Why did they stop with springs in lower rad hoses?

Were they just deemed unnecessary, or are they just saving money? If my old hose had one I would have transferred it.

I think there's a possibility the hose may have collapsed a couple times in my Power Wagon while in traffic on hot day. Gauge shot up. Everything new including hoses, max cooling rad, milodon thermostat, milodon water pump, block flushed, new freeze plugs, and coolant distilled water mix. I couldn't get out and look at hose in traffic. I guess gauge could be faulty but temps went right back down when traffic started moving again.

Why did they remove springs?

Stronger materials and yes saving a few pennies.

Pure money savings. Just like when you buy a brake hose they no longer come with new copper washers.

I can tell you the only reason they put them there was for initial fill purposes only. It was NOT to keep the hose from collapsing in use.

They probably quit putting them in because they started using a new fill method.

http://automotivemileposts.com/autobrevity/moldedhosecoil.html

http://www.martiauto.com/faqfocus.cfm?qid=20

Thanks for that link, Supercuda. That was interesting.

Electric gauges? I'm thinking just normal temp bump from less air/water flow at idle.

I always transfer my spring when putting in a new hose. I don't care what they say, it IS needed! I helped fix a factory Hemi Dart that was overheating. I stood above his radiator as he revved it up and watched the hose collapse shut!

On my Challenger, I could watch my temp gauge climb on the highway. I put a lower spring in, and no problems since then.

So can one buy a replacement spring to put in a lower hose, if you wanted one?

I ordered from CJ Pony Parts. Lower radiator hose spring stainless steel small block 1965-73. It was $8.99

https://www.cjponyparts.com/catalogsearc...l+block+1965-73

I went to the local auto parts stores and bought a universal corrugated hose with a spring in it for 10.00. Pulled it and installed in my hose.

large pop-up sprinkler heads have stainless spring. just stretch it to length

It is my understanding that cooling issues in the conditions you describe is a cooling system issue, and that the high temps on the highway are related to the lower hose collapsing.

the 15 psi inside a proper cooling system should easily keep the hose from collapsing.

(sarcastic statement) Is this something they look for when judging a vehicle at the concours level?

Its called the Charmin Test. It is in the Judging Guide, look it up.

if your lower hose is collapsing your problem is not lack of a spring. It is something else.

Why does it collapse and what causes the condition needed? It's not lack of a spring.

I'm pretty sure that's not how it works There is only 15 psi in the entire system when the temperature is quite high. At 180 degrees there is a few psi on the output side of the water pump (that's what moves the coolant through the radiator, heads, block...) but the inlet side can very well be under suction. A lower hose collapses because it's being sucked in, which by definition means there is negative pressure inside it.

Now if there's a restriction in a clogged-up radiator, it's even more likely that the water pump will have vacuum at its inlet (the lower hose)...

Very well worded...

If the no spring is causing it to overheat at idle/low speed I would think it would be worse at high speed on the highway (with higher suction on the hose if that is linear) & he says it is OK then.

If you really want one it's not hard to wind your own - people have even used coat hangers for this! Stainless wire is probably a better option. Find a suitable diameter cylinder as a former and manually wind the wire around it.

Although it's being referred to here as a spring, it is not performing the function of one, so does not need to be from spring steel etc.

I also got 1 from CJ Pony, cheap and easy and it works.

Same here BDW...

JOe

So did I. Around $7 bucks if I remember right.

I've seen the springs at local parts stores to add to the lower hose. When I replace the hose I always swap the spring from the old hose to the new one.

be sure to turn the ends inward toward the center.

Never needed one!!

That's what I did when I pulled the old spring out and it was rusted as #$%^

Is the small block one from CJ pony parts, what we need for a BB Mopar? I see a small and big block option.

My brand new lower hose on my Power Powagon collapsed while idling in traffic on hot day here in Florida. First time I've had this happen. I noticed when temp gauge shot up and I popped hood and no leaks anywhere. New radiator, milodon water pump, thermostat....everthing is new in cooling system so I figured it might be that.

Also, I've noticed our Charger police cars have spring in upper hoses (reverse flow I guess?), so that kind of defeats the theory they were for factory fill purposes.

Go back and think about what you just said.

Not very helpful. If I missed something, excuse me! Can you just clear it up for me? Admittedly, I'm not a genius and might have missed something. But, I believe someone wrote they DON'T use springs anymore because they have a different method for factory fill, and that's what the springs were originally for, and NOT for eliminating collapsing hoses during consumer use.

My Power Wagon runs very cool otherwise. Engine runs great, and it will cruise all day long on the highway at 70mph, and will run in traffic for hours no problem. But that one time on a very hot day, bam, temp shot up and the lower hose was sunk in.

I've done a ton of work on this engine. Just about everything but piston rings. It's had complete valve job, new cam and lifters, radiator, freeze plugs, timing chain, water pump, thermostat, hoses, belts, plugs, wires, ignition, timing set, headers, dual exhausts. It's squared away. I've since bypassed heater since core is at rad shop right now being repaired.

It did not overheat in traffic that time because of something else. I'm going to get a spring for lower hose (or wire if you want to be technical). Thank you to those with helpful answers.

My truck is '79 with Max Cooling and HUGE lower hose.

Here’s my non-scientific pragmatic approach to it......

I’ve seen numerous vehicles through the years suffer from the “bottom hose sucked shut/engine runs hot” scenario........ where adding the “spring” fixed it.

It’s a cheap and easy thing to try........ if it doesn’t help, you’re not out much time or money.
If it does...... it was a simple cost effect solution.

If you’re having issues with the lower hose getting sucked shut..... it certainly can’t hurt anything to try adding the spring.

I agree ^

Going to try it.

You can also put a little tension into the hose when you install it to sort of "pre load" it. Just make sure you twist it opposite of the way the motor rocks when under load. I've had the same issue with some long top hoses that needed a little tweak.

No springs here and no problems either.

Coil, not spring.

If your hose is collapsing, that means the pump is evacuating coolant from the hose that is not being replaced from the radiator. Why not? Because the system has restriction(s) that is/are not allowing for adequate flow-----most likely the radiator, but it could be inherent design restrictions. Best to check for good flow.

If you are familiar with fluid pumps, a hose used on the suction side is very rigid, in order to prevent what we are talking about, but that's an open system---it doesn't loop under pressure like our systems do.

^^^ I learned something! I would add it, from a rod of stainless welding rod (maybe gratis at a welding shop) & continue the search if things are running too hot. #1 accurate gauge #2A too hot at idle/low speeds or 2B to hot out on the highway. & if so then what parts (shroud/stat etc) are you running? & rad might be partly plugged EDIT a partly clooged rad might not show up at low speeds but more likely will at high speeds so if it is OK at high speeds then it ain't the rad.

as easy as it is to fab and install, the spring [or whatever you want to call it] in the lower hose can't hurt anything, especially if you have a long section of straight hose, and if there may be some trouble getting all the air out of the system.
just my opinion, and i could be [more than likely !] wrong. wouldn't be the first time !

At $8.99 it's cheap insurance.

moparx and Montclaire I agree.

I appreciate the help from all and I know it's kind of a long thread so I don't think all read all my posts. The radiator is brand new. Now I suppose a brand new radiator could be clogged, but as I also wrote and pictured, I had the engine out, freeze plugs out, water pump out and flushed the block out, bypassed heater core. Yes, factory shroud in tact.

It never runs HOT on highway nor idling all but that one time, and I now have 800 miles on it since engine out. I don't think the temp gauge is dead on, but it's close. It just shot up that one day in very hot weather in very bad traffic. And it did immediately drop back down as we moved on.

RapidRobert; stainless welding rod. Um, good idea.

Pieces of rusty coil have been known to find their way to water pumps, sharp ends have pierced hoses...it IS possible for things to go wrong. Stainless steel is advised.

I once used an antenna-----that was a beech to coil up!!!

Larry did you do that blue paint job? Good job!

you are absolutely correct !! i should have been more specific, as i use a stainless wire every time i do this.
so, to those that are "rollin' 'em at home", use stainless wire to do so ! .075 wire or so. don't go TOO large, as it will NOT be "fun" to wind over whatever you use to fit into your hose. also, remember the wire will relax to a bigger size after it is wrapped around ??? to form the coil, so take that into consideration as well.
make sure you bend the coil ends to roughly a 90 degree inward, so as to prevent the ends from damaging the hose when you wind it in.