towing a racecar

Posted By: actionange

towing a racecar - 05/27/12 01:48 PM

After MANY years of towing I was stopped yesterday by the MA DOT. I've a Dodge Ram 2500 with 24 ft enclosed trailer. It was told to me that since I have a combined GVW over 10,000 lbs and traveling from CT to NY through MA I was required to obtain a DOT number and put my name on both sides of the truck. I explained that I'm a hobby racer and have been for years. He said that if I win money racing and travel interstate that constitutes "interstate commerce" and I have to register with the DOT.
Can someone shed some light on this please?

Posted By: cudaboy

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 01:54 PM

But you don't race for money, you just go to test and tune, right? Not sure if he is even correct though.

Dennis

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 02:39 PM

Sorry I cant help BUT this is why I dont like to travel
to other states... seems that the rules change from
state to state... in Mich we have a permanent that
has no weight rating and SOME states require it to
have a weight rating on the truck and/or trailer

Posted By: Evil Spirit

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 02:57 PM

Mi is supposed to be going back to the sliding scale - the more weight/bigger trailer, the higher fees.

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 03:03 PM

Quote:

Mi is supposed to be going back to the sliding scale - the more weight/bigger trailer, the higher fees.

Sure isnt gonna help me... I have 4 permanent plates

Posted By: Evil Spirit

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 03:15 PM

Treat them and the trailers they are on like gold - the permanent plates aren't transferable. At least that's what they told me when I switched utility trailers.

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 03:19 PM

Quote:

Treat them and the trailers they are on like gold - the permanent plates aren't transferable. At least that's what they told me when I switched utility trailers.

Your correct.. its for that trailer only
EDIT
its sorta nice that of the 11 trailers I have...
all but 3 have home built on the title/registration
so IF I wanted I could(but never would)change the
plate to the other home made trailers... I have a
dump trailer that has its own plate along with a
little 10' enclosed and a travel trailer

Posted By: Evil Spirit

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 03:27 PM

I went from an 8x8 snowmobile trailer: 1500LBS, 64SQ/FT - to a 9x7 utility trailer: 1500LBS, 63SQ/FT and had to buy a new plate. ButtMunchingAzzWeasels...

Posted By: pittsburghracer

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 03:33 PM

Here's a good post made by Bob George that is in the tech archive's.
https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/show...e=1#Post4611784

Posted By: jamesc

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 03:54 PM

Quote:

Can someone shed some light on this please?

my response would overload the moparts filters

government completely out of control

Posted By: dmking

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 04:05 PM

in pa there is a thing about if a trailer is over 10,000gvw you need a combo licence for truck and trailer. pisses off the rv guys cause the 5th wheel rvs can be 12,000gvw. but the rv guys never get hit so there is either a huge gray area for the rv world or the state cops do not care as of yet.
no rv guy i know with the huge 5th wheel has a combo licence. they get away with it.

Posted By: Blucuda413

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 04:10 PM

Food for thought: The below was taken from the Federal guidance book on how to interpret the DOT rules.

"Question 21: Does the exemption in �390.3(f)(3) for the ��occasional transportation of personal property by individuals not for compensation nor in the furtherance of a commercial enterprise�� apply to persons who occasionally use CMVs to transport cars, boats, horses, etc., to races, tournaments, shows or similar events, even if prize money is offered at these events?

Guidance: The exemption would apply to this kind of transportation, provided: (1) The underlying activities are not undertaken for profit, i.e., (a) prize money is declared as ordinary income for tax purposes, and (b) the cost of the underlying activities is not deducted as a business expense for tax purposes; and, where relevant; (2) corporate sponsorship is not involved. Drivers must confer with their State of licensure to determine the licensing provisions to which they are subject."

This interpretation may not can be used with a police officer but it definitely can be used in court.

I don't think the 10,000 pound rule is a Federal rule. And only Federal rules can restrict interstate commerce. States have no right to pass laws having to do with interstate commerce. That is given to the Federal govt by the Constitution. Hopefully he gave you a reference to the 10,000 pound rule. I would love to read it

Posted By: hemi-itis

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 04:26 PM

DOT rules are federal and supposed to be uniform throughout the states,but the states can have other rules over and above the DOT.The keyword is commerce,so when they ask if you make money,laugh at the officer and tell him how much you LOOSE every year.
The other issue is the way a person registers thier tow vehicle.I know some cheapazz guys that register the vehicle as the curb weight instead of the MAX weight and put passenger plates on instead of Commercial plates to save a coupla bucks.If you get pulled into a DOT stop,your likley to get an OVERWEIGHT ticket if your pullin your trailer.
Check with your local DMV & DOT and look at the rules to determine what's best for you.

Also do a search here,we have debated this topic before

Posted By: Blucuda413

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 04:39 PM

You're right, most states incorporated the DOT published rules by reference into law. States can definitely tighten the DOT rules by state law but they can't make them looser. I'll bet most officers don't even know about the interpretation but a judge could certainly determine it's applicability. To prove some of your status would take significant documentation that you definitely wouldn't have with you on the road.

Definitely the bad thing is it's getting worse and worse and we definitely won't hear the end of it.

Posted By: slantzilla

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 04:43 PM

states are just as broke as the federal gubbamint and looking everywhere they can for $$$$$$.

Screwing with someone out of area/state makes for an easier target than a local.

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 04:52 PM

Thats the thing... I'm compliant in Mi but in other
states I might not be... the rules state that you must
be compliant in YOUR STATE which you would think is
fine for the other states... I believe in PA you must
have a weight on both the truck and trailer plate...
we dont even offer such a thing here in Mi

Posted By: dusturbd340W5

Re: towing a racecar - 05/27/12 11:56 PM

Quote:

Thats the thing... I'm compliant in Mi but in other
states I might not be... the rules state that you must
be compliant in YOUR STATE which you would think is
fine for the other states... I believe in PA you must
have a weight on both the truck and trailer plate...
we dont even offer such a thing here in Mi

correct,if you are legal in your state they are not supposed to mess with you,example in Fl we only have 1 plate on the rear of a vehicle but we can travel into states that require plates front and rear with out getting a ticket.

Posted By: BloFish

Re: towing a racecar - 05/28/12 02:21 AM

Shed some light, sorry can't do that. The future is looking dim

Posted By: HEMIFRED

Re: towing a racecar - 05/28/12 06:35 AM

the officer needs read the Federal law and to pay attention to the "Guidance " ( common sense)offered and recommended by the law makers. I carry a copy

Quote:

uestion 21: Does the exemption in �390.3(f)(3) for the ��occasional transportation of personal property by individuals not for compensation nor in the furtherance of a commercial enterprise�� apply to persons who occasionally use CMVs to transport cars, boats, horses, etc., to races, tournaments, shows or similar events, even if prize money is offered at these events?

Guidance: The exemption would apply to this kind of transportation, provided: (1) The underlying activities are not undertaken for profit, i.e., (a) prize money is declared as ordinary income for tax purposes, and (b) the cost of the underlying activities is not deducted as a business expense for tax purposes; and, where relevant; (2) corporate sponsorship is not involved. Drivers must confer with their State of licensure to determine the licensing provisions to which they are subject.

Posted By: SCDaytona

Re: towing a racecar - 06/08/12 08:49 PM

Quote:

After MANY years of towing I was stopped yesterday by the MA DOT. I've a Dodge Ram 2500 with 24 ft enclosed trailer. It was told to me that since I have a combined GVW over 10,000 lbs and traveling from CT to NY through MA I was required to obtain a DOT number and put my name on both sides of the truck. I explained that I'm a hobby racer and have been for years. He said that if I win money racing and travel interstate that constitutes "interstate commerce" and I have to register with the DOT.
Can someone shed some light on this please?

Did he give you a ticket? I tow up to LVD through Mass. and have never been stopped.

Posted By: Guitar Jones

Re: towing a racecar - 06/08/12 09:19 PM

I'm way over 10,000 pounds. The trailer loaded alone is about 14,000 plus the truck is 8000. That still puts me under the 26,000 GCVWR for a CDL, although I do have a class A CDL. I also have "NOT FOR HIRE" on both sides of the trailer so they know it's not a commercial enterprise. So if I don't need a CDL why would I need a DOT number? It doesn't make sense. Cops aren't always right you know. If you got a ticket I'd take it to court.

Posted By: jamesc

Re: towing a racecar - 06/08/12 09:22 PM

Quote:

Cops aren't always right you know.

that is true but hard to "prove"

Posted By: actionange

Re: towing a racecar - 06/08/12 09:27 PM

Quote:

Quote:

After MANY years of towing I was stopped yesterday by the MA DOT. I've a Dodge Ram 2500 with 24 ft enclosed trailer. It was told to me that since I have a combined GVW over 10,000 lbs and traveling from CT to NY through MA I was required to obtain a DOT number and put my name on both sides of the truck. I explained that I'm a hobby racer and have been for years. He said that if I win money racing and travel interstate that constitutes "interstate commerce" and I have to register with the DOT.
Can someone shed some light on this please?

Did he give you a ticket? I tow up to LVD through Mass. and have never been stopped.

I've been towing up there for 25 years and this was the 1st time I was ever stopped. No ticket was issued. Just a little speech.
He must've been bored or pissed that he had to work on Memorial day weekend so he pulled me over.
I putting "NOT FOR HIRE" on the truck and trailer before my next trip so we'll see what happens then.

Posted By: Guitar Jones

Re: towing a racecar - 06/08/12 09:33 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Cops aren't always right you know.

that is true but hard to "prove"

That's what lawyers are for.