PM

Posted By: Hot 340

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/20/13 10:04 PM

Posted By: The Shocker

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/21/13 12:23 AM

My Econo W2's.I mainly just removed the casting marks and lines.I also worked on the "short turn" sum ,widdled down the pushrod pinch and gasket matched them .BTW , i used a regular Dewalt drill even though i have a die grinder.I just prefer to use it with diamond carbide bits ...

Attached picture 7554853-004.JPG

Posted By: The Shocker

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/21/13 12:24 AM

Another pic ...

Attached picture 7554856-003.JPG

Posted By: 67_Satellite

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/21/13 01:36 AM

Air wants to go around as large a radius as possible.A huge bowl opened up to a vertical(90deg) angle right up to the seat diameter doesn't help flow as much as the increase in area would lead you to believe. Keep the throat diameter at 85-88% of the seat.Give the air a gradual turn to go around.This is the reason for all of the multiple angles on valve jobs, to create a radius from bowl to seat.

Posted By: 340_Dart

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/21/13 01:41 AM

Why don't you give Brett Miller (W5Dart66) a call and see what he can do for you. He'll be able to set your heads up for you and do what port/ machine work you want to do. PM me if you want his number. -Andy

Posted By: WHITEDART

Re: Pocket Porting Pics Please - 01/21/13 04:17 AM

Quote:

Why don't you give Brett Miller (W5Dart66) a call and see what he can do for you. He'll be able to set your heads up for you and do what port/ machine work you want to do. PM me if you want his number. -Andy