Posted By: mopar_man
413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/16/11 09:17 PM
Just pulled an old 413 I had in storgae out and have a look at it. Its a C413 also has ET41 stamped on the pad , 8 29 94.
Now the question is the cam is gear driven large gear on the cam small gear on the crank. Is this normal on 413s?
Posted By: buildanother
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/16/11 09:52 PM
If it has just the 2 gears and no chain, I wonder if it was a reverse rotation marine engine? Or some H D industrial? dunno.
Posted By: dOOc
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/16/11 10:19 PM
THAT'S a typical RV/truck engine.
That set-up cost Mopar big-$$ compared to a cahin ... but they were KINGS of the market back then.
Posted By: Stanton
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/16/11 10:58 PM
You could put that cam in any big block as long as you use the gears. Likewise you could use any cam in that block as long as you use a normal timing set.
Posted By: Yancy Derringer
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/16/11 11:36 PM
!!!! WAIT A MINUTE !!!!
Let's get this STRAIGHT!!!!
You are saying??
That there is a GEAR on the crank, and a GEAR on the cam, and NOTHING ELSE, no chain, no idler gears, etc?
THIS MEANS one of two things:
Either this is a reverse rotation marine engine
or
It's a normal rotation engine with a gear drive cam.
IF THIS IS TRUE you MAY NOT be able to use a standard distributor unless the dist. drive gear on the cam / driveshaft was ground 'reverse' to compensate.
YOU CAN EASILY tell if the distributor is "standard" CCW rotation for a BB / RB. Simply "spring" the mechanical advance. Easy---if the dist. is CCW rotation, you must "spring against the spring" CCW, and the spring will "pop back" CW
You can tell if the engine is reverse rotation by rotating it with a wrench and examining how the valve train operates.
If you have the starter, hook it to a battery and see which way it operates, then visualise it operating the flywheel. ---- OR --- "hand rotate" the starter drive to see which way it ratchets. (over runs). The starter obviously operates the other direction.
To put it differently, visualise the starter, as if you were viewing it installed, from the front of an engine. Visualize that as an engine starts (normal rotation) the flywheel rotates CW as viewed from the front. This means that the starter drive gear will be rotating CCW AND WILL RATCHET in that direction.
The chances of this being a "basackwards" engine is slim, but they do exist
Posted By: Stanton
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/17/11 01:10 AM
Reverse rotation ... only the crank turns in reverse, everything else is normal. Only the firing order on the dist is reversed but the dist still rotates in the same direction ... it has to to drive the oil pump so it sucks instead of blows!
If its a reverse rotation engine then the dist. gear would be the same as any normal big block and so would the cam. The crank would be turning counterclockwise but the cam would be turning clockwise because of the gear drive.
Posted By: Stanton
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/17/11 02:49 PM
You got it sunshine!
My guess is its a reverse rotation motor and here's why ...
If its a reverse rotation motor the only things they had to change were a) the timing gears b) the starter and c) the firing order. Everything else stays the same ... cam, dist drive, oil pump, etc.
However, if its a standard rotation motor with a reverse rotation cam then they had to change a) the cam grind b) the timing gears and c) the dist drive gear. For what ... what advantage is a reverse rotation cam ?!?!?
Posted By: mopar_man
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/18/11 02:24 AM
Will get a pic tommorrow. The cam gear is so large It looks so close the the timing cover housing.
Posted By: mopar_man
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/18/11 11:25 PM
ok . i got a pic of the cam gear and the pad , but the pics won't load . They are in jpg format. anyone know how to upload these so we can view them ?
Posted By: Turbo W350
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/19/11 12:50 AM
All 413 and 361 industrial engines used gear driven cams, nothing at all about odd here it's just a run of the mill 413 HD.
Posted By: rabid scott
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/19/11 01:29 AM
I still want to see a picture!
Posted By: dOOc
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/19/11 02:24 AM
I thought I had a pic ....
They are really a useLESS piece .... no one makes cams for them PLUS the cam-tech way-back-when is junk anyways.
If someone has a MH service manual .. there is a pic or two in there.
Posted By: mopar_man
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/19/11 02:46 AM
Thanks Doc , same pic as i have without the paint . So the cam spins in reverse
Posted By: cudaman1969
Re: 413 cam shaft gears.?????????????? - 02/19/11 04:25 AM
we had two 400 Chrysler engines in my dads boat. when we replaced them we got two short-blocks from machandles with two new 452 heads. we swapped the steel cranks (one clockwise,on cc) they both had gears and chains, the gear on the cam was different in each engine, was like a mirror image, lobes too,dist turned same on both,18436572-12756348. That a late model industrial motor, got different heads right.
...sorry NOT ALL did ... quite-a-few ? ...Yes.
