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340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray

Posted By: mopar346

340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 03:13 AM

I need some good pictures to show my powder coater the basic engine paint overspray pattern.
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 03:42 AM

There was no "pattern" the manifolds were bolted on and painted with the engine, no effort was made to paint them (or not) most got a lot of coverage most of which burned off shortly after start up leaving paint on areas that didn't get as hot (mostly the flanges where they meet the heads and the collectors at the heat riser, etc.).

FWIW I don't see know how much help a powder coater is going to be in accomplishing a true factory appearance.
Posted By: autoxcuda

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 06:26 AM

There will be lighter covered areas on the block where the exhaust manifolds get in the way of the spraying paint.
Posted By: kentj340

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 06:32 AM

Quote:

There will be lighter covered areas on the block where the exhaust manifolds get in the way of the spraying paint.




Same is true of bottoms and flanges of oil pans, because the spray gun didn't get low down.
Posted By: mopar346

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 12:22 PM

Thanks guys, I am familiar with most everything you discribe and have described it to him. I just wante pictures to give him a visual and yes it would be tough for him to get the burned off effect, but the best chance he has is to have pictures.
Posted By: 472 R/T SE

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 02:45 PM

I always wanted to figure out a way to somehow preserve the overspray on the manifolds. The enclosed trailer look on a driver, .
Posted By: mopar346

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 02:56 PM

Well, I have seen hi-tem powder coating retain the look, I just don't have any pictures. Surely someone on Moparts has done it and/or has some pictures.
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 05:27 PM

As mentioned the manifolds masked areas of the block from paint and gun position left many lower areas bare or thinly painted. Since powder coat is electrostatically applied I'm not sure how they only cover certain areas while leaving others bare. Not to mention that even high temp powder coats will burn off of most manifolds. Are you planing to have them powder coat the completed engine with manifolds as an assembly?
Posted By: mopar346

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 05:55 PM

No not as an assemble, I hae seen what I a talking about at shows plenty of times I just cant find a good picture. It is completely cast color and then appears oversprayed at the top, heavy in the beginning and fading out as it gets further away from the flange. Here is one of the only pictures I can find.

Attached picture 7899058-IMG_1153.jpg
Posted By: mopar346

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 05:58 PM

....

Attached picture 7899061-IMG_1154.jpg
Posted By: MOPARMIKE69

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 06:30 PM

Pictures are not showing up. If you want to make it really factory you have to paint the engine and manifolds etc together. Also no paint on the manifolds before painting the orange. That cannot be done with the powdercoating process. You can "simulate" the factory process by painting or ceramic coating the manifolds off the car, and hitting them with paint around the edge, but it will only simulate the look.
My says you have to commit. Either have the manifolds look nice and not paint them with engine paint, or do it like the factory and have them burn off and rust. Or never start the car?
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 06:52 PM

Posted By: RJS

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 07:28 PM

I usually have them ceramic coated and then bolt on and shoot the engine.
This last set were powder coated silver/gray bolted on and shot.
Like Scott said whatever burns off burns off, why over complicate the process?
Ron

Attached picture 7899191-IMG_2669(Large).JPG
Posted By: 472 R/T SE

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 07:41 PM

Quote:

I usually have them ceramic coated and then bolt on and shoot the engine.
This last set were powder coated silver/gray bolted on and shot.
Like Scott said whatever burns off burns off, why over complicate the process?
Ron




For some people, it's part of the fun.
Posted By: mopar346

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 07:44 PM

That is the problem with my AAR, I get too caught up in aking it right or what is currently perceived to be right. It would be so much more fun to build it just to look good and be enjoyable.

Thanks for the input, on to another subject.
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 08:14 PM

YOU asked for "correct" and you got some good/accurate replies. There's no grey area ("currently perceived") about it. The way the facyory did it is well known and documented, doing it any other way is simply NOT correct.
Posted By: RJS

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/24/13 11:19 PM

That hanging motor turned to this:

Attached picture 7899412-IMG_2690(Large).JPG
Posted By: mopar346

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/25/13 12:37 AM

Quote:

YOU asked for "correct" and you got some good/accurate replies. There's no grey area ("currently perceived") about it. The way the facyory did it is well known and documented, doing it any other way is simply NOT correct.




I undestand, agree, respect and appreciate all the information supplied. I realize most everything known is pretty solid at this point but new information surfaces still today. The orange small block cut off for instance. At one time it was thought that the fender black out was done with a cardboard template covering the engine compartment and sprayed afer the body was pnted, it is now understood that the black was sprayed first. Cars restored to what was thought to be crrect 15-20 years ago are now moched for being incorrect, but that was info available at that time. Not arguing any points above, just tryng to be as correct appearing and durable all at the same time. I am very analytical many times to a fault, but that is something I have to come to grips with.
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/25/13 01:22 AM

Quote:

I undestand, agree, respect and appreciate all the information supplied. I realize most everything known is pretty solid at this point but new information surfaces still today. The orange small block cut off for instance. At one time it was thought that the fender black out was done with a cardboard template covering the engine compartment and sprayed afer the body was pnted, it is now understood that the black was sprayed first. Cars restored to what was thought to be crrect 15-20 years ago are now moched for being incorrect, but that was info available at that time. Not arguing any points above, just tryng to be as correct appearing and durable all at the same time. I am very analytical many times to a fault, but that is something I have to come to grips with.





Oh make no mistake, I agree completely on the subject of details that we either have wrong, will be discovered later, or possibly never be discovered due to the passage of time and loss of untouched original reference examples or factory supportive documentation. However, when it comes to the paint coverage on 340 exhaust manifolds that you specifically asked about, you can bank on the current knowledge being accurate, that's an easy one! Respect back at you!


As far as the 71 340 engine color cutoff date, so far all we have to go by are surviving examples, I have yet to see a factory document which details the changeover date, hopefully someday it will surface, but I sort of doubt it ever will. Concerning my post on the subject elsewhere, that was my attempt to share/add to a rather recent discovery, but that discovery didn't really change the (yet unknown exact cutoff date) but rather tossed in a "Never say never" example of a car that received an orange engine way past the blue/orange changeover date simply due to an earlier built engine being installed LONG after it was intended due to some problem with the engine or inventory.
Posted By: mopar346

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/25/13 02:28 AM

I agree the exhaust manifolds are known issues at this point. I have seen what I am talking about and it looks good in my opinion but yes only correct looking until they were cranked and run.

Above I think it was mentions to spray engine paint over the powder/ceramic coating and let it naturally burn off. Has anyone done that and does it leave a stain on the coating were the paint was?
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/25/13 02:49 AM

Quote:

I agree the exhaust manifolds are known issues at this point. I have seen what I am talking about and it looks good in my opinion but yes only correct looking until they were cranked and run.




Well not really since they first ran at the plant before the dealers received and sold them, this would make the freshly burned off paint (and any remaining paint) "correct" if being judged in O.E. judging, in fact even a small amount of surface rust is ok.

Quote:

Above I think it was mentions to spray engine paint over the powder/ceramic coating and let it naturally burn off. Has anyone done that and does it leave a stain on the coating were the paint was?





Yes people have done this and while it looks nice, and has a "faux" correct look, the coatings (any coatings) look different as compared to real raw cast iron and are therefore "incorrect". But if that's the look you are going for that's of course your choice, but if you plan on entering your car in high level judging expect to lose points for it.
Posted By: mopar346

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/25/13 03:02 AM

Not intended to be judged, just want it to be respectable.
Posted By: MOPARMIKE69

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/25/13 01:02 PM

Quote:

Not intended to be judged, just want it to be respectable.



Then don't paint the manifolds with engine paint. The only reason to make them look like that is for points. 99% of the people who see your car will not appreciate the burned off or oversprayed orange paint on your pretty manifolds DAMHIK!
Posted By: mopar346

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/25/13 03:23 PM

You are correct, most people will have no idea what they are looking at as far as the car goes much less overspray. I am not doing it for anyone else or there opinion, the deal is I will know and just prefer it to be that way. Even though I never sell anything, you also have to be aware of the difference in value of one the is nice and one that is close to correct. Truth is I much prefer day 2 and super stock cars or for that matter just plain junk but I just cant do it to this car.
Posted By: RJS

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/25/13 11:37 PM

Hey how many people look at Big Block Negative battery cables and just think your sloppy!!!!!
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms

Re: 340 exhaust manifold pictres needed - correct overspray - 10/26/13 12:23 AM

Quote:

Hey how many people look at Big Block Negative battery cables and just think your sloppy!!!!!





My take on all of the uneducated negative comments about proper restoration detailing is simple, I refuse to "dumb down" my restoration to appease the ignorant masses.
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