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6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body

Posted By: charger440sixpak

6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/28/10 04:46 AM

Here's a question/mystery I haven't figured out, maybe one of you guys know. My set of braces have welded spacers on the ends.

The repop's don't have these and I am wondering if the spacers were original or a customization.

Anyone know?
Posted By: mopars_1

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/28/10 04:51 AM

Posted By: Barnabas_Kriss

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/28/10 06:54 AM

The spacers are original, but mine were not welded on like that. They were separate pieces.
Posted By: charger440sixpak

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/29/10 08:57 PM

Quote:

The spacers are original, but mine were not welded on like that. They were separate pieces.



The date on my seat tracks is late Dec 1970 just prior to them being discontinued. I'm wondering if these were differences due to when they were mfg'd or possibly which plant the car came from. My Charger is a Lynch Road car. Do you know when & where your car was built?
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/30/10 01:10 AM

I have two sets. One set has separate spacers and the other has one welded on spacer but I'm missing the other spacer and the attachment plates. My Charger didn't come with a six-way. I also have an e-body seat track but I don't have the underfloor braces for it.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/31/10 05:43 AM

I do not know if it changed for '71 (or B-Bodies), but this diagram shows them loose for 1970 Challengers;

Attached picture 6168445-1970e-body6-wayseatdiagram.jpg
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/31/10 05:52 AM

Maybe it was a running change. I can imagine that it would have been a hassle to hold the spacers in place under between the floor and brace while trying to insert the seat.
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/31/10 06:41 AM

Duh, I should practice my reading. The brace goes in after the seat.
Posted By: gtx6970

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/31/10 11:55 AM

I parted out a 71 barracuda to get the 6 way seat and the only spacer it had were the phenolic ones between the seat and the carpet. There was nothing between the under floor brace and the floorpan.
Posted By: JS29R0B

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/31/10 01:18 PM

Quote:

I parted out a 71 barracuda to get the 6 way seat and the only spacer it had were the phenolic ones between the seat and the carpet. There was nothing between the under floor brace and the floorpan.



I'm with you Bill that is the only way I have seen them.I can't speak for B bodies.
Posted By: tak

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/31/10 01:23 PM

Mine are seperate pieces, my car was build in May 70 if I remember correctly. I would imagine though the spacers being welded on has to do with the vender and not the assembly plant.
Posted By: charger440sixpak

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/31/10 06:59 PM

Thanks for the diagram, Barry! It's hard to tell if the spacers are above or below the floor pan (unless I'm missing something, which is very possible... )

I'm beginning to get a sense that it's only the B-bodies that got braces with the welded spacer on the underfloor brace. It also seems like the 6-way tracks were more commonly found on the E-bodies, making it difficult to find B-body examples.
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 08/31/10 11:39 PM

Quote:

Thanks for the diagram, Barry! It's hard to tell if the spacers are above or below the floor pan (unless I'm missing something, which is very possible... )

I'm beginning to get a sense that it's only the B-bodies that got braces with the welded spacer on the underfloor brace. It also seems like the 6-way tracks were more commonly found on the E-bodies, making it difficult to find B-body examples.



They're more common on e-bodies because they were offered longer. They were dropped part way into the 1971 model year.

Years ago when people used to pull these things out of junkyard cars, they didn't know about the braces and would leave them behind. There are certainly more seat tracks available than braces but all of the E-body and '71 B-body ones would have had them originally. Fortunately there are nice repros available. Just need to clear up the spacer thing.
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 12:24 AM

The spacers go under the floor. Between the floor and the brace.
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 01:06 AM

I can tell you first hand as I was involved in making the reproductions you pictured (In fact I took that very picture) and though I haven't seen every original set, I've seen at least a couple dozen that were fresh off the cars (70 & 71 E-body cars) and none of them had the welded on spacers.
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 02:08 AM

Here's a picture of the ones I have. You can see that one of one pair has the welded on spacer. I got these from a swap meet so don't know what they came off of. The complete set with the loose spacers, I pulled myself from a '70 Barracuda.

At least on the '71 Charger, the spacers are required or you'll damage the floor or the brace.



Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 02:36 AM

Interesting Nick, that would be the first of those that (at least appeared) to be original I've seen. Maybe a late 71 change or a B-body deal.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 02:56 AM

Anybody got a 1971 B-Body FSM that can look for a similar diagram to the one I posted?

May as well cover the 1971 E-Body too while we are at it.
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 02:58 AM

I just looked at Barry's site and on his 6way install page there is a picture of the bottom of an E-body and I see that it's different than my '71 Charger. There are extra reinforcments on the floor for the inboard seat bolts that aren't on my car. Looks like the underfloor braces for the 6way would mate up to these.





Here is a link to the full page. Hamtramck Historical - 6-Way Seat Install
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 03:03 AM

Here's the underside of my '71 Charger floor for comparison.

Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 03:08 AM

Quote:

Anybody got a 1971 B-Body FSM that can look for a similar diagram to the one I posted?

May as well cover the 1971 E-Body too while we are at it.



The '71 FSM shows the same thing you posted. The figure is labled "Challenger" though. This manual covers all Dodge cars.
Posted By: charger440sixpak

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 03:48 AM

Quote:

I can tell you first hand as I was involved in making the reproductions you pictured (In fact I took that very picture)



Scott, my apologies for not including the appropriate credit, I saved your photo a long time ago and didn't recall where I'd found it.

Quote:

and though I haven't seen every original set, I've seen at least a couple dozen that were fresh off the cars (70 & 71 E-body cars) and none of them had the welded on spacers.



That would support my theory the spacers were only on the B-bodies, maybe only the Charger? I know I've seen a couple other B's with 6-ways (a RR and a GTX) but I've no idea whether the same braces were used.

Nick, I'll check my floor pan and see if I have the plates on the underside of the floor pan. I know the ones on the top side are there.
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 03:56 AM

Quote:

That would support my theory the spacers were only on the B-bodies, maybe only the Charger? I know I've seen a couple other B's with 6-ways (a RR and a GTX) but I've no idea whether the same braces were used.



Problem is that the '70 Challenger service manual shows the spacers.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 05:12 AM

Ok, image below is from the 1970-71 parts book.

No mention of spacers with the B,J models (Barracuda / Challenger) although the FSM clearly shows them.

Note the highlighted section for the B-body crossmembers says "w/spacers". (W/' is 'with')

So to me, this seems to indicate welded spacers for the B-bodies, likely because the floors did not have the cup in place that the e-bodies had to help hold them in place.

Attached picture 6170725-seatadjustersmall.jpg
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 05:43 AM

I was just looking at the same thing. Right above your highlighted section are more '71 B-body ones that have the same part numbers as the E-bodies.

When you did the one for your web site, did you have spacers?
Posted By: Alaskan_TA

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 05:46 AM

I was not aware they existed until you asked me to look at this thread.
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 06:15 AM

Anyone have a copy of the bulletin announcing the cancellation of the 6-way seat option in December 1970? I believe it mentions some other option as well.
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 06:36 AM

Quote:

Scott, my apologies for not including the appropriate credit, I saved your photo a long time ago and didn't recall where I'd found it.




You don't need to appologize, I was just letting you know where the pic originated.....Although "Some people" continue using Dr.'d versions of my original photos to promote the items I no longer sell (even though I politely requested that they discontinue doing so and that they set up and take thier own photos).

Posted By: RestoRick

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 12:12 PM

If you're referring to me, I've had no such request...
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 01:47 PM

No Rick, not you directly, seems that you weren't told, about it, it's all good between us.

Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/01/10 04:41 PM

I assume these repro seat braces do not come with the spacers. Is that the case?
Posted By: RestoRick

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/02/10 02:31 AM

Yes, no spacers with the repro's.
I have dimensions for them, but I haven't gotten around to having some made.

Rick
Posted By: 71 Charger R/T

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/02/10 09:57 PM



Quote:

and though I haven't seen every original set, I've seen at least a couple dozen that were fresh off the cars (70 & 71 E-body cars) and none of them had the welded on spacers.



That would support my theory the spacers were only on the B-bodies, maybe only the Charger? I know I've seen a couple other B's with 6-ways (a RR and a GTX) but I've no idea whether the same braces were used.

Nick, I'll check my floor pan and see if I have the plates on the underside of the floor pan. I know the ones on the top side are there.




My car ('71 Charger R/T) is opted with the six way (all original still) and has the welded spacers on the brackets with no plates below but plates above floor pan.
Posted By: Stewpar

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/02/10 10:57 PM

Quote:



Quote:

and though I haven't seen every original set, I've seen at least a couple dozen that were fresh off the cars (70 & 71 E-body cars) and none of them had the welded on spacers.



That would support my theory the spacers were only on the B-bodies, maybe only the Charger? I know I've seen a couple other B's with 6-ways (a RR and a GTX) but I've no idea whether the same braces were used.

Nick, I'll check my floor pan and see if I have the plates on the underside of the floor pan. I know the ones on the top side are there.




My car ('71 Charger R/T) is opted with the six way (all original still) and has the welded spacers on the brackets with no plates below but plates above floor pan.



My 1970 'Cuda built in LA have them and they are not welded on..........
Posted By: 6bblgt

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/03/10 12:39 AM

Quote:

My car ('71 Charger R/T) is opted with the six way (all original still) and has the welded spacers on the brackets with no plates below but plates above floor pan.



What SPD & plant was your Charger R/T assembled?
Posted By: tak

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/04/10 02:16 AM

Quote:





That would support my theory the spacers were only on the B-bodies, maybe only the Charger? I know I've seen a couple other B's with 6-ways (a RR and a GTX) but I've no idea whether the same braces were used.

The Roadrunners/GTX/Sats also have the spacers. The E bodies have the seat reinforcement plate on the underside of car so the spacer isn't needed and the b-bodies with bucket seats have the reinforcement plate top side under the carpet, reason for spacer.

Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/04/10 06:01 AM

At least some E-bodies used the spacers anyway. The ones I have came from a '70 Barracuda.
Posted By: 71 Charger R/T

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/07/10 02:33 AM

Quote:

Quote:

My car ('71 Charger R/T) is opted with the six way (all original still) and has the welded spacers on the brackets with no plates below but plates above floor pan.



What SPD & plant was your Charger R/T assembled?



The plant it was built at was Lynch Road, Mi.
By SPD I assume you mean specific production date?....if so, Jan 29 1971
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/07/10 05:02 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

My car ('71 Charger R/T) is opted with the six way (all original still) and has the welded spacers on the brackets with no plates below but plates above floor pan.



What SPD & plant was your Charger R/T assembled?



The plant it was built at was Lynch Road, Mi.
By SPD I assume you mean specific production date?....if so, Jan 29 1971



Interesting, they were supposedly removed from the options list in December of 1970. Was your car ordered? Maybe it slipped in under the wire. Never know with Chrysler.
Posted By: charger440sixpak

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/07/10 03:39 PM

This would be my educated guess - when the call was made to drop the 6-way manual adj. seat option, the existing orders calling for the option were tallied and some extra's added for a final order from the vendor. As the cars with the 6-way seats ordered came up for production, the 6-way seats from the final order were installed. This might also explain why the extra "6-WAY SEAT" appears on the bottom of the broadcast sheet.

Is there any way to decipher the order date from the order number? Not the SPD but the actual date a salesperson at a dealership took/placed the order? I think that's the key...
Posted By: NicksGarage

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/07/10 09:01 PM

Quote:

This would be my educated guess - when the call was made to drop the 6-way manual adj. seat option, the existing orders calling for the option were tallied and some extra's added for a final order from the vendor. As the cars with the 6-way seats ordered came up for production, the 6-way seats from the final order were installed. This might also explain why the extra "6-WAY SEAT" appears on the bottom of the broadcast sheet.

Is there any way to decipher the order date from the order number? Not the SPD but the actual date a salesperson at a dealership took/placed the order? I think that's the key...



No, you can't tell that from the order number. Dealers had batches of numbers as did the factory. I don't think I've ever seen the order number on a handwritten invoice or sales contract. Not that I've seen that many of them.
Posted By: 71 Charger R/T

Re: 6-way seat track braces for 71 B-body - 09/19/10 12:39 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

My car ('71 Charger R/T) is opted with the six way (all original still) and has the welded spacers on the brackets with no plates below but plates above floor pan.



What SPD & plant was your Charger R/T assembled?



The plant it was built at was Lynch Road, Mi.
By SPD I assume you mean specific production date?....if so, Jan 29 1971



Interesting, they were supposedly removed from the options list in December of 1970. Was your car ordered? Maybe it slipped in under the wire. Never know with Chrysler.



Yes, The original owner stated that he ordered the car, and with the excellent help of Nick deciphering the Broadcast sheet, we have confirmed that to be true. Maybe sometime I can contact the original owner again and find out when he ordered it.(I would imagine by the build date, it was before Dec. 1970).
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