What cam would I have used in the 70's

I were going to "soup up" my B engine back in the 70's what cam would I have used ?

Crane Fireball.

Direct Connection Purple Shaft .509 lift 292 duration Hydralic cam.
Oh, and don't forget the Holley #3310 750 cfm, Edelbrock dual plane, and some Hooker Headers attached to a pair of Thrush mufflers.
All while listening to your Radio Shack 8 track player, with some
KISS or maybe a little Foghat...

You question is a bit vague. Some will say a purple shaft.

I like old vintage cams, big and stinky but some dont.

There are from time to time some good old vintage cams on ebay, her is a current one for a BB and it almost looks to me like you could use a new oem spring or still a single, but im not a BB or cam expert but here is the link.

Pretty mild but above stock it seems.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Big-Block-Chrysler-Dodge-MOPAR-V8-Speed-Pro-CS-181R-Performance-Camshaft-Cam/182798760006?epid=23009291102&hash=item2a8fa7b846:g:LkQAAOSwXedZz6jF

You should probably post the combo you have now and what your expectations are.

Isky 1012B was popular at the beginning of the '70s.
The 1012C was another one I heard about a few times.

Using a vintage Weiand intake and cal custom valve covers on the B engine (400) I’m putting in my ‘73 Barracuda. Thinking of keeping Old school cam too. I’m not racing so it’s not particularly important that my combo isn’t awesome.

You're definitely well on your way.

Those look like 346 head castings from the "II"....

Don't forget the Mallory Rev Pol, Voltmaster coil, paint the headers white, etc etc. Or maybe Accel dual point + super coil + yellow plug wires that always seem to be covered with grease stains. Definitely consider using solid core plug wires to cause as much radio interferance as possible. That's how they did it back then....

from the '70 Hustle Stuff catalog * RACER BROWN SSH-25

http://www.4secondsflat.com/RB%20Cam%20Specs.htm

Zippy nail it
OP, that old intake may make you change your mind on using after driving it a while
I have one of them on a new small (464C.I.) stroker (3.91 stroke) pump gas motor 440 motor now with a 850 DP, I'm anxious to see how it works

Use the 509 so it runs like crap with that carb. Then you'll get sick of driving it and park in the shed where it will become a barn find in 30 years. I think the 509 cam created the barn find Mopars since the engines ran so poorly with them. The 509 + 850 DP combo turned lots of nice 440 engines into stinky, plug eating piles back in the 70's.

But the .509 cam with a Holley 3310 vac. sec.Edelbrock CH4B//727 w/3000 stall convertor/3.91 8-3/4 is the way to go.
I used that combo back in the day in my factory stock headed 440 C Body, and it ran low 14:20's @99.5 MPH, in a 4600 lb. convertible...on street tires with full exhaust as well.

Yep these are the hipo 346 heads ! I have actually been considering using some of those other components you mention that are available to me

That's cool!

I have no idea what this intake will do. The reason I got the 400 is for future stroker build. But that’s not a priority right now and since this engine I got is running in decent shape I’m going to run it. I’m the carb I have is a 700 annular discharge.

The 509 is definitely an option !

Absolutely! Just like that Kiss Alive II !

It was a barn (field) find when I got it ! Lol

your safest bet is the old street hemi grind.

Do you want to run a hydraulic flat tappet, solid flat tappet or which type cam and lifters?
I would stay away form some of the older cam grinds, especially the Mopar Purple shaft JUNK
I see so many people on here advocating them(they have always, until recently, been cheaper in costs than any other brands out there and I wonder if those people have ran anything else
I sold a friend a Mopar Purple Shaft 284 street hemi grind for a 383 motor going into a 1968 Charger with power brakes, he owned a automotive garage and it was for one of his bigger commercial customers Son car. I help him degree it, it had right at 4.5 inches of vacuum idling at 850 RPM in gear, enough to stop once good in traffic and not again in traffic very well
He ended up buying a R.V. cam kit and installed himself straight up dot to dot
The kid ended up wrapping that car around a power pole within the year of the motor work
Take your time on the cam selection and make sure and degree it regardless of which brand or grind you choose

That's strange... must have been something else wrong since you degreed it for him. Huge vacuum leak maybe? I put that exact same Purple Shaft cam (284/.484) in my basically stock 383 rebuild. It idled with a very minor lope at 13" vacuum at 750 rpm!

The Hemi cam in the 70s was a .465 225@50, 80s .471 228@50 and ran power breaks no problem.

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Yep these are the hipo 346 heads ! I have actually been considering using some of those other components you mention that are available to me [/quote]

Thought so...the markings on the heads have always helped me. It sounds like you're right on track. This is probably too detailed, but if you can find any of the goofy old metal cal custom type plug wire looms, and maybe the T handle valve cover bolts they would look right at home. having looked at alot of working mans/budget hod rods when I was a kid, this is the kind of stuff they usually seemed to have.

That 509 cam might not had been the best choice for street performance, but it sure sounded like it was! That bad boy gave the motor a sound of its own.

Like a lot of stuff back in the day, the performance level highly depended on the guy doing the tuning. Some guys had the touch, and others pretended they had the touch. It seemed as though the guy with the touch could make any combo work, and the guys without the touch might have ended up with one combo that worked pretty well, so they stuck with it.

If you really want performance, I'm not so sure any of the old cams would stand up against the newer stuff, but if you want to look and sound the part, the old stuff is hard to beat. Gene

I'm surprised no one said to use a 3/4 race cam

I agree and that’s true today too. My original plan was to use the Hughes whiplash cam. But I had a thought that I may just keep it old school. 😁

Hahaha yeah. That’s the first description I was ever given of a performance cam - in a ‘68 camaro 😂

this, and anti-pump-up lifters

My first thought was did you want a 3/4 or full race cam.


Tim

I was told by a local Mopar Purple shaft lover, he is very knowledgeable on Mopar V8 B&RB motors , that Ma Mopar had change the LSA on that camshaft, RB&B motor street hemi 284, 484 grind back in the mid 1990s or so
I bought several other Mopar brand camshaft later before abandoning them all due to the "590" grind not having .590 net lift I called them, Mopar hot line, about it and I was told they had change vendors and they knew it wasn't .590 net lift now but they had dyno the cam and they weren't worried about the loss of .040 lift

I know they changed the LSA on the hydraulic .509 and made it much more driveable, so other cams very well may have changed too. But the .484 that I bought was waaay back in 1984, so original

Anyway there aren't many cams (outside of "4/4 race") that idle at 4" of vacuum!

the isky 1012b was the '64 s/s wedge race cam; 320 degrees duration, .520 lift, 108lsa, a lot of cam. the 1012b was superseded by the racer brown stx series; stx21, 22, & 23. the ssh25 and 284-.484 are identical for all practical purposes. the real issue may be how much head modifications your willing to do to run a high lift cam. there are 114lsa versions of the 284-.484 and 292-.509. in my opinion, none of the above.

What about the old Street Hemi grind 280-.484 ?

509, Torquer 383 intake, 3310 holly, 383 with stock 67 heads, Manley pop up .30 pistons, 68 street hemi converter, 4.88 gears in a 70 all steel Duster. 11.67@117 mph. Idled nice at 600 rpm (after carb work) all back in 1979. Tried 750-850 dprs, never made any difference. It had the M/T valve covers and stock dist (one tiny spring) with a MSD 6 and the yellow Accel coil and wires. Hooker fender well headers with 12" extensions. A little 2 gal Moom tank and a Carter electric pump, 3/8 aluminum line. I might have had $500 in the whole car. Forgot to add, snorkel scoop on the steel hood. Makes me wish I had it back.
get the 509 and don't go overboard with the carb, no Russel fittings, no braided line, no wire looms, fiberglass fan, Moroso air cleaner, no shiny stuff.

You can't get the old Street Hemi grind cam from MP anymore. I ran one in my 413 when I rebuilt it in 88, it was in my 300 and had zero problems running power brakes or the HVAC controls. The new version is different.

I ran the hydraulic purple cam 284-484 with crower anti pump-up lifters.

Back then mine where Racer Brown or General Kinetics. Never owned a purple cam.

hi

crower monarch in my 413 in 1969-70 !

I thought everyone ran the vaunted 3/4 Race Cam.

Used one too in my 383. Later swapped it for a Stage III solid lifer cam. Was also running Stage III heads. Had to modify the intake for that of course.

In 1981 when I was building my first 440, I bought a Crower Monarch 280H for $66.

280/280 advertised, 224/224@.050, 110lsa, 460/460 lift.

That was a decent little cam.

my first performance cam was a crower 201hj; 284/.480. best running little street cam I put in my 383 road chicken.

In 1987 I switched from the purple shaft hydralic .455 RV cam with a Holley 650 vac. sec. to that .509/292 purple cam in my 1969 300 440 big block, with factory oem compression(10 to 1) and stock 906 heads (except for a fresh valve job with stock valves). And the Holley 750 #3310 carb. It made a HUGE NIGHT AND DAY DIFFERENCE in performance! I had power brakes, which worked fine with that .509 and it idled around 800 RPM or so in gear. That big car could do tremendous burnouts, AND keep up with new Buick Grand Nationals on the street !

The "hemi grind" was available through all of the 70s. It had 284°/284°, 0.465" lift and 60° OL. I don't know when the rest of the "purple shaft" DC cams came out, but in 1976 Ma Mopar was still recommending the Racer Brown SSH25 and SSH44 hydraulic cams. I tried one of each before I went to a Crower solid. My buddy was running the mini-express with mushroom tappets. That thing was Bad Azzzz.

Yes the MP Mushroom cam and Lifter .690 lift

With Speed Pro 11.5 (Boat Anchor - Heavy) pistons

on Sunoco 97 or Shell 95.5 gas

I think when racer brown died and the business changed mopar changed.

There are actually two Mini-Express mushroom cams, the 316 duration (278 @ .050) with .654 gross lift, and the bigger one 328 adv. (don't know the .050) with .690 lift. My '82 D.C. book says the .690 "loses some low speed torque"...

I built my 451 around the smaller one. Reground to restore lobe taper and now .652 and 272 @ .050. Has a really nasty idle, 6-7" Hg at 1000-1100 rpm. Should be fun once I get the A-body reassembled this fall

On my list of “1000 things I’d like to test on the dyno(that will likely never happen)” would be a cam shootout between the old racer brown/DC grinds(ssh-25 and ssh-44)including the hemi grind, vs the updated MP 280, 284, 292 cams, vs the old school Comp 280, 286, 296 Magnum cams, vs the newer Comp Purple Plus 280, 284, 292 cams.
Then toss in some “fast rate stuff”... the Comp XE/HL 275, 285, 295 to see how it all compares.

3/4 race or full race cam

Wow, 15 cam changes! Don't forget to degree them all.

back in the day a friend had a '70 cuda with a 440 6-pak in it. he used a racer brown st21 and swore by it.

If you were to guess, what do you think you'd discover?

Tested on a motor combo good enough to exploit the faster rate cams, and all cams tested using lifters with similar bleed rates, I would expect the faster rate cams to make more power than their slower counterparts........ up to the limiting rpm of the lifters.

Aside from the peak power numbers, I’d be interested in seeing how much higher(if any) the older profiles would rev before the valvetrain got unhappy.

Another test along those lines I think might be revealing would be to try and find some lifters with a nice slow bleed rate, then sort through a tray or so of new stock replacement lifters, find the 32 with the highest bleed rate......... then test the slowest bleed rate vs the fastest bleed rate on the cam that ran into stability problems at the lowest rpm...... and the one that revved the highest before getting unhappy.

The 440 I bought for a core in 1981 had a pretty new DC 292/510 cam in it..... the ssh-44.

I put it in a box, but installed it years later..... actually a couple different times.
The last time was when I was selling my old 448.
I seem to recall it not having any problems turning 6500rpm on the dyno with springs set up at 125/325 and stamped rockers.

That was probably close to 20 years ago now.......... and I’m pretty sure it’s the last time I had a hyd cammed BB Mopar rev that high.

Another test along those lines I think might be revealing would be to try and find some lifters with a nice slow bleed rate, then sort through a tray or so of new stock replacement lifters, find the 32 with the highest bleed rate......... then test the slowest bleed rate vs the fastest bleed rate on the cam that ran into stability problems at the lowest rpm...... and the one that revved the highest before getting unhappy.



My head hurts now.

How do the older oem rate? Ive some sets from the 70-s long before they started putting the nice machine marks on them to get the crown.

Thanks Dwayne.

My thoughts are similar. It's as much about the lifter as the lobe profile.

My guess is that the fast rate would probably make more peak if the lifter stays compliant. But if it starts to give it up after peak, the old school still might have greater average hp/area under the curve, ie making the car faster.

My 383 with the new hemi grind and 30 year old lifter will pull decent to 7000 rpm, despite peak power probably at 6000-6200.

Russ, by the “new” hemi grind...... you mean the 280/.474-110?

I never tried one of those.
Seems like there was some deal where it came without lifters, and by the time you bought the lifters the cost ended up being quite a bit more than a 484 or 509 cam & lifter kit.

If I stumbled across a NIB one now I might pick it up if the price was right.

Fundamentally I like solids so much better it’s unlikely I’d ever use it in one of my own motors though.

In 1975 I used a crane solid 590 cam in my V code Cuda but it was 13.1 and .030 over. Car had insane torque and power. And 2 miles per gallon. lol

Mike

back in the day all aftermarket except mopar cams and hemi cams had the same chevy grinds on there cams do yourself a favor and let someone with the understanding pick out a real mopar cam for you later is far far better

racer brown ssh 25/44 with a ch4b or dp4b intake and hooker super comp headers. carb of your choice, starting with at LEAST a 650dp, all the way up to one of those holley "3bbls". 3.91-4.56 gear and b&m holeshot/super holeshot converter.

Yes, that's the one. I actually like it. But when I put that one in long ago, I changed a few other things so I cannot really say what improvement were cam related.