Moparts

Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger

Posted By: Flying Banana

Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/02/11 08:43 PM

My '70 Challenger R/T w/auto in the console is coded for cruise control, but the steering column was replaced at some time in the past and the wiring and control stick are long gone. Is the stick a standard part across mopars, or specific to my car? If specific, is anyone reproducing this?

Thanks
Posted By: gtx6970

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/02/11 08:57 PM

70-71 E-body only,,,,, and I'm not sure but it might also be 71-72 B-body as well

One of , if not the hardest cruise switches there is to find
Posted By: toplescuda

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/02/11 09:16 PM

i have factory cruise on my 70 cuda if remember right b body stick is at a differnt angle far as i know not reproduced good luck finding one ralph
Posted By: EV2RTSE

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/02/11 09:51 PM

As mentioned the E and B Body turn signal stalks with cruise look the same at first glance but are actually slightly different. They are not easy to find but do seem to pop up on ebay every now and again. If I'm not mistaken the wiring harness itself can be scavenged off of practically any car with factory cruise all the way through probably at least the mid 70's.
Posted By: twodoorpost

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/02/11 10:27 PM

1970-71 E body only speed control handle is longer than B body. It also has a sharper angle to compensate for the E body crush can that puts the steering wheel so far away from the turn signal switch.

Attached picture 6506443-Ecruisehandle01.jpg
Posted By: 70runner

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/02/11 11:23 PM


Below is B body. I had a 70RR with cruise, so collected several of these sticks when you could still find them - long gone on ebay. As noted the E stick has more angle. The head, switch, and lettering is the same for all. The C body has a screw in end. They are all rare.

Attached picture 6506532-CClever.jpg
Posted By: EV2RTSE

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 04:13 AM

C-Body Lever

Attached picture 6507085-CBodylevr.jpg
Posted By: EV2RTSE

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 04:15 AM

E Body lever, wiring harness, and brake switch

Attached picture 6507087-EBodyCruiseControlWiring.JPG
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 04:42 AM

And because you can't find an original one & also because the E body ones aren't chromed like all the others.. What I've done in the past is take two easily found switches, strip the electrical out of both of them, cut one near the area where the switch fits, cut the other the proper length to equal a real E body lever then weld the two pieces together... Laying them in V blocks will keep them straight, tack around the tube like doing body work, then grind it smooth... chucking it in a drill press makes getting the whole lever sanded for paint a breeze, clamp the area where it bolts to the T/S switch in a vise, heat the area just past the vise with a torch & adjust the lever angle... Prime, paint & reinstall the electrical & you now have a switch that no one will question...
Posted By: Flying Banana

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 05:04 AM

If it isn't chromed, what paint color is it? And are the electronics basically standard across models? If I fab up the stick as you suggest, is there a best model to look for the donor parts?

Thanks
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 05:20 AM

The lever is silver argent.. You need a upper section from a 69-73 vehicle so it will have the style of switch shown it the above photos.. C body ones (the screw in style) are easiest to find & will work... For the lower section you need one of the type that was mounted with a screw like a standard lever.. The switch style doesn't matter so the later B body or FMJ body make good donors...
Posted By: 70runner

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 06:01 AM

Quote:

C-Body Lever





I sold this one in April 2007
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 06:15 AM

Quote:

Quote:

C-Body Lever





I sold this one in April 2007




Got anymore, I think somebody needs one...
Posted By: 70runner

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 09:24 AM

Wish I did. I had collected about a dozen or so, but sold them all on ebag.
Posted By: mccannix

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 01:52 PM

As stated above 68-69 B-body is similar to E-body but has a shorter handle.
Both have small black button on end.

Attached picture 6507554-cruise4.JPG
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 02:25 PM

Thanks Mccannix! So if the 68-69 has the small button as you pictured, then the B body lever pictured above must be the 70-72 or 73 lever?

Tav
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 02:52 PM

Quote:

E Body lever, wiring harness, and brake switch




This is my setup. I'm using the lever, and possibly the brake switch. I sent that 70 e body wiring harness to M&H electric and had them build me a brand new one. Now that they have a diagram of how to make it, you should be able to call them and order one for yourself. M&H makes good stuff. They supply all of Year One's wiring harnesses. Due to limited parts availability (grommet) you won't find this harness in the Year One catalog. Call M&H direct to get it.

For the brake switch, they didn't change much up to the early 80's I think. Part # changed, but only difference I could find was the color of the wire.

I agree that the E body switch is different from the B body. I do have a B body switch installed in my 'Cuda and it works fine.

Tav

Attached picture 6507622-speedcontrolharnes(70Ebody)copy.JPG
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 03:05 PM

E body

Tav

Attached picture 6507631-70Ebodyspeedcontrolturnsignallever2copy.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 03:08 PM

B body

with these pics you can see the differences a little better. There is a slight angle difference, and the E body lever is about 1.5 inches longer. Also, the B body is chromed, while the E body appears more matte.

Tav

Attached picture 6507635-Bbodyspeedcontrolturnsignallevercopy.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 03:22 PM

Quote:

And because you can't find an original one & also because the E body ones aren't chromed like all the others.. What I've done in the past is take two easily found switches, strip the electrical out of both of them, cut one near the area where the switch fits, cut the other the proper length to equal a real E body lever then weld the two pieces together... Laying them in V blocks will keep them straight, tack around the tube like doing body work, then grind it smooth... chucking it in a drill press makes getting the whole lever sanded for paint a breeze, clamp the area where it bolts to the T/S switch in a vise, heat the area just past the vise with a torch & adjust the lever angle... Prime, paint & reinstall the electrical & you now have a switch that no one will question...





I might try that sometime Randy.

Here is an exploded view of a B body lever (also typical of E body).
Dissassembly not for the weak of heart. The chrome ring that you rotate for acceleration is Fragile, and the black plastic is Not meant to come off of the metal stalk.

This is the one I'm currently using on my 'Cuda.

Tav

Attached picture 6507654-CruiseTurnSignalArmExplodedViewcopy.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 03:33 PM

Quote:

The head, switch, and lettering is the same for all.





I Disagree with that statement. I've found 3 variations, and would be happy if anyone could tell me what years/cars they go with. (or maybe they were just made by a different vendor?)

See Pics...

This first picture is an E body lever. I was told it came out of a 70 Challenger.

Tav

Attached picture 6507670-speedcontrolselector1-Ebodycopy.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 03:37 PM

This is a B body lever. Notice there is a cutaway section for pressing the button on the end. The E body lever didn't have that.

Tav

Attached picture 6507674-speedcontrolselector2copy.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 03:40 PM

This is also a B body lever. Notice the addition of the "SET" lettering and arrow. I suspect this came after the levers without the lettering, haven't narrowed it down to a specific year yet. Any help appreciated.

Tav

Attached picture 6507679-speedcontrolselector3copy.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 03:47 PM

Quote:

If I'm not mistaken the wiring harness itself can be scavenged off of practically any car with factory cruise all the way through probably at least the mid 70's.




The wires color and where they go are the same, but there are sometimes differences in lengths. You might have to splice in a small piece to make it longer if you scavenge from another car.

I had an NOS B body harness that was just barely a little short for my E body.

Tav
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 03:55 PM

Quote:

My '70 Challenger R/T w/auto in the console is coded for cruise control, but the steering column was replaced at some time in the past and the wiring and control stick are long gone. Is the stick a standard part across mopars, or specific to my car? If specific, is anyone reproducing this?

Thanks





I'd love to hear more about your car. Do you still have any of the underhood cruise parts? The Servo bracket is E body specific and is tough to find, just like the turn lever.

The Servo itself, brake booster bracket, and throttle cable clamp can be scavenged from other cars. The throttle clamp is different for big block vs. small block. Big block left in photo, Small block right in photo.

Tav

Attached picture 6507699-cruiseclamps.JPG
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 04:07 PM

Quote:

As stated above 68-69 B-body is similar to E-body but has a shorter handle.
Both have small black button on end.




Terry this is the first time I've seen you post something I don't agree with... I've owned two factory cruise control Challengers, both had the larger button like posted in Tav's second picture above... Can't really see it well enough to tell which style handle it is but this car is coded for it & I bought it back in 74..

Attached picture 6507705-RTS.E.Dash.jpg
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 04:59 PM

Here's the button style in my '71 Charger. My '73 Van has the shielded button with the word "SET" on the housing. Also, the lever shown above for C-bodies is actually for tilt columns only which are also used in '71 B-bodies. Non-tilt C-bodies use the same one as other cars except E-bodies.

Posted By: 70runner

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 08:56 PM

Quote:

Quote:

The head, switch, and lettering is the same for all.





I Disagree with that statement. I've found 3 variations, and would be happy if anyone could tell me what years/cars they go with. (or maybe they were just made by a different vendor?)




I stand corrected - forgot about the notch and "SET" lettering. When I was collecting these, it seemed the notch appeared somewhere around the mid-70 model year. I never found any with the "SET" lettering prior to 70. These dates could vary of course.

This one came off a 70 Satellite, May build date (I usually kept the fender tags for parts w/o date codes):

Attached picture 6508094-cruzcontr.jpg
Posted By: 70runner

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 08:59 PM

This one off a 72 Plymouth S/W...

Attached picture 6508102-cclever.jpg
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/03/11 09:27 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

The head, switch, and lettering is the same for all.





I Disagree with that statement. I've found 3 variations, and would be happy if anyone could tell me what years/cars they go with. (or maybe they were just made by a different vendor?)




I stand corrected - forgot about the notch and "SET" lettering. When I was collecting these, it seemed the notch appeared somewhere around the mid-70 model year. I never found any with the "SET" lettering prior to 70. These dates could vary of course.

This one came off a 70 Satellite, May build date (I usually kept the fender tags for parts w/o date codes):




The problem is that you don't know if the switch was swapped out at some point. Chrysler would just supercede the early ones in parts because they still worked even if they looked different.

The '68-9 ones had different terminals on the end so they may have been unique.
Posted By: RROD

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/04/11 01:51 AM

Just curious. Did any 4-speed 70 E bodies have the cruise control option?
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/04/11 02:08 AM

Cruise was N/A with manual trans or multi carb..
Posted By: mccannix

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/04/11 02:32 AM

Randy
I could plead "brain fart" or "typo" but I will simply say you are correct and I was wrong, E-body button WAS larger
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/04/11 02:39 AM

Been there done that... It happens... I know for me it's gotta be CRS..
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 03/04/11 02:47 PM

Quote:

Cruise was N/A with manual trans or multi carb..




Also not available with Hemi


That said, I've seen cruise on an auto trans Cuda with a Hemi installed. The cruise throttle cable is Very close to hitting the valve cover. (owner may have bent the bracket a little for clearance) Also, you can't use the long Hemi power brake booster with the cruise. They take up the same space under the hood.

Also, After adding cruise to my 'Cuda, I also added a six pack. I'm not sure why the factory didn't want cruise with multi carb. I didn't have to do anything special to install mine, and it works like a dream.

On a Barracuda, the cruise wiring goes through the same spot on the firewall that was used for the 4 speed reverse dash light wire. For some reason I don't understand, Challengers seem to have used the spot that was used for road lamp wiring on 'Cudas. Both cars use the same cruise wiring harness, so it's odd to me that it would go through different spots on the firewall. I haven't seen cruise installed on a manual trans E body, but my cousin has cruise on his manual trans 2003 Mach 1 Mustang.

I'd be interested in learning more about which firewall holes were used for cruise on the other members cars here. Is it as I described?

Here's a picture for reference, so that we're all talking about the same holes.

(NOTE: in 71 the grommet for the 4 speed reverse dash light wire got smaller. Does anyone know if the cruise wiring grommet also got smaller, or did it stay the same as in 70.)

Tav

Attached picture 6509492-ACcableandfirewall.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/08/11 10:29 PM

Here's a pic of the cruise control 'Cuda I was talking about with the Hemi installed. To keep the cruise in the factory location, he couldn't use the Hemi brake booster setup.

Tav

Attached picture 6623700-Hemicruise2smallersizeedit.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/08/11 10:36 PM

Not factory of coarse, but here's a hemi with the hemi brake booster setup, AND cruise. The cruise was intalled over where the fender tag would go, and I think the cruise throttle cable was routed slightly different so that it would reach.

Tav

Attached picture 6623706-Hemiwithaddedcruise.jpg
Posted By: mopars_1

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/08/11 10:51 PM

on my 71 gtx, instead of having a twisting type indicator, mine has a sliding one? any reason?

Attached picture 6623729-100_0874.jpg
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/08/11 11:00 PM

I think Chrysler started using those around 74 so it has been changed assuming it is original.... Code on the fender tag would be N88
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/09/11 01:18 PM

Either a previous owner added the cruise, or the original was damaged and replaced with this later version.

If it's original (N88 on fender tag), I'd be very interested to know where the cruise wiring grommet comes through the firewall. Pic if possible?

Tav
Posted By: ThermoQuad

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/17/11 12:33 PM

This applies to 70 and newer cars
1968-9 cruise control is much different as there is a vacuum throttle release switch vs the electric throttle release switch.

Cruise control was a dealer installed option starting in 1970. Section 8 in the factory service manual.

There were kits to fit the various body styles. I have never seen 69 and back cruise kits but that does not mean they don't exist.

All mopars from 70-80 are wired to accept cruise control. Plug and play. It's not hard to piece together a system and it works well, taking the drudgery out of driving old iron.

There is at least one six pak car with factory type cruise control besides my former six pak car with owner installed factory cruise.

This is correct including the hole in the throttle linkage for the lost motion link pivot pin. One difference from most factory set ups is a pivot pin with a clip retainer was used vs a roll pin as seen on 99% of installations.

I can't remember where this pic was taken. The intake looks like cast iron...

Attached picture 6637362-cruisesixpak.jpg
Posted By: m46rat

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/17/11 04:54 PM

Didn't Mopar call it "Speed Control"?
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/18/11 03:10 AM

Quote:

Didn't Mopar call it "Speed Control"?




Yes, it was called "Automatic Speed Control". Before that, they called it "Auto Pilot".

Auto Pilot was approximately 1958-1966.
I'm not sure what it was called in 1967-1968.
Automatic Speed Control was 1969 and on into the 70's.

Tav
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/18/11 03:20 AM

Quote:

Cruise control was a dealer installed option starting in 1970. Section 8 in the factory service manual.

There were kits to fit the various body styles. I have never seen 69 and back cruise kits but that does not mean they don't exist.






Many thanks for the input!

The dealer installed kits are in addition to the factory installed variety coded N88 on the fender tag correct? My factory service manual has speed control in section 1 accessories instead of section 8 electrical.


Here is an Auto Pilot installation kit for all 1965 Chrysler Newport, Saratoga, 300, 300-L, New Yorker, Town & Country, and Imperial, Crown, and Le Baron.

Tav

Attached picture 6638667-1.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/18/11 03:31 AM

Quote:

There is at least one six pak car with factory type cruise control besides my former six pak car with owner installed factory cruise.






Here is mine,... 1970 340 'Cuda, cloned into an AAR, owner installed factory speed control.

difficult to see, but the cruise cable is on top with the throttle cable under it, and the special throttle bracket holding both is at the far right of the picture.

Tav

Attached picture 6638693-340sixpacksetupsmalledit.jpg
Posted By: gtx6970

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/25/11 03:11 PM

I dug up a servo bracket for a 3rd gen B-body. and I don't see why it would not work in E-body applications .
Considering just how hard cruise parts are to find. It might be an easier / cheaper alternative to the E-body specific parts.

Anyone ever tried?

E-body on the left
71-72 B-body in the middle
68-70 B-body on the right
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/26/11 01:43 PM

So this is a 68-70 B body bracket? I've always wondered.


Too bad cruise didn't come on 4 speed cars. I've probably got an entire setup for my 70 Roadrunner now that I know what this is for.

Thanks!

Tav

#1

Attached picture 6651721-speedcontrolservobracket1smalleredit.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/26/11 01:47 PM

How about this one? Anyone know what mopars this goes to?

Tav

#2

Attached picture 6651723-speedcontrolservobracket2smalleredit.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/26/11 01:49 PM

How about this one? Anyone know what mopars this goes to?

Tav

#3

Attached picture 6651724-speedcontrolservobracket3smalleredit.jpg
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/26/11 07:09 PM

Quote:

I dug up a servo bracket for a 3rd gen B-body. and I don't see why it would not work in E-body applications .
Considering just how hard cruise parts are to find. It might be an easier / cheaper alternative to the E-body specific parts.

Anyone ever tried?




They do look remarkably similar. It looks like two of the holes are in the same spot, while the third hole is relocated for some reason. I think the factory installed cruise used a welded on Nut on the inner fender so that the bolts have something to thread into. Myself, when adding cruise to an E body that didn't originaly come with it, I just drill the holes and use a nylock nut on the bottom side. You don't see it inside the fender unless you're really looking. On an E body, a bolt going through that relocated hole on that 3rd gen B body bracket would hit some inner fender bracing on the other side, and it would be difficult to get a nut on it. You could drill a pretty big hole in the bracing to make room for the bolt & nut, but I think a better suggestion would be to weld up that hole and drill a new one on the bracket in the E body location. Other than that, it looks like it would work fine.

Here's a pic where you can see the underside of the two mounting holes that appear to be in the same location on both brackets.

Tav

Attached picture 6652175-Undersideofcruisemounting1.JPG
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/26/11 07:24 PM

Here's a pic showing the other hole. It's between the brace and the inner fender. As you can see, it wouldn't work very well to move it closer to the other two holes. As it is, it's a little difficult to get a nut on there. I put the nut on the wrench and hold it in position, and then thread the bolt into it.

Tav

Attached picture 6652196-Undersideofcruisemounting2.JPG
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/27/11 02:09 AM

I just measured these angles for someone, and thought I'd post this here incase it helps anyone else.

Tav

Attached picture 6652773-BbodyvsEbodycruisestalkanglessmalleredit.JPG
Posted By: gtx6970

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/27/11 02:23 AM

Tav,
On the 3rd gen B-body bracket, you are correct. The 2 outer holes are in the exact same spot as the E-body bracket.
Also,,,,The E-body bracket is actually maybe 3/4" of an inch longer on the upper plate portion of the bracket. So modifying it for use on an E-body would be super simple, although I personally don't think it's necassary.

When I removed the E-bracket off the car I parted out, I don't remember taking any nuts off from the bottom( several years back so anything is possibile )

The 71-72 B-body bracket was just removed this past week. And it had studs sticking up thru the inner fender with captive washer nuts holding it on. Next time, I'll ck from beneath to see how it attaches
Posted By: cudaman1969

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/27/11 05:13 AM

thought i would add some to this subject. i took the speed control parts off a 71 or 72 Chrysler(been 27 years)and put it on my 70 Challenger. the speed control bracket bolted in the same spot on inner fender(had to drill out little dimples in panel) bent the lever a little to angle it back,it seemed to be the same length as the standard one. everything just snapped together and worked fine.
Posted By: wally426ci

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/28/11 01:15 AM

There are some cruise control parts in the ebody for sale section.....
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/28/11 04:46 PM

Quote:

How about this one? Anyone know what mopars this goes to?

Tav

#3




I have one like that on my '78 Dodge D150 Pickup but I think it was a dealer add on kit.
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/29/11 02:48 AM

Thanks Nick!

Tav
Posted By: dart1962_440

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/29/11 01:53 PM

Tav, #2 is C-body
Posted By: cataclysm80

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/29/11 03:07 PM

Cool, any idea roughly what years of C body?

Tav
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/29/11 05:21 PM

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1970-1974...6#ht_500wt_1182
Posted By: dart1962_440

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 05/30/11 08:13 PM

Tav, C-body one is roughly 68-73
Posted By: 2fast4yourBrain

Re: Cruise Control on a '70 Challenger - 02/26/13 11:25 PM

Is this the correct head for a '71 e-body?




Or is a '71 have the same head as a '70 (fully round near the SET button w/no notch/wedge)?

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