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Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones?

Posted By: domingo

Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 01:32 AM

Does anybody out there do a good repro of the Daytona Nose cones?

I was wondering if ther eis a need for a good quality accurate repro of these...
Posted By: ricomondo

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 02:10 AM


Depends on if you want steel or fiberglass.
Ted Janak is the man for steel parts. He also sells glass noses

http://wingedwarriorbodyparts.com/

or Dayclona

http://wingedwarriorbodyparts.com/


and there's another guy I believe down in the south (Mississippi?) but his name escapes me now.I'm sure others will chime in
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 02:16 AM

Supposedly there is also a very high quality piece avalible from a guy named Mike that owns a company called Dayclona...
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 02:44 AM

Quote:


Depends on if you want steel or fiberglass.
Ted Janak is the man for steel parts. He also sells glass noses

http://wingedwarriorbodyparts.com/

or Dayclona

http://wingedwarriorbodyparts.com/


and there's another guy I believe down in the south (Mississippi?) but his name escapes me now.I'm sure others will chime in






Hmmmmmm,.............Ted Janak, in Texas, makes a fiberglass nose cone, always has,

Dayclona,( That's me) in Massachussetts.......makes a fiberglass nose cone

Jack McGaughey, ...in Georgia, makes steel nosecones

Gene Gregory, in Indiana, ...makes steel nosecones



All of the above are the "Preimer" vendors for wingcar parts, each haveing their pros/cons......there are other vendors making wingcar parts, but they are the ones usually avoided.....


Be aware the wingcar market is very small, if your going to invest in a steel replica cone, your tooling return will probally never be seen?.......and if you think people complain about repro sheetmetal fitment problems now!,....wait until you deal with a few wingers!



Current market price of repro steel cones is $5K-$7K,.......Glass cones run from $600 for junk,....to $1500 avg for a quality cone



Mike

Attached picture 5259275-Mikesparts2%20026_3.jpg
Posted By: domingo

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 03:28 AM

How were they originally made??? Steel or aluminum???

I could make em by hand, with some "basic tooling" no real hard tooling. I could use one of my parts cars and a couple 70 charger fenders to test fit each cone to make sure they fit right with no problems. Its the same way I do the 64-67 HEMI scoops and MW scoops I sell and I have never had 1 single complaint regarding fitment or quality issues.

I could certainly do better than 5k for a repro steel nose cone.

Im just wondering if it would be worth it. I would plan on using a NOS nose cone as a pattern.
Posted By: LimeliteAero

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 03:55 AM

the noses are steel. Would you also be offering any of the support bracing/attaching items or just the shell?

I think it would hurt your efforts if you only offered the shell.
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:15 AM



I could certainly do better than 5k for a repro steel nose cone.

Im just wondering if it would be worth it. I would plan on using a NOS nose cone as a pattern.






Domingo,



The cones were steel, and they were hand made on kirksite molds, back in the day at a rate of about 16-20 cones a day with a 12-16 man crew,....many of the wingcar parts were handmade because of their limited production, and the bean counters influence,......so this equates to a lot of "sloppy" parts/fits,.........keep that in mind when working with NOS wingcar parts,....I've found out the hard way, that NOS wingcar parts are perhaps the worst line rejects to deal with, if your going to base your repros off of deminsionally,......a seasoned (off the car) original part is a much better canidate,.....if you feel you can offer a steel repro for a much better price on the market than $5K, it's your choice if you want to step in the waters,......but keep in mind, it's a very small market

Attached picture 5259625-mellon.jpg
Posted By: MLR426

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 02:52 PM

Quote:

How were they originally made??? Steel or aluminum???

I could make em by hand, with some "basic tooling" no real hard tooling. I could use one of my parts cars and a couple 70 charger fenders to test fit each cone to make sure they fit right with no problems. Its the same way I do the 64-67 HEMI scoops and MW scoops I sell and I have never had 1 single complaint regarding fitment or quality issues.

I could certainly do better than 5k for a repro steel nose cone.

Im just wondering if it would be worth it. I would plan on using a NOS nose cone as a pattern.



It's a very small market and alot of parts to
make for a complete operational set up. I think
with the number of people making stuff now your
to far behind in development to spend time developing it and make a profit.
Between Mike,Ted and Gene they have the market
covered with all the parts needed. There is also
another guy behind the seens making headlight
pivot brackets, latch trays, wing supports, Jacks etc.
You mentioned staying under 5k ?,
You would need to stay under 4 k on a steel nose
Also Gene's noses are steel, as far as I know the
others are glass but more affordable.

logan426
Posted By: dOrk !

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 02:59 PM

1500 clams for a nose ? ... guess what part I will consider making directly when my production gets on-line !

On that site ....why are there no published prices ?
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 04:50 PM

Quote:

1500 clams for a nose ? ... guess what part I will consider making directly when my production gets on-line !

On that site ....why are there no published prices ?









Eric, the site with no prices, I assume your taking about Janaks site,.......if you get a catalog from him, prices are listed, they change with the weather with him..........the reason for higher priced fiberglassed cones on the market, such as mine, or Janaks, are that they fit!, all flanges are there for all of the necessary bulkheads, light buckets, valance tabs, latch tray attachment, etc, and they are done in one lay-up, no pcs added later, to crack, or split under driving/road stress, therefore a much more complex moulding process to achieve a 1 piece construction, more set-up time, more "dress" time to trim out a peice, plus premium fiberglass supplies/materials equate to more costs associated to the finished product, my cone usually takes 40 hrs actual man hrs. from raw start(mold prep) to ship ready.....the cheaper fiberglass cones on the market, suffer from poor fit/shape, little to no flanges, poor lay-up, or choice of materials, construction, etc, and the ablilty to use factory, repro parts from other manufacturers,.....if your going to enter the winger market, there's only two ends to the market $1.98 wingers....or high end wingers, no in between exsists in this market,.....I didn't make the rules, just they way it is.......plus when you start a "wing" endeavor, most, if not all customers want the corresponding componets to go with your offerings,....because there's not many places to turn to for parts that interchange with other vendors offerings,.....wingcar part suppling has a way of snowballing your plans for production.....

Attached picture 5260367-customerscars.jpg
Posted By: dOrk !

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:03 PM

Mike .... prices that change with the weather ??.. !! ... whata' guy !... ....whata' way to run a BIZ ..

Just a couple of quick Q's .... how many parts is the actual mold ? ... what does the finished part weigh?
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:13 PM


Just a couple of quick Q's .... how many parts is the actual mold ? ... what does the finished part weigh?






By "parts" in the mold, I'll assume the molds constuction, not the number of attachment parts in the nosecone,.....my daytona mold consists of 10 sections that bolt together to create all the positive and negitive mold features needed to form all the nescessary flanges, internally and externally,......finished part weighs in at approx 40-45 lbs




inside cone view

Attached picture 5260402-Mikesparts2%20030_2.jpg
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:16 PM

.

Attached picture 5260404-Mikesparts2%20027_2.jpg
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:16 PM

/

Attached picture 5260407-Mikesparts2%20028_2.jpg
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:18 PM

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Attached picture 5260412-Mikesparts2%20026_3.jpg
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:27 PM

Eric,...then there's the bird cone, should you decide to add this to your inventory?...more surface detail, and deminsionaly larger than the Tona'

Attached picture 5260424-sbcone.jpg
Posted By: dOrk !

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:27 PM

Looks good ..... just curious -- why white gel-coat?

So your 10 pc mold bolts together? ... with pins and bushings ?
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:42 PM

Quote:

Looks good ..... just curious -- why white gel-coat?

So your 10 pc mold bolts together? ... with pins and bushings ?







Eric,


I can tint the white gel-coat to the customers color choice, within reason, black, gray, yellow, red, orange, etc for a favorable color underlayment depending on their finished car color, seeing the nose will be prone to road/rock chips,.....I use a premium marine UV stabilized Gel-coat versus the generic "gray" gel-coat, buy it by the drum crap that offers no UV protection to the mat underlayment



My mold is assembled using nylon pins for alignment, and nylon nuts/bolts for EASE of disassembly,.....if you know what I mean
Posted By: chrisf

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:52 PM

Quote:

1500 clams for a nose ? ... guess what part I will consider making directly when my production gets on-line !

On that site ....why are there no published prices ?



Doc, do you actually make parts? in the 10yrs i have been on here i have never seen anything you have done, just "i can make that" do you have a company or?
Posted By: dOrk !

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 05:52 PM

Interesting ... honestly ...I have never really looked at that nose in-depth before.

My multi-part one-piece fiberglass molding experience is somewhat limited .... but whan I have done-it I have used bronze bushings that are 'glassed into the part when the mold is being made and then steel rods are used to line-up the mold exactly. Then I used simple c-clamps or spring-clamps.

Just curious .. how many people/companies produce a FG nose ?
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 06:47 PM



Just curious .. how many people/companies produce a FG nose ?







at least 6 that I can think of, the poorest quality and cheapest coming from Showcars.com.....for around $500-$600,......the best quality ones on the market are mine and Janaks, priced in the $1400-$1500 price range,....
Posted By: dOrk !

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 07:02 PM

....Showcars ? .. how does that place stay in biz ? .... and how many times does a person who needs a nose .. buy that SC part ...and then ask-you how to fix it?

SIX people in that mix ? .. that is waaaay to many people making a part that has a very small market.

I withdraw my intent on making that part !!

do you have a pic of the nose mold ?
Posted By: Clair

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 07:35 PM

Quote:

Quote:

1500 clams for a nose ? ... guess what part I will consider making directly when my production gets on-line !

On that site ....why are there no published prices ?



Doc, do you actually make parts? in the 10yrs i have been on here i have never seen anything you have done, just "i can make that" do you have a company or?



In 1974 he did something but even Doc does not know what it was
Posted By: Redbird

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 07:39 PM

As someone that actually makes parts for Daytonas and Superbirds, Mike-Dayclona, has a pretty exact knowledge of how the very limited reproduction market for wing car parts actually works. I think he's given a pretty concise..., for him, discription of the different suppliers out there.

What is available has quite a range in quality and price. One of the biggest problems is interchangability of parts. For the clone builders, buying parts from several suppliers tends to create a 3 dimensional chess game of fitting things together. Trying to mix and match parts from 2 or 3 suppliers to save a couple of $ is at best a fools errand.

For folks with original cones, fitting reproduction parts into them is a similar 3d chess game. On unrestored cars the headlight buckets are often rusted. Combine 40 years of bumped, crushed, damaged cones with the starting out fact that there a lot of variances in the original delivered cones and this is recipie for a lot of hours at a workbench.

Probably the hardest part to make would be a steel Superbird cone shell. I can't see why anyone would attempt it with Jack Mc. making them already. The part is all compound curves. Even more than the other parts reproducing it well takes years of knowledge. A number of years ago I saw a stack of Superbird cone top pieces Jack had. To be able to produce them is pretty impressive. This is not something someone is going to be able to figure out how to do well in a month of study of a single part. If you could master the top then figure out steel sides, as of a couple of years ago Jack was still trying to do that.

Everyone wishes the parts were cheaper. What Mike and Jack tend to offer are parts thought out through years of trial and error fitting.
Posted By: SunroofSuperbird

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/29/09 08:26 PM

A Hot seller would be a complete headlight setup ready to bolt in. No One makes one and thats why you dont see many clones on ebay or for sale with working headlights. I would love to have a set. I have the Fiberglass repos and they are junk. and making the nose is the easy part as I made mine with almost no tools in my backyard and it is as close to orig as you could get.
Posted By: BERTS DART

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/30/09 01:05 AM

I think this one turned out nice!

Attached picture 5261242-TONA.jpg
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/30/09 01:38 AM

Quote:

A Hot seller would be a complete headlight setup ready to bolt in. No One makes one and thats why you dont see many clones on ebay or for sale with working headlights. I would love to have a set. I have the Fiberglass repos and they are junk. and making the nose is the easy part as I made mine with almost no tools in my backyard and it is as close to orig as you could get.








Marty,......My first priority in reproing wingcar parts was accurate fit and finish, trying to maintain the same materials and construction in parts, and trying to avoid "tweaking" them, as other vendors had to make the parts work their way......I made concessions in the nose cone material selection, choosing fiberglass over steel, as a steel cone, while desirable, is not affordable for most, due inpart to the tooling and time required to build one,..........another priority was working headlites, as original, my lite assys are offered complete, or partial in original form, and mateials, and can be combined with original or NOS componets if need be,....plus updated componets to retrofit originals to cure them of factory malidies,......my headlite assys are still the only true functioning assys avaliable as an original,......sure others have made the glass units work, but usually with a lot of voodoo.....

Attached picture 5261317-litebucket.jpg
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/30/09 01:41 AM

-

Attached picture 5261321-11-02-08_1650.jpg
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/30/09 01:43 AM

Quote:

A Hot seller would be a complete headlight setup ready to bolt in. No One makes one and thats why you dont see many clones on ebay or for sale with working headlights.



Attached picture 5261326-lightups.jpg
Posted By: DAYCLONA

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/30/09 01:49 AM

=

Attached picture 5261338-tonabeatsbird.jpg
Posted By: dOrk !

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/30/09 02:59 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

1500 clams for a nose ? ... guess what part I will consider making directly when my production gets on-line !

On that site ....why are there no published prices ?



Doc, do you actually make parts? in the 10yrs i have been on here i have never seen anything you have done, just "i can make that" do you have a company or?



In 1974 he did something but even Doc does not know what it was



Chris and Clair ... I just caught this.

Chris ....OPEN yurrr eyes ! .. there have been many people post pics of my product and talked about it - when I was here first - even during my "vacation" - and now. And yes I had a shop up until '99. It is a complex story ... but that shop and all the molds are gone.

The reason for a re-start of the biz? ... everywhere I go(even though most of my customers I never met) I am asked why I stopped building parts and then am asked to get-back into it.

The real major kick-in-the-pants was that Car Craft magazine mention in '06 ... that has prompted me to get-back-into-it.

Clair .... 1974 ? .... what was that ?? ... I only had maybe 25 molds then. So it could not have been much.

In 1999 ...I had maybe 400 molds. And some of those were "officially" Chrysler and Fords.
Posted By: dOrk !

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/30/09 03:05 AM

Quote:

As someone that actually makes parts for Daytonas and Superbirds, Mike-Dayclona, has a pretty exact knowledge of how the very limited reproduction market for wing car parts actually works. I think he's given a pretty concise..., for him, discription of the different suppliers out there.





Yes ...and Mike was very nice about this whole deal here with me. But IMO .. the small market for winged-cars is tooooo crowded as-it-is.
Posted By: SunroofSuperbird

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/30/09 01:07 PM

Hi Mike now yes that is a good looking headlight setup. Thats the way it should be sold. How much is that setup $
Posted By: 6PakBee

Re: Does anybody repro the daytona nose cones? - 05/30/09 01:49 PM

I try to keep this list up to date as I have a '69 Charger just waiting to get 'pointy'.

Gean Gregory
Alhambra Auto Body
Box 235
Alhambra, IL 62001
(618) 488-7941
http://www.alhambracustomservice.bravehost.com/


Erik Nelson
(Board Member)

Jack McGaughey
www.wingcarfab.com
770-277-8086

Stinger Fiberglass
http://www.stingerfiberglass.com/products/

Janak Repros
www.wingedwarriorbodyparts.com

Showcars
http://www.showcars-bodyparts.com/charger.html

Dayclona Enterprises
http://www.officialdayclona.com/
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