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Predator Starter drag even with16V

Posted By: camastomcat

Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 07:09 PM

Anybody out there have this problem with 15.75-1 compression and 604CI? I'm afraid it's going to be hard to get enough charge in it between rounds. I'm sure spring tension has a lot to do with it, but I have another starter even though the one I have is suppossed to be abke to handle 18-1 compression.
Posted By: mopdragster

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 07:20 PM

Is it slow to crank with ignition off or only when you throw the fire to it? My 15-1 b-1 motor would get a little hard to crank whe you put the ignition to it and at 25 degrees of start retard it would back fire badly I ended up with 10 degrees start retard seemed to be perfect. Mine has 350lbs on the seat and about 900 open so it has big springs as well. probaobly not as big as predator but close.
Posted By: sg66mopar

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 07:24 PM

Tom, silly question but you HAVE checked the condition of your battery, right?
Posted By: ProStDodge

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 07:36 PM

Add another ground! (just a guess - but often cures such problems)
Posted By: boatracer572

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 07:59 PM

Hey Tom, i had the same problem years ago.I dont know how your dragster is wired,if you have a starter selinoid,take it out and throw it as far as you can! hook the battery cable to the starter,and a small wire from the starter button (12 or 16v) to the starter. fixed my prob.
Tony

Attached picture 6988558-mikegeephotos-lake%20elsinore%20njba%202011-2169-X2.jpg
Posted By: camastomcat

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 08:36 PM

Quote:

Is it slow to crank with ignition off or only when you throw the fire to it? My 15-1 b-1 motor would get a little hard to crank whe you put the ignition to it and at 25 degrees of start retard it would back fire badly I ended up with 10 degrees start retard seemed to be perfect. Mine has 350lbs on the seat and about 900 open so it has big springs as well. probaobly not as big as predator but close.



My 572 B-1 turned over like a dream compared to this.
Posted By: camastomcat

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 08:39 PM

Quote:

Tom, silly question but you HAVE checked the condition of your battery, right?



I did charge it before even fired it Dick. I just wonder if my Starter is getting weak. I have a McRobb starter in the trailer, and I'll have to look at what Boatracer said too.
Posted By: jamesc

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 08:43 PM

Tony how do you get that montser to hook up with those little bitty tires?
Posted By: Dodgeguy101

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 08:54 PM

Quote:

Tony how do you get that montser to hook up with those little bitty tires?



Well, he does have 4 of them..
Posted By: MRMOPAR622

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 11:01 PM

On my aluminum block I run a # 4 welding cable from each head to the side of my block then back to the battery as per MSD. I done this for the ignition,but it really helped on the cranking. Also I had a power Master 16 volt battery that done the same thing yours is doing,after it started going bad. Try a good strong 12 volt battery out of your truck or car,before changing out the starter.
Posted By: camastomcat

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 11:04 PM

Quote:

On my aluminum block I run a # 4 welding cable from each head to the side of my block then back to the battery as per MSD. I done this for the ignition,but it really helped on the cranking. Also I had a power Master 16 volt battery that done the same thing yours is doing,after it started going bad. Try a good strong 12 volt battery out of your truck or car,before changing out the starter.



Thanks for the input guys. I actually have another new 16V battery, and am planning on running another ground cable as suggested. I guess I could run 2 in series, if I needed to?
Posted By: Al_Alguire

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 11:13 PM

Tom my B1 is about 15-1 and we have 400lbs on the seat and no issues. It used to have a Mopar mini on it nad now has a CSR starter due to me dropping the mini and all I could find at the track was a CSR. Been trouble free though.

The 99 Hemi is not quite as much compression but the springs are 510lbs on the seat and have no issues with it at all.

Both cars are 16 Volt. The silver car has Turbo start stuff with no alternator. The orange/gray car has XS Power stuff and an alternator. Wonder if maybe you have abad cell in the battery?
Posted By: jamesc

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 11:32 PM

before you go changing anything i would do a voltage drop test with a quality DVM. this will show you where the losses are and if that is the cause or part of the problem. is the starter pinion in proper mesh with the ring gear?

on start retards i learned the hard way that more retard isn't necessarily better (like i "thought" it would be). with a locked distributor and crank trigger you can back the timing up to the point where it starts firing the wrong cylinder...yea this causes problems.

as for spring tension remember that the lobe has two sides a noteworthy amount of that energy is returned when the valve is closing.

Quote:

I guess I could run 2 in series, if I needed to?



32 volts...GET ER DONE, i know you meant parallel
Posted By: camastomcat

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 11:51 PM

Quote:

before you go changing anything i would do a voltage drop test with a quality DVM. this will show you where the losses are and if that is the cause or part of the problem. is the starter pinion in proper mesh with the ring gear?

on start retards i learned the hard way that more retard isn't necessarily better (like i "thought" it would be). with a locked distributor and crank trigger you can back the timing up to the point where it starts firing the wrong cylinder...yea this causes problems.

as for spring tension remember that the lobe has two sides a noteworthy amount of that energy is returned when the valve is closing.

Quote:

I guess I could run 2 in series, if I needed to?



32 volts...GET ER DONE, i know you meant parallel



I would only run 2 batteries as a last resort, and pos to pos and neg to neg wiring if I were to go that way. Is that parallel? I'll look into the dead cell battery thing, the extra neg. cable to the battery, and my different starter before doing anything else. I will say that trying to turn it over by hand is a biatch!
Posted By: jamesc

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/28/11 11:58 PM

yea that's parallel. check your basics before you get too carried away changing things. i was really surprised when i was doing a voltage drop test recently on the transbrake circuit of my new car. iirc it was losing around 3.5 volts between the battery and the solenoid which is huge. i went out and checked the old car, it was as bad if not worse and that brake has never once failed to set. now when it comes to cranking a big high CR engine things can really be a pita
Posted By: sg66mopar

Re: Predator Starter drag even with16V - 12/29/11 12:01 AM




I will say that trying to turn it over by hand is a biatch!



By HAND You plannin' to wrap a rope around the dampener and give it a yank?

My kick back and hard crank problems went away this year when we got rid of the "nitrous" cam and went with one Dan (performance only) ordered me from Bullet. Car went a "little" faster too.
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