Moparts

"removable" radiator core support question

Posted By: moparx

"removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 03:17 PM

has anyone made the top bar of the radiator core support removable so as to be easier to replace engine/transmission assemblies ?
if so, how did you reinforce it for the bolt in attachment points ?
yes, i know about lowering/removing the K member, but this core support is being heavily modified for a crossflow radiator mounted in front of the support with a factory dual fan assembly mounted where the original [22"] radiator lived. i want to brace the top and bottom of the core support, as with the modifications, the top seems pretty flexible. [it felt that way before the modifications were started.]
TIA as always ! bow
beer
Posted By: Mr PotatoHead

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 03:21 PM

Id not cut my car like that, however I did buy on already hacked up and they did it ok, They took another top of the core support that was approx 2 inches longer on each side that overlapped perfectly and had a small triangle bolt hole pattern and when bolted tight I dont think im giving up any or much over oem status.

BUT DONT CUT YOUR CAR THAT WAY.
Posted By: Stanton

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 03:37 PM

I cut mine years ago and just used plates to bolt to. I doubt they provided any support. In hindsight, I don't think removing that section helped much - you still have to get the motor high enough to clear the crill support and grill unless you remove those also. The motor will come straight out the top if you can lift it high enough - gantry instead of engine hoist !!
Posted By: moparx

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 03:43 PM

i guess i'll re-think this more before i make any decision.
thank you guys !
beer
Posted By: topside

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 04:29 PM

You could fab welded-on flanges (aka "doublers") to bolt the removable section to.
Might be able to use the inner gussets at the fenders as a mounting point, depends on the car.
Or for that matter, fab a new crossbar that could also have an upper rad mount bracket, and bolt that to those gussets.

I once pulled and re-installed a SB in a Duster without even pulling the hood, but it was a really tight fit.
Had a Milodon pan on it, used a carb-flange plate & a tilting bracket, trans & headers in car, didn't scratch a thing.
While the OEM upper tie bar is weak fore-aft, it's purpose is side/side reinforcement.
Posted By: moparx

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 05:03 PM

my original plan was to fab a round/square tube upper with the radiator mounts [already fabbed from 16ga stock and 5/8" thick truck mud flap material] incorporated being removable, and reinforce the bottom with a piece of 1 1/2" square tube [with the already mentioned mounts incorporated] from frame rail to frame rail, tapering into each rail, being fixed, allowing for radiator and AC condenser removal.
beer
Posted By: rustbuckett68

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 05:05 PM

The older B vans had a removable top support section, Might be worth a look to see how it was engineered. Mines in a snow bank now or I would take a picture.
Posted By: AndyF

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 05:15 PM

Sure, people do it all the time. I cut the upper core support in my Coronet about 30 years ago.

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Posted By: AndyF

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 05:18 PM

The Duster project I'm finishing up had the core support cut. I decided I didn't like that approach so I welded in a new core support. Now the engine has to come out the bottom but that is okay.

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Posted By: jcc

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 08:10 PM

I cut mine and will on all my future projects.

On pic #57 below link you can make out most of the details. I'm running engine air intake thru 5 of the flared holes partially seen in the pic. At the time because of the added holes, I deepened the upper crossmember to gain some stiffness back, and lowered the radiator, which in my app is an additional plus. The only downside is, and I asked this question a decade? back here, isn't there an OEM "hidden" stamped vin/chassis number in this area (which my mod likely obliterated), and the LEO's use this sometime to verify a cars lineage.


https://board.moparts.org/ubbthread...4/62-polara-500-cruiser.html#Post1554264
Posted By: Mr PotatoHead

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 08:51 PM

Yep your risking removing or hurting the core support vin.

Some seem ok with it, to others its a bad bad hack. Might be ok on cars that dont matter, modded cars or like I used to do id cut them on cars id get the motor/trans out of but not a good move on a car with any real value.
Posted By: AndyF

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 08:55 PM

Originally Posted by Mr. Potatohead
Yep your risking removing or hurting the core support vin.

Some seem ok with it, to others its a bad bad hack. Might be ok on cars that dont matter, modded cars or like I used to do id cut them on cars id get the motor/trans out of but not a good move on a car with any real value.


Yeah I wouldn't cut the core support on an original Hemi or V code type of car but my '65 Coronet is an original 426W four speed car and I cut the core support on it. Some people might say it was a mistake but I don't see those guys in my shop offering to help me pull the engine so their opinion doesn't carry much weight.
Posted By: 340Cuda

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/19/20 09:13 PM

Originally Posted by AndyF
I don't see those guys in my shop offering to help me pull the engine.

I have no opinion of the core cutting but send me a plane ticket and I'll be there for you. :-)
Posted By: poorboy

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/20/20 02:31 AM

Cut the core support. Add a small piece on each side to bolt it back in. Its only metal, if the next guy doesn't like it, he can have it welded back in.
Then again, I don't picture myself owning anything valuable enough for such things to matter. Gene
Posted By: John Brown

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/20/20 03:49 AM

On my brand X cars, I used to drill out the spot welds that held the top bar. Used bolts to hold it in place from then on.
Posted By: Jjs72D

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/20/20 05:50 AM

When XV Motorsports began their development of their chassis reinforcement products, they found that the top of the core support was fine structurally but the bottom benefitted from additional reinforcement. This tells me that converting the top section to a bolt in setup may not cause nearly as many issues as some may think.
Posted By: dIc dOc Deity !

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/20/20 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by moparx
my original plan was to fab a round/square tube upper with the radiator mounts [already fabbed from 16ga stock and 5/8" thick truck mud flap material] incorporated being removable, and reinforce the bottom with a piece of 1 1/2" square tube [with the already mentioned mounts incorporated] from frame rail to frame rail, tapering into each rail, being fixed, allowing for radiator and AC condenser removal. Hi
beer


The CarrotVanMan has been working on them toooooo muchO !

This is eggZACKlee the way Caravans are set up !

Not a bad idea .. oleHam2!
Posted By: moparx

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/20/20 02:31 PM

Andy, your pictures was exactly what i had in mind for cutting the core.
the numbers on the support would not be affected, as they are far away from the cut lines, and this car is NOT valuable in any way with the exception it is an almost 19k original mileage 69 charger.
as the car was hit HARD in the rear when i acquired it way back in 1970, then abused at the dragstrip weekly until 1983, it has lead a hard life.
i will never restore it in my lifetime, so if the next caretaker decides to, well, that's his problem. biggrin
i do like the dimple die design in whatever photo i saw. [maybe JCC's ?]
beer
Posted By: Mr PotatoHead

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/20/20 04:16 PM

Good thing we treat our kids better then our cars.

Vs cutting your charger up, how many times in the rest of your life do you plan to pull the motor?
Posted By: 5thAve

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/20/20 11:39 PM

It's one thing to cut that out on a car that's going to be used for racing but for anything else why bother? Unless drivetrain changes are something you plan on doing regularely. It's really not that hard to work around it.
Posted By: GY3

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/21/20 02:37 AM

I guess I don't understand why? shruggy

I have a normal engine hoist and a deep sump pan on my RB and can easily clear the yoke. If I needed more room or had a hoist that wouldn't go up as high as I needed, I'd unbolt the front wheels and let the car down on a floor jack. wrench

Besides, grille is going to be in the way too!
Posted By: moparx

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/21/20 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by GY3
Besides, grille is going to be in the way too!


good point !
beer
Posted By: jcc

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/21/20 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by GY3
I guess I don't understand why? shruggy

I have a normal engine hoist and a deep sump pan on my RB and can easily clear the yoke. If I needed more room or had a hoist that wouldn't go up as high as I needed, I'd unbolt the front wheels and let the car down on a floor jack. wrench

Besides, grille is going to be in the way too!


1. Every car is different
2. When doing a swap with trans attached, by your self, it helps
3. And the extra 8"? until you get to the grill, which also is fairly easy to remove, makes a big difference
4. Nobody has yet made the case other then VIN number there is a real downside.
Posted By: moparx

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/22/20 01:09 PM

another thing to remember with this particular setup, i moved the radiator to the front of the core support because it is a huge crossflow unit, and there is a bunch of room that is unused from the backside of the grille to the front side of the support. the removable support like Andy showed on his coronet will work perfectly for radiator R&R, as well as any future engine work if needed.
as to the numbers on the top portion of the support, they are stamped in an area that is well away from any area that will be cut.
also, the top side is pretty flexible as is. i would like to stiffen that up some if possible.
beer
Posted By: R/T1968R/T

Re: "removable" radiator core support question - 01/23/20 12:58 AM

Welded tabs on then bolted it up. Painted it last so it matches. 68 Valiant 440

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