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Oil weight, which to use!
Posted By: superbeedave
Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 12:46 AM
Guys, need help with my dilemma. I have been running 15w40 Delo 400 with Royal Purple break-in oil in my 383 since I had it rebuilt 1000 miles ago. After comparing oils with Zinc/Phosphates in them I have decided to use Brad Penn. Here is my dilemma, should I use 10w30 or 15w40? I live in Ohio so temps. are anywhere form say April to October 50's to 90 degrees. Car runs 180 to 190 all day. Now, which do I use? I can get Brad Penn $50.00 a case which is 12 quarts, not too bad! Please help me with my dilemma! Thanks!
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 01:09 AM
Quote:
should I use 10w30 or 15w40?
the lightest wt that will maintain adequate psi. idle psi is not extremely critical if it jumps up as soon as you goose it & 8 lbs per 1000 rpm is adequate.
Posted By: sturmenater
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 01:14 AM
It depends if the engine was rebuilt sloppy loose or not has it been happy pressure wise with the 15w40.
If so stick with that weight. If it seems high at a idle when warm try the 10w30.
Im currently runing 10w30 in my fresh 440 no problems
Posted By: superbeedave
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 01:23 AM
It will run 65 psi hot at highway speeds down to 40-45 at idle when hot. Runs 75-80 when first starting up when cold with the 15w40. So
you think I should stay with 15w40? I have never tried 10w30 in it yet.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 01:26 AM
Quote:
It will run 65 psi hot at highway speeds down to 40-45 at idle when hot. Runs 75-80 when first starting up when cold with the 15w40. So
you think I should stay with 15w40?
no
Posted By: Pacnorthcuda
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 01:27 AM
40-45 at hot idle is pretty high, nothing really wrong with that, but it is indicative of a motor that would probably do just fine on 10w30, and save a bit of HP running the pump.
Posted By: dOOc
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 01:34 AM
Quote:
I can get Brad Penn $50.00 a case which is 12 quarts, not too bad! Please help me with my dilemma! Thanks!
50 beans for 12 quarts ? ... 
Posted By: 68-scatpack-rt
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 02:06 AM
Quote:
Quote:
I can get Brad Penn $50.00 a case which is 12 quarts, not too bad! Please help me with my dilemma! Thanks!
50 beans for 12 quarts ? ...
it's good oil! i use it in all my stuff. lots of zinc. 
some friends bought a pallet direct from brad penn and it cost them about 3.80 a qt. 50 for 12 qts is just over 4 bones a qt. not bad compared to other "designer" oil brands. 
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 02:12 AM
Quote:
some friends bought a pallet direct from brad penn
How did they go about doing that? I am a fan of it
Posted By: 68-scatpack-rt
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 02:17 AM
Quote:
Quote:
some friends bought a pallet direct from brad penn
How did they go about doing that? I am a fan of it
pretty sure they bought it at the pri show.
Posted By: RapidRobert
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 02:20 AM
Quote:
pretty sure they bought it at the pri show.
alright
Posted By: runner12
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 02:21 AM
I had alot of talks with the BRAD PENN people trying to set up a distributor they were very nice thruout he whole process. Talk to the guys who run it !! Plus its made local at the old kendall plant in bradford P.A. and the employees have a part in the deal ..and it works. thanks Nick
Posted By: gch
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 02:44 AM
10w30 with a zinc additive and you are fine.
Posted By: superbeedave
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 03:18 AM
I was under the impression that it has plenty of Zinc/Phosphates without having to add any additives. There is a oil company distributor of this oil within a few miles that they will only sell it in cases and not single quarts. The case of 12 for $50.00 works for me. And at $4.00 a quart you can't be it. The other guys can't even come close to that. Joe Gibbs, Zalt, Amsoil or even Edelbrock
and compcams oil can't seem to want to touch that price with a ten foot pole.
Posted By: CompSyn
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 08:57 AM
Quote:
It will run 65 psi hot at highway speeds down to 40-45 at idle when hot. Runs 75-80 when first starting up when cold with the 15w40. So
you think I should stay with 15w40? I have never tried 10w30 in it yet.
Well according to the trusty 1969 Plymouth Service Manual here, it's specifying 45-65 PSI operating pressure @ 1000 R.P.M. with a minimum pump pressure of 20 PSI @ 500 R.P.M.
But your oil pump could be doing excess by-passing with the 15W-40.
I'd still give the 10W-30 Brad Penn a try with NO aftermarket pour-and-pray motor oil additives.
CompSyn
Posted By: dOOc
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 09:01 AM
Quote:
...... with NO aftermarket pour-and-pray motor oil additives.
THAT'S a good one ..... 
Give ole CS a ceegar !
Posted By: CompSyn
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 09:27 AM
Quote:
Quote:
...... with NO aftermarket pour-and-pray motor oil additives.
THAT'S a good one .....
Give ole CS a ceegar !
Thanks for the props Doc. You know as well as any if one does his/hers homework, there's no need to play backyard chemist and mix your own....
Of course sniffing fiberglass fumes all day has a weird way hindering one's better senses 
That's a joke Doc 
Posted By: StealthWedge67
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 04:36 PM
Just an FYI for those that have not yet seen it: Summit Racing is now offering its own line of semi-synthetic, high zinc content, multi-viscosity oils. @ 4.95, the price is right! I just did an oil change yesterday in my 451, using the Summit 10w-40. Bottles say manufactured by I.L.C. in Brookfield Conneticut.
Posted By: MoparMarq
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 07:59 PM
Quote:
40-45 at hot idle is pretty high, nothing really wrong with that, but it is indicative of a motor that would probably do just fine on 10w30, and save a bit of HP running the pump.
Plus, it would be a real bummer to twist or break the intermediate shaft because of the excess torque required to spin the pump... 
Posted By: dOOc
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 08:10 PM
Quote:
Of course sniffing fiberglass fumes all day has a weird way hindering one's better senses
That's a joke Doc
Hey HAY ...I truly MISS those polyester resin and gel-coat fumes ....IN THE MORNING ! 
DID you see that article in the Car Craft magazine tooooo ? ... 
Posted By: PorkyPig
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/07/11 09:09 PM
The OP doesn't say zippy about the 383 build. Stock? Hot? Driven like an old lady or beat on like a rental?
Posted By: CompSyn
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/08/11 12:14 PM
Quote:
Just an FYI for those that have not yet seen it: Summit Racing is now offering its own line of semi-synthetic, high zinc content, multi-viscosity oils. @ 4.95, the price is right! I just did an oil change yesterday in my 451, using the Summit 10w-40. Bottles say manufactured by I.L.C. in Brookfield Conneticut.
Intercontinental Lubricants Corporation (ILC) better known for their Spectro brand of powersports oils.
I'd be interested to see a Product Data Sheet (PDS) of the Summit Racing Oil if Summit can provide one just to get a better idea of the flow characteristics of this oil.
Update: submitted a tech question, stand by....
Posted By: superbeedave
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/08/11 04:11 PM
My engine is more like a mild build. KB400's with .03 over, compcams xe268 cam with their matching valve springs, 906's with 3 angle valve job, 650AVS carb. The car is not driven like an old lady, just like a normal person. I don't race it. I drive 60 to 65 on the highways. I would estimate I'll let her loose about every other month usually when getting on the highway I will open it up to maybe 85 then back down. I will do a hole shot twice a year. I don't baby my Super Bee
but I do respect it cause I want it to last for as long as I do. And I am 51.
Posted By: ZIPPY
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/08/11 04:29 PM
Quote:
The OP doesn't say zippy about the 383 build.
He shouldn't, after all...I didn't build his engine
Posted By: CompSyn
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/09/11 10:58 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Just an FYI for those that have not yet seen it: Summit Racing is now offering its own line of semi-synthetic, high zinc content, multi-viscosity oils. @ 4.95, the price is right! I just did an oil change yesterday in my 451, using the Summit 10w-40. Bottles say manufactured by I.L.C. in Brookfield Conneticut.
Intercontinental Lubricants Corporation (ILC) better known for their Spectro brand of powersports oils.
I'd be interested to see a Product Data Sheet (PDS) of the Summit Racing Oil if Summit can provide one just to get a better idea of the flow characteristics of this oil.
Update: submitted a tech question, stand by....
Just got a response back from Summit Racing:
Quote:
Hi,
I don't have a Product Data Sheet. The only information that has been provided is: 1,800 ppm of zinc and phosphorous (ZDDP)
meets A.P.I. SL quality standards. - Ernie
So we know the ZDDP content but none of the other performance attributes are available.
Posted By: Von
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/10/11 12:09 AM
Quote:
1,800 ppm of zinc and phosphorous (ZDDP)
meets A.P.I. SL quality standards.
Im pretty sure SL rating was well below 1800 PPM of zinc. He must have meant SF or SG?
Posted By: Dr Lebaron
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/10/11 01:01 AM
Herb McCandless likes Z-Alt for the zinc. He also doesn't believe in any additives.
When Russ Flagle and Dick Edlebrock come to your house to 'play engines', I listen to what they say.
http://z-alt.com/
Posted By: superbeedave
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/10/11 01:22 AM
Okay, can anyone come up with the zinc/phosphate ratings for Brad Penn, Zalt, Amsoil and Joe Gibbs oil so as we can compare! To me there has to be hard facts and not just word of mouth. It seems to me that more and more muscle car owners with flat tapped lifters and engine builders are using Brad Penn oil. That seems to be the census. I just purchased a case of Brad penn 10w30 at $50.00. I still have a hard time accepting the fact that Brad Penn is manufactured by kendall oil.
Posted By: CompSyn
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/10/11 12:33 PM
Quote:
Okay, can anyone come up with the zinc/phosphate ratings for Brad Penn, Zalt, Amsoil and Joe Gibbs oil so as we can compare! To me there has to be hard facts and not just word of mouth. It seems to me that more and more muscle car owners with flat tapped lifters and engine builders are using Brad Penn oil. That seems to be the census. I just purchased a case of Brad penn 10w30 at $50.00. I still have a hard time accepting the fact that Brad Penn is manufactured by kendall oil.
How do we get past hearsay, marketing hype, and personal opinion?
I'd like to point out there’s much more to choosing a balanced motor oil product than focusing on one anti-wear additive alone, e.g. Zinc and Phosphorus (ZDDP). Don't get me wrong, we all want the proper amounts of ZDDP in our muscle car, but we also want a complete and balanced motor oil that can withstand the rigors of weekend fun street/strip duty.
Quote:
A motor oil has seven responsibilities:
1) Minimize Friction and Wear
The #1 function of a lubricant. Friction is detrimental to engine components and results in wear, so a lubricant must act as the barrier between moving parts.
2) Cleanliness
Internal cleanliness of an engine depends on contaminants being suspended, preventing them from adhering to engine components.
3) Cool Moving Parts
Engines rely on lubricants to help them run cooler by absorbing heat and moving it to a different location to be safely dissipated. The cooler the operating temps, the better your engine can perform.
4) Prevent Contamination by Acting as a Seal
Acting as a seal, motor oils help minimize combustion by-products from contaminating the lubrication system. Lubricants act as a dynamic seal in locations such as the piston, piston ring and cylinder contact areas.
5) Dampen Shock
In the event of mechanical shock, lubricants help cushion the blow. The lubricant film can absorb and disperse energy spikes over a broader contact area, reducing impact.
6) Prevent Corrosion
Corrosion of internal components can be reduced or prevented by lubricants, by either chemically neutralizing corrosive products or setting up a barrier between the components and the corrosive material.
7) Transfer Energy
At times a lubricant is required to act as an energy-transfer medium, such as in the case of hydraulic equipment or valve lifters in an automotive engine.
So what’s the point? The point is, you can have all the ZDDP in the world but if the oil fails in any of the seven categories listed above, it’s not a balance product and you probably don't want it.
So how do you tell if you have a balanced motor oil product? You can first get a glimpse of certain performance aspects by looking at the Product Data Sheet (PDS) if the manufacture provides one; most do. And if you really want to know, you can get a Virgin Oil Analysis done and then back that up by trending some Used Oil Analyses on the oil you’re using. It could be that the motor oil you're using right now is falling flat on it's face and you don't even know it regardless of the ZDDP content.
BTW, Brad Penn is not manufactured by Kendall oil. Brad Penn oil comes from the original Bradford, Pennsylvania refinery otherwise known as American Refining Group, Inc. This refinery is where the original Kendall GT-1 “green” race oil came from until ConocoPhillips bought the Kendall name. So today, the old Kendall is packaged under the name Brad Penn short for Bradford, Pennsylvania and the new Kendall product is unrelated.
CompSyn
Posted By: DennisH
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/10/11 12:45 PM
440. My builder recommended 10-40 Synthetic. I use AmsOil.
Posted By: superbeedave
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/10/11 04:47 PM
Wow! You learn something new everyday! Thanks for that lecture on oil.
That's some good knowledge. Sometimes I let my ignorances get the best of me!
Posted By: CompSyn
Re: Oil weight, which to use! - 03/10/11 11:32 PM
Quote:
Wow! You learn something new everyday! Thanks for that lecture on oil.
That's some good knowledge. Sometimes I let my ignorances get the best of me!
Thanks Dave. I'd just like to say my post wasn't meant to be a lecture per say or to make anyone feel ignorant. It's just information posted in an information forum. Guess that's how it goes, any one person may or may not find the information they read in an internet forum helpful.
