360 LA - Driver's Side Lifters Won't Pump Up. Found It!

Long story short, we picked up a fresh, never-fired LA 360 about a year ago for my Goddaughter's '70 Duster. It had been built by a reputable shop. I usually build my own but due to being in a hurry we just picked this one up locally off of CL. I pulled the pan and it looked like a quality build - nice and clean, rods and crank had been ground on to balance, casting flash ground off of the block, bearing clearances good, etc.

It's a pretty basic 360 - about 9:1, '587 heads, Eddy Performer RPM, #1406 600 cfm Eddy, mild hydraulic flat tappet cam. Don't know the cam specs.

It's been running fine for the last year and about 6000 miles. A month ago it developed a ticking noise. I found 2 collapsed lifters on the driver's side, #3 & #5 exhaust right next to each other. I yanked the intake, inspected the cam lobes (all good) and ordered 16 new lifters. Might as well replace 'em all.

Anyway, swapped 'em all out with cam lube on the bases and lobes, and oiled the sides. Verified they all spun by hand. Everything went back together real nice. Changed the oil and filter with 10w-40 break in oil.

Fired it and after about 3 minutes at 2000 rpm I shut it down because it was rattling away. Didn't want it to destroy itself.

Pulled the valve covers, and the passenger side was fine - everything nice and tight. The driver's side I could easily push down the pushrod side of every rocker and bottom out the lifter. I also noticed a LOT of oil on every rocker of the driver's side; the passenger side looked normal. Oil pressure is fine @ 60 psi.

So, what could these 2 issues have in common - all lifters on the driver's side not pumping up, and excessive oil up top on the same side?

that is a strange one, If anything strikes me I will toss it out there & do keep us posted.

I`m not sure about the excessive oil part but it seems to me that a cam bearing might have spun.

Only thing that comes to mind is if that left bank galley plug by distrib was left out. But I believe the oil pressure would be lower.

I agree. I would have to have a looky see at the cam bearings and look to see if the bearing oil hole is off.

I have had high mileage cam bearings flake off in layers/small areas around oil hole (babbit gone and copper showing) and the pieces clog oil hole along with scoring the cam.

where is the oiling chart when you need it? follow that looking for problems with oil galleys to see how they feed the lifters?

maybe pull the dist and hand prime/oil it while trouble shooting.

even tho the symptoms dont add up, some lifters went bad (it happens) but the only part that was changed to correct that was the lifters so I would focus there & compare one of them to one of the new ones (oil hole/cup height/oil hole) & see if anything is different. Yes I would drill prime it CW & see what you see. turn dampener to 20 ATDC #6 compression firing for the drivers side head to be oiling and 90 deg (1/4 turn) BTDC #1 compression for the pass head oil passages to be lined up. alot of SB have 3 partial slits on the dampener (every 90 deg) in addition to the full TDC slit & if not then cut a strip of paper 5.694" to use as a ruler. Keep us posted!

With more thought I think I would first put a 1/8 NPT gauge (they're cheap) in the sending unit top port at the rear of the block & drill prime & see what you get. I'd do that before I lined up the oil passages.

I actually did this on a 360. Cold pressure was fine, idle pressure hot was about 15 as I recall. Easiest way to check for this is remove the distributor and use a priming rod. If you forgot the plug, it'll look like a river of oil.

you can pull the oil sender and use a piece of wire down the hole..it should be about 7" down.

I know there is a chart with exact measurement for the cup plug to be. but about 7" to see if it is there is ez enough.

may want to check the plugs behind the cam thrust plate?

The lifter galleys are not fed through the cam bearings, the rocker shafts are. The right lifter galley is fed through an oil port from the pump, it travels to the front of the lifter galley to an oil port down to the FRONT main bearing. There it distributes oil to the crank shaft and up to the front cam bearing. The port to the left lifter galley feeds off this same area. If there's no oil getting to the left lifter galley the front MAIN bearing may have spun, blocking the port. If the main bearing is in place check the cam thrust plate bolts, make sure they're tight. Check the plate for cracks. Something there is keeping oil from the left galley or letting it massively bleed off.

Godscountry - Thanks! That's a huge help. I was wondering how the galleys got oil.

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Here's a pic of the area I'm talking about. This is the top, front main bearing seating area. There are 3 ports there. One comes down from the right lifter galley, the center one goes up to the front cam bearing and the other port goes up to the left lifter galley. Now this is a '69 340 and there is a lot of room in the cavity on this block so even a spun main bearing would not likely block oil travel, BUT, I've seen some later blocks where the cavity here wasn't nearly as deep and a spun bearing could block it. There are also different cam thrust plates, some are completely flat and some have notches coming from the lifter galleys. If your block doesn't have the plugs in the galleys (some do some don't) and you have a plate with the notch or groove in it, that could be bleeding off oil to the left galley. Just some things to look at.

Thanks to everybody for their responses; I'll get to it this weekend.

You've gotten alot of love on this one, be sure to post what it ends up being.

My money is on the internal plug at the back of the valley next to the dissy drive gear.

One thing not done I'm sure, did you prime those new lifters with oil? Right there in the service manual. Fill a can with oil so the lifter is covered, push plunger down just like bleeding brakes. Thing that's got me is why only 2-3 lifters pumped down and not all on that side after 6000 miles? If there was a plug in that lifter bank you would of had that problem from the get go. There could be a plug that's not quite plugging, allowing some oil through to keep that side up marginally. Like one said, cam oil holes has nothing to do with lifters getting oil.
Take out the back lifter on the bad side, remove distributor and use a drill like you're priming it the first time, check how much oil is coming through that missing lifter hole. It'll be pretty obvious what's up.

I got to spend a little time on this today, so...

First pulled the distributor and verified the plug is installed in the rear of the driver's side galley. (Was hoping it wasn't; that woulda made a simple fix). Oh well...

I pulled the rockers and shaft from the passenger (good) side, removed the front lifter, and spun the pump with my drill. Peered down inside and saw lots of oil coming out of the exposed hole, so reassembled that side and moved to the driver's side.

Did the same as the passenger side - pulled the front lifter and drill spun the pump. Nothing. Nada. Not even a trickle.

Sooooo, apparently there's a blockage between the 2 galleys. Since they intersect under the number 1 main, the crank will have to come out just to check.

Anybody have ANY more ideas before I go thru all that hassle? Everybody's input is greatly appreciated.

p.s. This telescoping magnet I got from Harbor Freight years ago makes lifter removal simple with the intake still on.

Here's the patient. Originally a /6 stripper, over the years we've converted it to 360/727/8-3/4 and the full Hotchkiss treatment.

Before dropping the crank, remove the cam thrust plate, you'll be able to see the lifter galleys behind it. If there are small push in plugs remove the one to the driver's side. You may have to drill a hole in it and install a screw to pull it out. You'll be able to see where the port comes up from the main. Look for anything that could be restricting it. I've seen large chunks of silicone sealer blocking ports. If you don't see any, rig up an air nozzle with about a 6" long tube on the end, bend the end at a 90 degree angle so you can blow air down through that port to clear any obstruction. If that doesn't clear it drop the front main cap, you'll know if that bearing has spun. You could also have something blocking that port junction (silicone sealer chunks). If you don't find anything in the driver's side port check the passenger's side port where it goes down to the main bearing, there could be something blocking that, if anything accidentally got into the lifter galley before the lifters were installed, it would be pushed to the front where the port is and clog it, use air or vacuum to clear it away. Good luck.

I tore down the front to get to the cam plate to see what's up. Found these goofy plastic/rubber plugs behind it. Huh? Never seen these before.

The passenger side had a metal cup plug behind it - visible in the first pic above. The driver's side did, too...way back in the hole, blocking the galley. Solved! many thanks too everybody who chimed in, especially Godscountry340.

Here's the driver's side:

Never seen them before either.

weird, a quick googleimage search seems to point to the plugs being in those holes.



are you saying the driver side plastic plug got pushed into the hole there blocking the oil feed to the lifters?

are those 9/32 plugs past the vertical feed in your picture supposed to be there too?

I've torn down many small blocks before and never seen those white plastic plugs.

The metal cup plugs seem to be hit and miss; some engines have them, some don't.

The 19/32 metal plug in the driver's side was installed way too deep - between the oil feed hole and the galley, effectively blocking all oil feed to the galley, and hence the lifters never getting pressurized oil to pump them up. It should have been driven in just to the front edge, with the oil hole exposed behind it.

Agreed, the front edge of the oil hole is ~.297" back from the front vertical face on the pass side & ~.383" on the drivers side. I have some Dorman 555-009 mini cup plugs that are ~.594" dia & look like they might be a hair too big (dia), maybe, not sure but iirc I have used that Dorman # in the past. I shoulda measured the height of that plug.

When I took apart the untouched 340 in my Dart last year. There were no metal plugs installed by the factory behind the cam thrust plate. My understanding that this was common or normal?
The new block soft plug kit had those plugs in it so I installed them in the front ends of the galleys based on advice here. I also remember someone saying to just install them flush with the surface of the block so not to block the passage that leads down to the #1 main bearing.
Again, good learning information here...

Ok, lots of posts but did I miss it - you did nothing to the front of the engine and all of a sudden these plugs move on their own ?

Is that what happened here ?

We bought this engine about a year ago as a never-fired fresh rebuild. I usually build my own but looong story short, we needed one in a hurry.

I swapped out the rear sump truck pan for a center sump car pan. While the pan was off everything looked real good: balanced rods and crank, bearing clearances right on, etc. We buttoned it up, primed it, and fired it. Ran great for about 5-6000 miles before the lifter tick became noticeable.

My guess is that the original cam and lifters were re-used. The lifters must have held their original prime until a couple bled down and wouldn't re-pump up. That's what started this whole mess. The drivers side never got any oil to the galley because that metal cup plug was installed way too deep, between the oil feed hole and the galley, effectively blocking it off.

As far as those plastic plugs are concerned, I don't think they had anything to do with the problem. I've just never seen them before.

Never seen the plastic plugs, something someone tryed for some reason???? Who knows. But the metal plugs started getting used around 1970. Should be flush with front of block. oil pressure supposedly goes up 10p.s.i. with the metal plugs behind the thrust plate. With solid lifters the plug on drivers side is intentionally driven in deeper to turn oil off. Some one might have originally set it up with plans for a solid lifter cam and switched plans to hyd cam and forgot they set it up for solid lifters.

Ding ding ding I do believe we have a winna.

This was bugging me last night, and got me to wondering if that plug was intentionally set in there deep - I mean it's pretty obvious with the oil hole right there staring you in the face.

So, your theory of blocking the galley for a solid cam makes sense. I've never run a solid in a small block, so I did some research and found the modest common method of blocking that galley is to drill and tap the hole from the #1 main saddle and install a set screw. Obviously the plug installed deep does the same thing.

Oh well, at least I know that front main bearing got plenty of oil!

Thanks again to everybody for helping me out.