Classic car dealers

I'm just looking around for a few different old Mopars to maybe upgrade to. And it seems like 80% of cars listed for sale are classic car dealers. Do they just swoop up and buy any good deal? And then double to triple the price. I guess you have to be lucky and find something local that's not on the internet.

It does seem that way. Cars sit for a year or more on these lots. I think it’s Uber rich guys that aren’t really running a business. One guy told me he made money doing payday loans and the cars aren’t priced to sell until he’s ready to move on. I’d seen one a few years ago that had come down more to what I thought it should be and called. He said his son died and that was who managed the “business” while he washed and waxed them and drove them for fun everyday. He was ready to thin it out after the kid died. Came very close to saying it was a tax shelter, right to edge of saying it.

I believe that contributes to the decline in interest by young people. Cars go unloved and have issues from sitting when somebody parts with far too much money for one. Then they are boxed in and lose the fire. Hard to get excited about an expensive toy that is broken, and your money to repair it is tied up in the purchase.

Some of the cars listed are actually on consignment. The owner doesn't want to mess with tire kickers, low ballers, and scammers. So they let a dealer do it for a commission or fee instead of messing with an auction house. Sometimes it is a family member wanting to sell a car of an owner who passed awaya nd doesn't know much about cars. Other times the "dealer" does own the car and is trying to flip a good deal they found.

As always, let the buyer beware. If you are the type of guy that's always looking for the rock-bottom price then you likely will not get it at a dealer. But if you do your due diligence it is possible to get a good car at a fair price--depending on the dealer of course.

This plus being on consignment adds a protective layer between parties when title and/or repair issues are discovered.

btw,
Carvana seems to gravitate toward selling stolen cars. Due diligence is needed now more than ever.

Maybe not much longer: https://zacjohnson.com/is-carvana-going-out-of-business

You need to be out on these Mopar web board, ebay, craigslist, most of the Mopar for sale groups on Facebook. ... And get connected locally through clubs, cruise-ins, and shows (regional and local)



Yes, there's a lot of fake and misleading classic cars that have entered the pool of availability. Usually let in by uneducated buyers. Then they just get shuffled to the next dealer, then owner and back to dealer. Of course this washed everyone clean of responsibility on the issue cars.

Worse than that, history is getting lost. Resto pictures, documentation, buildsheets. New owners don't understand the value or history and things get misplaced. Turns out, the safest place for a buildsheet or fender tag in on or in the actual car.

And classic cars are typically sold for cash with bills of sale that don't match the actual transaction amount. Great oppurtunity for money laundering.

Crappy, probably AI written, article.

Lots of nothing in it.

Case in point - my car - 71 Duster w/408 stroker 4-speed, wilwood brakes, upgraded springs, sway bars, bilstein shocks

Really nice car, I spent about $35K total - rotisserie restoration also had a lot of great help from friends

Sold it to a guy in Delaware in 2018 for just a tick over $30K, he ends up selling a few months later to a "classic" dealership in Ohio for about what he paid me - $30K - they put it on their website for $50K

Sits there for about year and a half - moves to another Ohio specialty dealership - now they want $70K (I noticed they installed power steering)

Eventually it sold at the 2021 Mecum Kissimmee auction for $68K including commission - billed as a "restomod"

I've been to several of these classic car dealers just to look, not buy. A few of them are fairly large & almost like a small museum to kill time in for a couple of hours with friends. One thing I noticed that seems to be a common trait with these places is that the majority of the cars are not worth the asking prices. They may be nice & not a piece of crap, but still not worth the price. To the average person they all look great & that's what they are counting on. Anyone who has been around these cars for decades & has worked on them knows this.

There is no way I would ever buy a car online without going to inspect it in person. The classic car dealers have a lot of vehicles that would be disappointing to you if you purchased it online & had it shipped.

You must have missed this then troll;
'The recent announcement of Amazon entering the car-selling industry has sent shockwaves through the market, including its impact on Carvana and other online car sellers. The news of Amazon’s entry has caused a decline in the stock performance of online car sellers, raising concerns about the future of this industry segment.

As news spread about Amazon’s foray into the car-selling market, shares of online car sellers, including Carvana, witnessed a significant decline. This development has emphasized the level of competition and the potential disruption that Amazon’s entry brings to the table.

Carvana, being one of the prominent players in the online used car retail space, is likely to face intensified competition from Amazon. With its vast customer base, robust logistics network, and strong brand reputation, Amazon has the potential to reshape the industry dynamics and capture a significant portion of the market share.

The market’s reaction to Amazon’s entry will serve as a crucial barometer for Carvana’s future performance. As the industry adjusts to this new competition, Carvana and other online car sellers will need to adapt their strategies to differentiate themselves and provide unique value propositions to customers.

That doesn't seem like nothing to anyone that knows anything about the car business. So, thank you for showing your working knowledge on the subject.

And here's some hard financial numbers on Carvana from another source that reinforces the conclusions in the link that you can choke on while trying to find fault:

'Carvana has been struggling to sell cars acquired at elevated prices as buyers, hit by inflation and worried about a recession, cut spending. Carvana shares have lost 87% of their value in the past two years. The company's market capitalization is $7.5 billion, well below the $60 billion it commanded in 2021.'

I was just at the Volo Museum and classic car sales yesterday to inspect a car. 90% of the cars there are on consignment, been going there for decades as it is about 5 miles from my house. Usually very nice cars that they know nothing about. Always at least 30% over priced if not more. Of course I go to the auctions and other classic car dealers around the country and most are like that. I find that no reserve auctions usually have a lot of dealer owned or consigned cars that they are just wanting to get rid of and talk the consignors into taking it to auction ...

We had one of those around here for about 3 years. Yep, most of the cars were consignment but at least they seemed honest in one aspect, The cars were nothing special. 74 Camaro, 70 olds cutlass, etc. They had no 442, Z/28s etc. Now the prices, this was around 2015 and they were asking 50k for that Camaro. I figure the owner wanted 20-25k and the other 30k was going to be profit. Like another has said, I was just looking to waste time. Sadly, these type of businesses are not really going entities. Go look on ebag. 20 years ago there were real people selling "real" cars. Now, 90% of the cars are from shops like was mentioned. One also needs to wonder about what lurks beneath with these cars. I might buy a car from someone on this sight who has been here forever and talked about their car. I might buy a car from one of my buddies. I would never buy a car from a dealer. I have bought 2 cars from ebay. Both were exactly as described and it didn't matter as I knew that I was going to have to rebuild everything. Only surprise was the barracuda's rear frame needing replacement.

I wouldn’t use these guys if you are in the market.

http://www.truemusclecars.com/

Would help a lot if guys would stop consigning cars. Plenty of horror stories out there on people not getting paid. You sign over rights to your car when you consign. One classic place in Florida just went belly up, people moved on to using their land for a wedding venue. About 4 million went “missing.” Nobody will get paid after the bankruptcy process, you just know it.

If only people weren’t too lazy to sell their cars themselves, these clowns wouldn’t have inventory, wouldn’t have a chance at a hefty payday to an uneducated buyer, and couldn’t take off with the loot.

most classic car dealers are nothing more than pimps promising you a virgin. What you normally get is a perfumed pig that is nothing close to what was represented. And as mentioned many go from dealer to dealer via auctions. Proceed with extreme caution.

There's a place not far from me I keep an eye on. They've had a few nice looking Mopars in the last year, and every one of them was a clone, but not advertised as such.

And how do the differ from any used car salesman?

so these cars being sold for 50k/100k, 250k, r being sold for cash???? - i find that hard to believe

A fellow vet friend of mine bought a 64 thunderbird in the 60,000 dollar range,a beautiful car and he bought it off the internet before he ever saw it in person I don't think we're that brave!lol!

I believe they are. Every known big time drug dealer where I grew up had a collection. Especially the major one that was tied into the cops so he moved his entire operation the week before a sting. He had more than a few, plus a “used car lot,” that had some classics on it. Somehow every person in town except the cops(ha ha ha) knew he hauled drugs in the tires of used cars.

As was said, paperwork is dodgy on what is actual paid. You can hide a lot of money in plain sight by sticking it into a classic car. Decent inflation hedge, not a real money maker, but is a lot better than securing a pile of ill gotten gains or explaining where it came from.

That article is out of date, Carvana seems to be doing well as of this week.

Last I saw Carvana had lost their business license for the 2nd time in Illinois for failing to provide titles to cars.

Thing nobody can explain about carvana- gross profit per car is about double all other publicly listed dealers. Yet they can’t turn a buck most quarters, and they had to get a debt forgiveness to the tune of a billion dollars! Uh ok then.

Found a rough looking 67 satellite at a car dealership yesterday, years ago i wouldve wanted it!Now I'm like ehhh....Think im over buying rough mopars.

So, after a couple of years of devastating stock plunges, you choose to point to 2 days of modest stock improvements climaxing Friday morning before beginning another slide. Are you buying or selling on that news?

There have been a few that have caught my eye in recent years. One was an '85 or '86 Daytona Turbo Z that was in the car corral at Carlisle a few years ago with the flyer from a consignment dealer still in the window--but with their price crossed out and a more realistic one handwritten in. I talked to the owner and he said his price was much lower because "I'd like to actually sell it."

Then there's this '83 Charger 2.2 I spotted on AT Classics last Spring, right after I talked myself out of a Shelby Charger that was a Hemmings auction. Now, this is a pretty nice example of a car you never see anymore, and it has the right options (5-speed, air, lower-body blackout, deluxe interior), but they're asking $10,995 for it! Now, how many people do you think there are in the whole world who'd still be interested in a 94-horsepower, carbureted, 4-cylinder, front-drive Dodge Charger? 50? 100? Think any of us are interested in paying eleven grand for one?
Well, it was on Barn Finds in late 2022, and the price there was only $5600.
Hope the consignor is enjoying it, because he's gonna have it for a while.

this reminded me of a customer a few years back. he was selling a nice but not show quality 64 Sport fury. he took it to a local CCD and put it on consignment. He got an acceptable offer ( to him) But the Pimps said hang on we can get a lot more for it. # months later he wound up selling it for about 4K less than the offer

There is a 68 GTX I inquired about last year. It keeps being auctioned ant different types of venues and the market is saying about what I think is within range for the car. It was being handled by some corvette goofs. I called and kindly went over the market with the handler. He said the guy wanted a good 30% over that. Went on to say several people had called and made my offer or thereabouts.

I told him I can’t make the horse drink if nobody else had been able. I’m still not sure if it’s the owner or the dealer calling the shots. I saw the car in the last month or so listed at yet another corvette goofball place. It might well be the owner is stuck on his number, one that is different than reality, which in turn has surely shrank in past 18 months.

I don’t know what their cut is, but taking some slickster out of the mix might create a path for a given car to sell. I’m well aware of how people can wear you out, but a good car will catch a good buyer if you simply take some decent pics and be honest about what you have.

Having recently been in talks with a consignment shop in PA.

IMO a lot of these places are at the mercy of the cars owner having an over inflated value of their car .

Case in point . This place charges a base fee to take the car in, then 10% of the sale price.

Ive talked to this cars actual owner and tried to buy before it was consigned. I made an offer on this one and told him if he didnt like my offer, Counter.
But he wanted nothing to do with an outright sale.

No way in hell will this car sell for high 60s

https://www.classicautomall.com/vehicles/5927/1967-plymouth-gtx-hardtop

imy wife has a 67 gtx, blue on blue buckets- not orig engine, auto/3.55 restored maybe 12yrs ago, rarely driven inside instrument panel , glove box, etc done, all bright work on the outside done. i was looking for 50k, last year, and not a taker - its not a 68/69 or 70

There are a few classic car dealers in this area. A couple of them have been in business for a long time but I honestly don't know how or why. A lot of the cars are "spray paint restos" with significant problems under the surface.

I know of a few 67 GTXs that have actually sold. Only one was over $50k but it was a really nice and HIGH optioned car

Most of the ones I know were low - mid 40s tops unless its a hemi car


A friend of mine wants a 67 GTX

That 2.2 Charger reminds me of a car my dad bought new in '83. I think it may have been around $12k brand new...The Plymouth version of this Charger above.
He bought an '83 2.2 Turismo..Crimson Red, with red velour interior. After he brought it home, I convinced him
to go with me, up to Mancini Racing ( at that time..6-1/2 mile & Gratiot Ave.) to buy a set of smoked tinted headlight covers for the Turismo.

I don't remember the pricing on the '83 Charger/Turismo 2.2, but the most expensive '82 I saw when I worked at the dealership was in the lower $9k range. Even with an automatic ($500ish) and air ($600+ and probably the most expensive single option you could get on an L-body at the time), it was hard to get the sticker much higher than that. My '86 that was basically a Charger 2.2 sans stripes and body kit only stickered at $9122.

If the one in the photo was Graphic Red, it would be pretty much the exact car I wanted when I was 19.

Yup.. I'm thinking my dad's Turismo was maybe around $9-10K new?? Not $12,000 like I mentioned... it's been 40 years..lol.
His had A/C and the automatic, with the stripe package too. I think it had the upgraded radio as well.
He also had it rustproofed at the dealership before picking it up... I remember that..because of the goop, dripping on the driveway for a couple days after he got it home..lol.

Checked on the 66 Dodge Coronet a bit closer this time.Its a 500,bucket seat console car.4 old flat goodyear tires with magnum rims and grey primer and surface rust body.The place is a new/ old car dealer had jeeps and a couple newer purple chargers and a body shop in the other building. The coronet sat next to a 68 350 firebird that looked rough and my wife noticed it's back window was missing kinda hard looking over car in the pouring rain lol I guess I'm still alittle car crazy,got my wife some Francis Coppola and Cooper and Thief wines. I've got a great amazingwife,she saved me from hopping out of the car and into a small pond around the backend of the coronet.

There is an article in “Sports Car Market” magazine this month regarding a dealer in Florida that declared bankruptcy. The jest of the article is that the owners of the cars will likely have to give up their cars for virtually nothing, even though the car owners still have their titles in hand. Everyone will need a lawyer. Not a pretty sight.

Thanks Redbird for sharing this that sucks for the car owners!

Perfuming up pigs for a profitable flip is a big industry. Many repair shops on you tube showing a familiar pattern: Person pays BIG $$$$$ for their dream classic car........and then take it to a pro for an evaluation or take it to a pro because it doesn't behave correctly. WHAT AN UNBELIEVABLE hacked up mess below the surface! Kiwis Classics and Customs is a shop where a big portion of his business are classic car purchases from dealers, auctions and consignment lots. One car was an absolutely stunning 69 Cougar. Flawless blue paint- built 351 Cleveland, 4 spd all new chrome new interior and new vinyl top. Perfection. But underneath is globby crap welds from an ARC welder- metal roofing material glued in with spot/glazing putty and duct tape. Self tappers, rivets and roofing tar- everything a broke 15 year old did in 1980.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wNmvDyoTO8&t=811s

Yeah not sure about the place we were at.Alittle sketchy....The body shop had a 64 corvette sitting out side in the pouring rain with a half-assed cheap tarp covering the top of it.And read about bad things about the dealer.

I could write a book on the htings we've seen from CCD's and auction houses not to mention a few fresh builds from supposedly reputable "Pro's" or maybe that was "Hoe's"
What is sad is the total lack of morals and ethics out there. it's all about the 🤑. A 69 Shelby GT500KR that was bought at BJ took almost 50K to straighten the mechanical and electrical issues on. But hey, the backseat& trunk were full of trophies, awards and platinum certifications from various Shelby authorities

One of the main reasons you see a lot of stuff on consignment is because the private party thinks their car is worth a load, they try forever to get rid of it and can’t.
So they take it to a dealer thinking they will get rid of it for them.
Problem is, the figure they give the dealer to work from is obviously already too high, and in order to make any money, the dealer bumps it up even more.
So what happens is the car sits and rots and nobody gets anything.
To listen to in many cases uninformed people on here, you would think only private party cars are ones that could possibly be nice, and priced correctly. That isn’t often the case.
It’s one of the main reason I never asked for a consignment license years ago when we opened our business.
I worked for a place years ago that had a consignment license. Most of the stuff the guy took in on consignment was exactly what I mentioned above, people having issues selling it themselves.
Usually such stuff isn’t worth fooling with, obviously exceptions, and as a dealer you have nothing tied up in it, so sometimes it works out for everybody.

There is also the issue that a lot of owners do not want to deal with today's buyers. Just look at the aggravations often cited here when it comes to selling just a few parts. Selling a big ticket item is just such a hassle in most cases where the seller wants to get all he can. Then there is the issue of guaranteeing the funds and maybe the quality of the title. Issues that a lot of guys just aren't fluent in and are rightfully concerned about getting screwed in the process.

This is not a recommendation for or affirmation of 'classic car dealers', it is just a few more reasons for their existence.

Boy was I shocked yesterday when my son came back from a work trip and mentioned that he passed one of dealers. I looked them up and good lord, was I surprised. Take a look at several of the vehicles being sold by South Jersey Classics. Specifically, the 1940 Ford COE. Super low mileage mustangs(yeah they are 80s-90's) and heck, the Coronet actually looks decent. Now I didn't look in person, but the Coronet is running a 273 and although there are some flaws, not really a horrible price. I know the Willys is priced about right too. For the COE, I have no idea if it is right priced that looks fun as heck.