Edited - truck purchased and here now. :-)

I'll be shopping for a 4-wheel drive used Dodge 2500 with Cummins / 5-speed soon, so what are the best years to look at?

Thanks!

Probably whatever year you can find. Those things aren't a dime dozen and expect to pay the price for it.

Ive been told BR body style

1999 to 2001

Power is never a concern, usually the question is fuel mileage:

For fuel mileage if you can find a First Gen with 3.08's is the best.
Second choice is 3.54's and those are available all the way to '02.

The 02's and prior are the most reliable engine-wise, but there are issues with the 5 speed reliability.

Despite the complete BS that gets printed on here, it's common knowledge in the Dodge Diesel community that the 03's and up common rails are reliability nightmares and fuel hogs. 3.73 gears are the reason fuel mileage took a dump. The common rail problems and schitt mileage are openly admitted from Cummins (I deal with them a lot). It sounds like Dodge addressed all the complaining did something about the fuel mileage and went back to a 3.42 diff.

What are you planning to use it for?

Use will be for a work truck, commuter for my construction job.

Occasional snow plow and car trailer towing also.

If MPG seems excessive, there is a local 4x4 place that does gear swaps all the time, so thank you for that info.

I'll try to save you a lot of unnecessary expense and suggest a gas pot.

A diesel is not a commuter vehicle: they need several miles (like 20) in the winter for full warm up, and no, idling for half an hour in the morning does not warm them up. Unfortunately with renting (leasing) new vehicles, many Wanna-be Truck Drivers park a new diesel in their driveway to impress the Neighbors and use them to drive 2 miles to Home Depot or 2 miles to their job. This absolutely effs these trucks up and it does not show up until you the second-hand buyer gets it. A guy I worked with this winter, hid Dad got one of these units....................$13,000.00 in two repair bills and the truck only had 80,000 miles on it. I laughed when he told me the story.

Barry: You have helped a lot of people on this forum including myself, so I'm just trying to pay it forward to you: it's too much to get into, but I'll cut right to the point: don't buy diesel.

A 6.4 Power Wagon, or 360/V10 2nd Gen is all the truck you will ever need. I pull E-Bodies on my open car-hauler with a 360 Magnum like they ain't even there. I've pulled 5400 pound QC 4x4 2Gens on the same car hauler and the 360 can still do it. Do I get passed by a Cummins? Yes. Am I paying $15,000.00 for the engine/trans and 45 cents a gallon more for diesel? No. Do I miss my Cummins diesels? Not in the least bit.

I have a 1998 12 valve 5-spd, a 2010 6.7 automatic, and have had a 2001 manual and a 2005 manual. The only ones that get (got) reasonable mileage is the '98 and the '01. The '98 can reliably pull down 18-20. The NV4500 did the traditional 5th gear failure but there are good fixes out there. On a good day the '10 6.7 might, might, get about 14 mpg on the highway turning about 1900 rpm. Power out the wazoo but you pay for it. If I was going to do straight highway hauling I'd still go with the Cummins, but for around town and short trip, I'm with Grizzly, a gas rig makes more sense.

(Notice I haven't even mention DEF which is another drawback to the current versions)

The 5-speeds are junk, buy a 6-speed NV5600 to save yourself major downtime. 2000-2002 are the only years you want. I didn't like the G56 Mercedes 6-speed in the common rail trucks either, went through a few of them too... But I am with Griz too, just turned 206K on my 2015 5.7 4x4 2500 and tow constantly with it, I will never go back to a diesel unless it is a steal. I know where a 2wd regular cab 3500 is that has the NV5600 and 300K miles and it is $5K, that may be cheap enough for me to take another chance...

rDART ... if you don’t move on it I would appreciate the referral ... definitely a 2wd for me as long as it has a suregrip!

I'd be happy with 10 mpg, so anything beyond that would be a bonus.

My last Cummins was in a 72 passenger school bus I converted to a motor home for the move here to PA, loved that rig, it did have an Allison automatic though.

My typical commute is 45 minutes or more at job sites all over PA and there will be times I'll need to pull big loads.

In cold weather I can plug in the block heater.

In nice weather I am not at all opposed to driving one of the 50 year old cars.

Any thoughts on the older 1st generations Cummins trucks and do the 3500s use the same gear box as the 2500s?

Thanks for all the thoughts so far, I also had a V-10 '99 with the 5 seed and loved it.

based on what you want it for I agree, a Gas motor truck would serve you well. And if you dont mind 10mpg ( loaded or empty ) a V10 would be perfect.
There was a V10 5 spd truck just advertised out here for about $5000????? ( don't know if it sold or not as I really want a 1500 and auto )


Diesels out here command decent money, regardless of model year.

But deals do pop up from time to time.
Just a few weeks back there was a 1999 quad cab , 2wd Diesel Auto. white truck with grey interior. I think miles was around 175k. 'Listed for $6900 and was gone same day. As a general rule something similar gets advertised at $10k and up

Ive been watching for a clean truck for my next daily driver. And I would prefer a clean 1998 to 2001 quad cab 2wd auto . Trust me out here clean gas motor trucks of similar years pull $4k easily.
Im not really after a diesel truck per say, But If I had seen that cummins truck sooner I would have gave it some serious thought

I spent over 7 hours on the road today, went to look at a truck and got the deal done.

I have a ride arranged for next weekend to go get it and bring it home.

Former fire department brush rig with only 44K miles, dings and so on but no rot.

It is a first generation D350 5-speed 4x4 with a limited slip rear, 4.10 gears. It gets 21.5 MPG.

At some point I'll likely swap the gears out for something less aggressive, but I'll drive it for a while first just to see how I like it.

So it's a W350? Is it a dually? Has the Getrag trans. Sounds like a decent truck but you know we need pics!

Yes to W350 and yes to dually.

I had my camera but I was having too much fun to take photos.

So next weekend when I get it home for pics.

Sure it does.

Any credibility you ever had............gone.

Really? That is what the seller told me and everything else he told me was spot on.

I will check it myself just for fun though.

He has a farm and the gooseneck was added to haul hay, so it was not on the highway much & I have no reason to doubt his statement.

If you know him to be a liar, please by all means send me an email with what you know about his honesty?

Gotcha, he hauls hay with it at 21.5mpg, should do 45mpg without that trailer behind it. lol, good one buddy.

I had a 92 for awhile that was a total beater with over 300,000 miles on it. It ran great and while the speedometer and odometer didn't work well enough to figure the MPG it seemed like it went FOREVER on a tank of fuel. I wouldn't doubt 20+MPG empty at 65-70MPH. Remember those 1st gens only had 160 horsepower.

You are the one full of sh!t. I've made 4, 1600 mile round trips from FL to WV in my 1st Gen. Hauling loads up and returning to FL empty. My truck gets 22MPG rolling down the highway at 80 MPH. On the last run back to FL it turned over 300,000 miles. It just made it's last trip up to WV yesterday. I could squeak out 25-26 MPG with my old 89 D350 5 speed.

Owned two First Gens and three Second Gens.......best one of the lot did 16mpg with 3.54's and a 60hp Edge chip. Additionally, I deal with a ton of people that run these trucks and they all get the same mileage as I did.

The odd person who needs to justify the 50 grand they just blew on a Cummins and 45 cent a gallon more for diesel will claim 20 to 35 mpg like a few on here, but all of us true Diesel Guys know they are full of it. There is also that other faction that after getting 9mpg out of a 454 or 460, and now getting 15mpg out of a Cummins feels like winning the lottery. Yes, a 50% improvement over a big block gas is huge, but it sure as hell isn't 32mpg like some of you have claimed on here in the past.

Guitar, you might as well add the house you were pulling behind you at 80mph and got 22mpg and ruin your credibility with me too.

Real World Cummins Fuel Mileage

I'll tell you what dude. I will bet you any amount of money you want to, you can come here and we will drive it and do the math. My truck gets 22 MPG just like I said. That isn't towing, that is empty. My 89 did exactly what I said it does all highway figures mind you. I've owned an 07 GMC Duramax crew dually 4WD that got 15 at best when it wasn't cleaning the DPF (down to 9 then) and an 06 Ram 2500 short bed quad 4WD that got pretty much 14 around town and if you were nice to it you could squeak out 20 on the highway. None of these figures are towing mind you. I checked the fuel mileage loaded on the first trip here towing my 2700 pound open car trailer loaded with all my tools and shop equipment and it was getting right at 14. The second trip loaded with more stuff and my crew cab on the trailer it got less but I didn't bother to check the mileage. It was heavy though. Pulling the 7 mile 5% grade when I first hit Virginia, the EGTs were over 1200, the temp gauge was past the normal range and I had to take it out of O/D and lockup. I was doing about 45 MPH by the time I got to the top of the mountain and it was struggling. 3900' elevation though.
I don't know what those guys are doing with their trucks to get that crappy of fuel mileage but it isn't just driving them. Maybe they tow mobile homes with them but you would have to really try to get that bad of fuel mileage.

You're on, I'll take your bet.

How about we do a once up and once back, unloaded both trucks, I'll lead there you lead back, 150 miles minimum. My '01 360 Magnum I'll put it at 16 mpg at 60 mph, 14 mpg at 70 mph, or 12 mpg at 80 mph. You come to my area, I have real mountains out West, not those Gopher hills you call mountains out East.

Have you at 22mpg at 80 mph..........closest to their stated numbers wins. You wanna put your money where your mouth is?

Since you said any amount, lets go $2000.00

lol, I know my truck gets 22 here on the east coast, out there I don't know. Going back to FL from here there is only about 200 miles of mountains. I don't know where you live but I'm not driving across the country to prove my point. Like I said, I don't know what those guys are doing with their trucks to get such crappy numbers, and it doesn't have any explanation as to what they do with them either, only that it is an average of many fill ups. I know there are guys that tow very heavy with them and that will certainly reduce the mileage and over many fill ups will bring the numbers down. But hey if you want to come here I'll take your $2000 bet. We will fill up my truck, hit the highway for a tankful (about 400 miles, and still have some left) and then we can refill it and crunch the numbers.

Here we go, here come the excuses. Should we all move out there for the +10 mpg better air? I'm in.




Gotcha.

How about I crunch the numbers? You have a 30 gallon tank, same as the First Gen I had, ("some left", so, 26 gallons), 400 miles divided by 26 gallons is 15.4 mpg.

15.4 mpg is a long way from the "25 to 26" you claim above, but a lot closer to the Fuelly site I quoted above.

I'll save you the trip here: you can just send me the $2000.00

How about this........

Since my post somehow sparked a rivalry among other members......

This is my proposal;

I will top up the tank in the truck when I pick it up.

I will record the mileage.

I will drive the truck until the gauge shows a low reading, then fill the tank again and record the mileage.

Then I will post the details.

Can everyone agree to be copacetic with that?

You are one miserable old SOB. I said my truck can get 22 MPG, you basically called me a liar. Well I offered to prove it by betting anything you wanted to bet, to come here and I'll prove it to you. You are the one with the excuses, who cares what you Magnum truck gets, you opened your mouth, called a bunch of people liars and now you want me to come there to prove it to you? You know what you can do to yourself. Put up or shutup or just send me the money now to avoid embarrassing yourself further. BTW what does 400 miles and 18 gallons of fuel (still a 1/4 tank left) equal genious?

Oh well.

I tried.

He isn't going to believe you anymore than he believes me. I can prove it though. I really don't care if he believes me or not but if he really wants to know, the offer is open. But trust me, he doesn't.

I have had many of the Cummins diesel 4x4 trucks I will post the years and mileage it would get if driven on the highway.
1989 W-250 Auto 3.07 gear. 22mpg
1990 W-250 Auto 20 plus mpg
1991 W-250 Auto 20 plus mpg
1992 W-250 Auto 20 plus mpg
2002 2500 4x4 Auto 24mpg 50 mph. dropped about 2mpg for every 5 mph. One at 75 mph it pretty much leveled out at 17mpg drove it 150K.
1995 3500 Dually with a dump 5 speed 17 mpg at speeds about 60 mph. I still have this truck.

Calling you a Liar? I guess, since twice in one thread you've LIED. I guess now I can call you a Welcher while I'm at it.

I'm not miserable, I just don't BS fuel mileage numbers. I have nothing to gain by doing it and neither does anyone else. The OP is going to first need a Chiropractor appointment after the 7 hour trip, secondly, be awful disappointed when that ugly tractor gets 12 mpg, and thirdly, invest in a quality pair of hearing protection.

Carry on, I've had enough of the Fairy Tales for one day. Things are improving around here, 10 years ago Members used to claim 32 mpg, I guess now we are at 22 mpg; 10 years from now it might get to 15mpg.

Don't bother, I've owned a few of them, I know what they get.

Do it.

See Barry he won't believe you either. He just can't fathom that anyone else knows something or can do something he can't. If he would have read a little further down he would see my truck is not stock. I worked to get those numbers out of my trucks and make them run very well at the same time. My truck is no slouch. Is it noisy inside, yes. Does it ride rough, yes. But it does what I said if does whether he believes it or not. I don't have any reason to lie about it, I'm the one paying the fuel bill not him.
And Grizzly, Plankton is a very fitting avatar for you, everything you do is a failure no matter how hard you try. You never win. I offered to bet you any amount of money you wanted, and this must be the part you missed, you come here, we fill my truck, drive it down the highway, fill it back up and we crunch the numbers but no, you want to include your truck (why I don't know as your trucks mileage was never a topic of discussion) and have me drive out west to you. That was not the original offer so I am done with you.

I included my truck because I will hit my stated mileage number, and my stated Cummins numbers will be within 5% on YOUR truck. It's more about who is telling truth around here about what a Cummins gets for fuel mileage, like 6pakBee and Rhino.

Really sad that you are resorting to reducing my character, but only proves you've lost out to someone who tells the truth. Everytime this comes up I get PM's from other Cummins Owners saying "thank-you for telling it like it it". They know better than to argue with you Delusional, wanna-be truck drivers.

It's all here for the WWW to see and judge for themselves, Guitar, too bad it was you this time: I had a lot of respect for you.

Now, where do I get a windshield wiper motor restored? Who makes the best hot air kit for my ________? I found a crack in one of my tires, should I replace all 4?

Why would I want to waste $2000 if my truck won't do what I said it would? Think about it. The answer is simple, I know my truck will. Easy pickin's for me from someone that can't believe that others may actually know how to tune a diesel. Done, believe whatever you want.

Everything went well today!

The truck drives awesome.

I topped up the tank on the way home and reset the trip meter, then took a photo.

That station is 20.5 miles from the house.

I let the truck sit for 7 hours then checked the tire pressures, all were low, one by 11 pounds, the rest were less than that, one only 3 pounds low.

I topped up the PSI to equal them out.

I'll report back on the mileage after the next fill up.

My current commute ranges between posted speed limits from 25 to 65 MPH and it is about 45 minutes each way depending on any traffic concerns.

That said, here it is at home. :-)

Nice looking truck. You do not see them that nice to often.How many miles did you drive it?

So, you drove it 7 hours to get it home, is this correct?

Facts can be important, what I actually said was;



Sitting to cool off to check tire pressures does not equal 'drove' time in this case. ;-)

I also know that tire pressures can affect mileage, so worth the effort to remain factual.

Well unlike others, I do actually read what gets typed on here.

Answer the question, did you drive it 7 hours or not?

If he had drove 7 hours there and back to look at it previously, wouldn’t his driving it home after someone drove him there today to get it be ~3-1/2 hours?
Cool truck by the way Barry.

Nice! So it's a non intercooled truck. I think they do better than the intercooled ones personally. The intercooler wasn't for performance anyway, it was for emissions.
Sent you an email.

I'll just throw a little fuel on the fire here. Truck in story is a 92 D250 automatic.

Last summer I helped a friend move from Cleveland to Tullahoma Tennessee, about a 1500 mile road trip. On the way out, i had my open car hauler loaded with his k10 which was loaded with spare parts and the bed of my truck loaded with more of his junk, probably 14000 combined weight. Got 14.5 towing out trying to average 70mph.

On the way back, truck and trailer empty and keeping close to 80 I got a little over 18.

I might have gotten better on the loaded trip but was dealing with a junk TPS that kept me out of overdrive the last couple hundred miles. I swapped in a functional TPS for the return.

You see numbers and focus on them apparently?

So, I'll try to explain it without adding any more numbers......

I had to travel to see it last Saturday.

I had to travel from there back home last Saturday.

Equal distance and travel time each way, so use a little division and you will know how far I had to drive it home yesterday.

Does that help at all?

Can't just answer the question, have beat around the bush and be a condesending Jerk? Avoiding the embarrassment of admitting I am right and having to post the reality that you did a 3 and half hour trip in dump truck that likely did 12 mpg.

Making excuses of tire pressure problems already and you'll "have mileage numbers another day"..................

Cheese and Rice what kind of a Fool would believe a DUMP TRUCK with a cow-catcher and 6x9 mirrors gets 21 mpg?

Well....

You can not even get the year of the truck right.

It is a flatbed with no hoist, so it is not a dump truck.

The mirrors are 7" x 16".

The fuel gauge read full, but the PO did not record the mileage and he was miles from a station so I knew it had been driven some, including my initial test drive.

So guess what?

To get factual numbers, I had to top it up and note the mileage so I have a solid base for a starting point.

New vehicle to me, I always check the basics, including the tire pressures.

As far as any possible bad attitude in this thread goes, I am not the one calling people names.

I will report the facts when the tank needs to be filled again.

But remember also...... I'll be happy with anything above 10mpg.

When driving a diesel and looking for best MPG there are other important factors to consider. All play a part in optimum MPG. The truck itself as to gear ratio, tire height, hiway tread vs. aggressive wider tires, dual rear tires, and air pressure. Then you get to outside factors like ambient temperature, wind speed/direction (the biggest factor!) and if you are pulling any weight. Then there is driver habits. Like cruising at 70-80mph. If you want to get nice MPG numbers slow down to 60mph and keep it in the diesel rpm sweet spot (say 1500rpm), let physics roll you fast down a hill and let momentum carry you up the hill mostly even if it slows you some. I have had probably 30 or so 2004 and newer diesels (since I deal in them) and pretty much every one of them will get 20mpg (highway only-no towing). My very first Cummins was a 1990 back in '93. It looked just like the OP's one. Red std cab dually flatbed 5 spd. It was a cab and chassis model with 4:56 gears 2wd. It's been a long time , but i recall it getting about 10mpg maybe 12 but nowhere near 20. I'll give it one thing though, It really sounded cool with that turbo spooling up when going up steep grades. Sure wish newer Cummins could sound like that!!

I don't believe 456 gears were available with any Cummins.

Non intercooled auto had 307, manual had 354 or 410

Intercooled trucks got 354 or 410 as optional regardless of transmission.

Theres unconfirmed rumors that some early intercooled auto trucks got 307 gears.

456 and a Cummins means a top speed around 45 mph.

Did you even BOTHER to go to the Fuelly site? That one I posted is the closest to the one you bought.

Site looks something like this, for example, " I have had probably 30 or so 2004 and newer diesels (since I deal in them) and pretty much every one of them will get 20mpg". Yeah, I deal with Cummins regularly, and this is more like it:

"Based on data from 88 vehicles, 5,354 fuel-ups and 1,915,436 miles of driving, the 2005 Dodge Ram 2500 gets a combined Avg MPG of 14.44 with a 0.10 MPG margin of error.

It is not a 2005 or a 2500 either....

I am only interested in what my results will be with my truck, in my location and with my driving, so why would I even want to look at the results of unknown drivers?

Just sit back and chill, I'll post what I find out when the tank is low enough to fill, honest.

As a general rule diesels get their best mileage at the lowest RPM they will operate at without lugging. Gas engines get their best mileage at the RPM they make their torque peak at. Of course there are other factors involved but just generally speaking.
The posted 14-15 MPG for the 2005 vehicle is about right in my experience also and I stated that previously. Although the electronics are very programmable they really aren't to the end user, you only have a few choices with what ever programmer you purchased. I used a Super Chips programmer on my 2006 with a boost fooler. No exhaust mods on that truck. I also used a SC tuner on my 2007 Dirtymax. They ran good and the the 2006 Ram would smoke all four tires but fuel mileage sucked. It got 12 MPG when towing my 30' enclosed race trailer around 70 MPH. Better than the 6 MPG I got with my 2WD V10 truck though. That truck got 9 MPG empty no matter what, city, highway, combined it didn't matter, it just got 9 MPG.
The early VE pumped trucks have a lot of adjustments and room for improvement in them because they were so detuned from the factory. 200 HP and 500 lb/ft is obtainable by just a few simple mods and adjustments to the pump. That's before even thinking about injectors, turbos, or the like.