Moparts
70 Chall flip top, LOCKING gas cap color/wont lock!
Posted By: 6pakdude
70 Chall flip top, LOCKING gas cap color/wont lock! - 06/27/09 04:27 PM
Org locking gas cap 70 Challenger.
My question is what color should it have on the cast section? bare metal or............
The ones I've seen pics of seems to have a gold color on the cast section.
So a pic on a restored or NOS one would help.
Is the rubber grommet(seals cap to the filler tube) available?
thanks Peter
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/27/09 04:41 PM
Close up of one from a very low mile car;
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/27/09 04:43 PM
Mines used, but still has it's color... It's similar to a Holley Carb... Zinc Dichromate... Scott Harms Smith offers that finish for other components, I'm sure he could do your cap body...
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/27/09 04:52 PM
NOS;
Posted By: Mastershake340
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/27/09 04:53 PM
Here is the backside of an NOS one I have if you need a reference of that. I've never heard of anyone selling new rubber seals for them.
Posted By: 6pakdude
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/27/09 05:11 PM
Yes, thats what I call a gold color, over here it's hard to do that kind of plating.
I mix some paint similar to org plating color, and then rub the paint down so it looks ok.
Have the original rubber, gonna make some rubber gasket to put under the old grommet to make it tighter to the tube.
Some day a new rubber grommet will be avaible?
Thanks for the help.
Posted By: FJ5_Fish
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/28/09 02:27 AM
Quote:
Yes, thats what I call a gold color, over here it's hard to do that kind of plating.
I mix some paint similar to org plating color, and then rub the paint down so it looks ok.
Have the original rubber, gonna make some rubber gasket to put under the old grommet to make it tighter to the tube.
Some day a new rubber grommet will be avaible?
Thanks for the help.
What about all the IKEA fasteners? There has got to be a plating shop in Sweden. 
Posted By: 6pakdude
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/28/09 07:25 AM
You think IKEA is made in SWEDEN. Most of their stuff is made in Asia and shipped around the world.
Plating and chroming is harder to get done for each year, because of health issues and regulations from the gov.
But I check with the few plating shops still left in Stockholm monday.
Peter
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/28/09 01:37 PM
I need one for my 70 R/T SE. Does anyone know where to find one?
Thanks,
David
Posted By: gygeneral
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/28/09 01:53 PM
Heres another example
Posted By: JulesdaWiperman
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/28/09 11:04 PM
David D. I will call a friend of mine who has an nos one.
I will ask him if it is for sale and let you know tomorrow.
Jules
Posted By: FJ5_Fish
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/28/09 11:49 PM
Make sure it is right for your car. Vented (most '70's) or Pressure-Vacuum (some 70's, All 71's).
Posted By: JulesdaWiperman
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/29/09 12:38 PM
Sorry David. He sold it last year.
Jules
Posted By: 6pakdude
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 06/30/09 07:28 AM
Made a new key, put the gascap together.
Can push it open in all positions, with or without the key. The lock don't work.
Should one of the four slots in the housing be shorter in the locking position? is it a metal piece in the bottom of one of the slots or?
Anyone who taken the gas cap apart should know about this.
Peter
Posted By: 6pakdude
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/04/09 05:35 PM
Anyone taken the gascap apart?
Peter
Posted By: 340SIX
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/04/09 08:10 PM
Quote:
Anyone taken the gascap apart?
Peter
If no one can help gp to a real lock smith.
I did when I could not take the glove box door lock off and he did it in a few seconds and said come back when I needed real stuff done. Was a super nice guy 
I wonder if they would even have a market for then being remade {repoped} since 1 year only for the 70 
Posted By: 6pakdude
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/06/09 12:22 PM
Took it to a lock smith to make a key. Then to another one, more into car locks.
They looked at it and say they don't understand the function of the lock of the cap.
See attached pic, perhaps something is missing.
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/06/09 04:08 PM
FWIW, those looking cap were made by Briggs and Stratton.
Are you looking for it to just seal and function, or does it have to lock. I don't see that it's real important to have it lock.
I've seen Troy fix his on T/A. A plate or a lever inside was broken or something. Can't remember.
Posted By: 340SIX
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/06/09 04:20 PM
Any Hope of someone making new ones?
Posted By: Iceman01
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/06/09 04:37 PM
Quote:
Took it to a lock smith to make a key. Then to another one, more into car locks.
They looked at it and say they don't understand the function of the lock of the cap.
See attached pic, perhaps something is missing.
I have had the exact same experience. I have an NOS piece that will not lock. So I took it to the oldest (expert) locksmith in town. He was familiar with the Briggs and Stratton stuff. We dissassembled it together and could not understand how that design could ever lock. It's quite a simple collection of parts. He also said he thought it had to be missing a part.
As someone else suggested, I now use it just as a regular gas cap.
Posted By: 6pakdude
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/06/09 06:21 PM
Iceman
So a NOS locking gas cap don't lock, thats weird?
I can push my gascap open in every position with or without the key, The round plate under the center screw will always push the two lock arms in.
Anyone who can lock their LOCKING Gas cap?
If so, and tell what the problem is:
Peter
Posted By: MoreParts
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/06/09 08:11 PM
About 10 years ago I bought an NOS one too, that would not lock. I disassembled it and was able to get it to work correctly. It was something I fabricated up to fix it, but because so long has passed I don't remember what the fix was. I do recall it not being too involved. I think some sort of metal tab was broken, but I can't say for sure. I found something in the garage that I was able to make work with little modification.
Then I lost the cap!!! I eventually replaced it with used one, but it could use a better seal.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap needed - 07/07/09 12:13 AM
Still looking for one for my 70 Challenger. Are they supposed to be vented or not? My car is a 440-6 pk, if that makes any difference. How can you tell the difference? Is there a different part no.?
Thanks,
David
Posted By: rftroy
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 12:29 AM
You have a broken part on your gascap. That lower disk with the blue coloring on the edge is supposed to have a tab sticking out 90 degrees away from the disk.
Actually, there should only be one disk with a tab, not two disks as shown. IIRC there is a thin rubber disc under the metal disk.
Mine broke in the same place. The design is bad, it is weak at the base of the tab.
If you look inside the base piece, the one on the far right of your picture that is marked either "Vented" or "Not Vented" on the bottom, there is a ~1/8" diameter pin sticking up about 1/8". When the disk is rotated by 90 degrees with the key, the tab, which you are missing, lines up with this pin and prevents the unlocking button from being pushed in and opening the cap.
I made a drawing for a new part to be made out of steel. The original is pot metal. I haven't gotten around to making the part yet.
Bob
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 01:55 AM
My NOS one had not been out of the bag before I bought it, it does not lock either. After I discovered that, I walked around Carlisle one year & talked to car owners that still had their originals. NONE of the ones we tested that day actually locked.
Posted By: rftroy
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 02:55 AM
Hhmmmmm...maybe a burgeoning business opportunity.
I wonder how much money I could lose by reproducing the lock disk for Challenger locking gas caps.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 03:06 AM
Quote:
I wonder how much money I could lose
Well, if you pay me three dollars you can make one for me if that helps at all? 
On a more serious note, if you do make them I can advertise them in the T/A newsletters for you at no charge. 
Posted By: Screamin340
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 03:13 AM
Hi Barry;
I am still looking for one for my T/A if anyone knows of one.
John
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 06:29 AM
My "locking cap" doesn't lock either ......
......
DISASSEMBLED
edit "NOT VENTED" used on most '70 cars (cars w/o N95) 
Broken locking disc
again
Inside where the lock would/should make contact.
Posted By: 6pakdude
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 07:34 AM
Now were getting there.
Anyone with a pic of the locking disc with the 90 degree tab.
Thanks for the pics and info. Let us know when the new part(locking disc) is for sale.
Peter
Posted By: ta340
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 05:23 PM
locking disc with the 90 degree tab.
Posted By: cataclysm80
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 05:23 PM
Quote:
My NOS one had not been out of the bag before I bought it, it does not lock either. After I discovered that, I walked around Carlisle one year & talked to car owners that still had their originals. NONE of the ones we tested that day actually locked.
That's scary to think that all those $500 gas caps could be stolen so easily. I originaly was looking for one to use as a regular cap without locking it, but after finding out how much they cost, I'll pass. I'd never use such an expensive gas cap without locking it if I was going to leave the car unattended.
Tav
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 05:38 PM
ta340,
Welcome & thanks for the pic.
Can you measure the height of the tab?
Posted By: ta340
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 05:39 PM
90 degree tab.
Posted By: 6pakdude
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 05:54 PM
Ta340,thanks for the pics.
I gonna make a new locking plate out of a piece of sheetmetal.
Peter
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 07:42 PM
I guess I'm the odd man out.. Mine works perfectly... It came with my car amongst the stash of NOS parts... The orignal locking cap was still with the parts as well, but the guy I bought the car from had lost the key & drilled into the cylinder... I tossed that old junk...
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 08:21 PM
What does the N9B represent? I don't have the build sheet, and that is not on my fender tag. The car is an R/T SE 440-6, with a build date of Nov. '69.
Would hate to pay the big bucks for the wrong part! Anyone care to guess if mine should be vented or not?
Thanks,
David
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 09:16 PM
Not Vented would be 49 state compliant 1970 vehicles, Pressure/Vacuum is 1970 California Emissions only & 1971 all...
Posted By: Mastershake340
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 10:14 PM
I bought an NOS one a few years ago, I've never taken it out of its plastic bag. Now you guys got me worried if it will work!
I have the original one off my T/A but when I bought the car I wasn't given a key for the cap.
20 years later the Mr. Norms sales folder for my car turned up and with it came a set of keys. I tried the key on my cap and it works just fine!
That cap is on my convertible now.
BTW, the guy I bought my NOS cap on ebay was in Mexico, and sold around 10 in a row a few years ago. I noticed the other day he listed another if anyone is interested. I had no problems with the purchase, he Fedexed it from Mexico and I had it within a week.
Posted By: gygeneral
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 10:45 PM
Altough I don't have a key for mine, I tought I should check mine. Here's a pic of what is inside, that particular part is not there at all in mine. It would be nice to get a hand drawing of the part so we can make a piece or better yet if someone would make a whole bunch.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/07/09 11:44 PM
1970 Challengers w/o N95 had
"NOT VENTED" gas caps
1970 Challengers with N95 had
"PRESSURE/VACUUM" gas caps
N95 was E.C.S. - evaporative control system - basically mandatory in CA only "California Emissions".
In 1971 all Challengers had a similar emissions package but were the parts the identical? My '70-'71 parts catalog makes this clear as mud ...............
FUEL TANK, CAP, Gas Filler Tube, WITHOUT VAPOR SEPARATOR1970 - Challenger chrome flip top - #3404 657
1971 - Challenger chrome flip top - #3466 435
Why 2 different part numbers? Is "WITHOUT VAPOR SEPARATOR" the same as w/o ECS?
& there is no listing for a non-flip top gas cap "WITHOUT VAPOR SEPARATOR" FUEL TANK, CAP, Gas Filler Tube, WITH VAPOR SEPARATORChallenger chrome - #3404 528
I know the non-flip top cars came with a body colored cap and the replacement was chrome.
Is this that cap? Again, it is only listed under "WITH VAPOR SEPARATOR"?
Shouldn't there be both a not-vented and a vented (pressure/vacuum) part? At least to cover '70 & '71? FUEL TANK, RING, F/Tank Filler Cap OrnamentChallenger - #3404 666
FUEL TANK, CAP, Filler Tube (Locking Type)Challenger - #3404 668
written in pen - is this the correct number?Challenger EXPORT - #3404 683
"NOT VENTED" & NOS on Ebay Clearly definitive information! 
Anybody have pictures of a "PRESSURE/VACUUM" cap, what are the differences?
Posted By: cataclysm80
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 01:27 AM
Quote:
BTW, the guy I bought my NOS cap on ebay was in Mexico, and sold around 10 in a row a few years ago. I had no problems with the purchase, he Fedexed it from Mexico and I had it within a week.
I was wondering how those auctions went. It seemed suspicious that he would post one right after another with the same pictures, and as far as I know Challengers weren't sold new in Mexico, so where would he get the caps from? I'm glad to hear that everything turned out OK!
Tav
Posted By: Challenger 1
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 01:41 AM
Quote:
Quote:
My NOS one had not been out of the bag before I bought it, it does not lock either. After I discovered that, I walked around Carlisle one year & talked to car owners that still had their originals. NONE of the ones we tested that day actually locked.
That's scary to think that all those $500 gas caps could be stolen so easily. I originaly was looking for one to use as a regular cap without locking it, but after finding out how much they cost, I'll pass. I'd never use such an expensive gas cap without locking it if I was going to leave the car unattended.
Tav
Yea me either, no way was I gonna put it on the car in a car show where you leave them overnite without it locking. I repaired the tang with JB Weld, been good for 5 years now. I was thinking, I'm not using this cap if it don't lock. Been working since 2004. 
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 01:50 AM
The low mile T/A (sold new in IL) has a "not vented" cap. I have not seen a cap yet that says "vented".
Does your parts book show 3404 683 ? It is not in mine. Someone found it for me once & said it was for an export car.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:04 AM
Curiosity got the best of me, I just took mine apart. The good news is that mine was an easy fix.
My tab was intact, but the bottom part of the housing was installed 180 degrees off, so there was no way the tab could hit the button to "lock".
Thanks for the photos & explanation Dan, that helped me spot the problem with mine.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:05 AM
Quote:
FUEL TANK, CAP, Filler Tube (Locking Type)
Challenger - #3404 668 written in pen - is this the correct number?
Challenger EXPORT - #3404 683 "NOT VENTED" & NOS on Ebay
gygeneral's pics appear to be a "VENTED" version. Any pics of the bottom with the "VENTED" and/or "NOT VENTED" script? Where does the hole opposite the screw holes vent to?
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:11 AM
My 70-71 book does not show 3404 668 either.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:13 AM
Not vented script from the low mile T/A. My NOS cap looks identical.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:19 AM
Quote:
My 70-71 book does not show 3404 668 either.
The 668 is in pen, what does your book show?
insides of mine - "NOT VENTED"
gygeneral's What's up with these two holes?
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:23 AM
Anybody know how the two pieces of "pot-metal" can be removed from the "chromed" steel piece?
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:31 AM
Quote:
what does your book show?
Mine just has part numbers for the whole J46 package, outer cap & all. It does have a different part number for the ECS version.
Posted By: ta340
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:49 AM
this is the part.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:50 AM
Not sure those part numbers are for the whole package?
I have a one sided 1460A page between 14-60 & 14-61 with GAS CAPS (14-86-35)
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:53 AM
Quote:
this is the part.
Yes, it should look like this .....
Posted By: gygeneral
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 02:59 AM
Well mine says " pressure vacuum"
Yes , that' how its spelled
What does that mean?
Posted By: gygeneral
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 03:02 AM
Another shot of those extra holes. I can't tell from here if they exit somewhere. I will blow some air in them tomorrow and post what I find.
I'm still puzzled about the "pressure vacuum"???
Anybody have any guesses
Posted By: gygeneral
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 03:06 AM
"this is the part"
TA340 OK I got it, and I now see the area where there would have been a tab.
Someone should make this part, just think of all the locking gas caps in the world would become functional all of a sudden
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 03:09 AM
From Beep Beep, no mention of ECS this time?
Posted By: HemiChallenger
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 03:11 AM
I have two originals, one 71 and one 70, 70 is not vented and 71 is Pressure vacumn. If you need pics i can take some...
Steve
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 03:13 AM
Quote:
I have a one sided 1460A page between 14-60 & 14-61 with GAS CAPS (14-86-35)
Aha!
A after the page number indicates an additional (new) page (or updated page in some cases) I have 1460 but not 1460A.
Can you please scan it for me so I can add it to mine?
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 03:44 AM
page 14-60A for the 1970-71
Chrysler Parts Catalog 
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 03:47 AM
readable1
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 03:48 AM
2
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 03:49 AM
3
Posted By: gygeneral
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 04:03 PM
"gygeneral's What's up with these two holes"
Well I took the rubber out, and those two holes are vented to two little openings, that would be outside of the rubber seal. See pic. Now, what does this mean? Is this one of those vented caps. Dont's forget the bottom of the cap says "pressure vacuum".
On a side note, what happens if you put a vented cap on when it should be a non-vented cap.
Posted By: 6bblgt
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 04:46 PM
I've edited some of my earlier posts, I had the caps bass ackwards!
Most 1970 model Challengers were non-E.C.S. and would use the
"NOT VENTED" locking gas cap. This sealed gas cap would prevent gas from exiting the tank. The gas tank was "vented" to atmosphere by other means.
1970 model Challengers with "N95" and all 1971 models would use the
"PRESSURE/VACUUM" locking gas cap. This gas cap would allow air to escape under pressure or enter under vacuum conditions. The gas caps on the E.C.S. (basically - sealed fuel systems) equipped were the "safety valve" for (excessive?) pressure or vacuum.
Posted By: RT_6_PakShaker
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/08/09 10:21 PM
Quote:
Anybody know how the two pieces of "pot-metal" can be removed from the "chromed" steel piece?
6bbl
try using a small flat screw driver and work carefully prying between the pot metal top or bottom and steel center piece, also you can try grabbing the pot metal pieces and try rocking back and for in opposite directions to get them to part from the center.
I have taken several apart for replating this way.
Posted By: Alaskan_TA
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/09/09 02:11 AM
Posted By: gygeneral
Re: 70 Chall flip top, locking gas cap color? - 07/09/09 03:03 AM
Quote:
Info on the 1970 ECS System, (N95 option code)
the pressure / vacuuum cap is mentioned at the second link, but I did not want to post it out of context.
http://www.hamtramck-historical.com/images/serviceHighlights/70%20sh%20125.jpg
http://www.hamtramck-historical.com/images/serviceHighlights/70%20sh%20126.jpg
http://www.hamtramck-historical.com/images/serviceHighlights/70%20sh%20127.jpg
Thanks , that's a good explanation of how that system functions. So I guess the two holes on my cap has somekind of valve in them ?? Maybe I have to go one step further and break the two halves apart and see what is there.
Posted By: B5EBody
Re: 70 Chall flip top, LOCKING gas cap color/wont lock! - 03/23/18 07:37 PM
Put it in the parts for sale section. And no eBay links are allowed here.
Posted By: B5EBody
Re: 70 Chall flip top, LOCKING gas cap color/wont lock! - 01/16/21 05:26 PM
If your Challenger locking cap dosen't lock, the problem is the locking tab on the disc shown in this thread is broken off. I have replacement discs I had manufactured for sale. I used one on mine and have sold a few more and they work beautifully. $20. Easy installation and cheap fix for a very expensive cap.