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4 speed guru's please read!

Posted By: moparrush

4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 06:16 AM

I am buttoning up a rebuild on an 833, and when I went to put the bearing retainer on it did not want to seat down all the way. I checked the new Mopar Performance piece I had against the old piece. I had to replace the old one due to cracking around the holes. Anyway they checked out fine. So after taking some calipers and measuring the height of the bearing sticking out above the snap ring it turns out that the new bearing is out approx. .025" taller than I'm assuming the old bearing that I pulled out. Unfortunately I tossed the old bearing during a rebuild, as I didn't think there would be an issue.
Has anyone ever ran into this problem, and if so what did you do to correct it? I went back to the parts store where I purchased the bearing to verify it is the correct bearing, and the other ones they had in stock were the same way. Do I need to just turn down the new retainer the .025" and call it a day, or what? Thanks for any help.
Posted By: Jim_Lusk

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 06:20 AM

Call Passon and see what theirs are. I never get trans parts at regular auto parts stores.
Posted By: moparrush

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 06:29 AM

I got the parts from a transmission specialty supply house who deals in nothing but transmissions.
Posted By: Jim_Lusk

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 06:31 AM

Then there's something wrong. Either the new bearing retainer is wrong or they got a bunch of wrong bearings. I do have two brand new 18-spline retainers out in the garage, but we haven't had to replace one yet so I don't know if they are good.
Posted By: tecmopar

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 08:18 AM

Most times when this happens its the large snap ring that comes with the bearing, its to thick. If you still have the old one, try it.
Posted By: moparrush

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 08:22 AM

I don't know who manufactured the bearing, but everything else lined up and fit right other than the fact it sits approx. .025 higher than I'm assuming a factory bearing did. Who knows maybe more chinese crap slipped into the parts supply system. There is more than enough meat on the bearing retainer to chock it up in a lathe and just take the extra .025 out so that it tightens up against the four speed housing. I don't forsee having to do this again, and this is a spare four speed anyway that I just wanted to refurb while parts are still available.
Posted By: moparrush

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 08:25 AM

I checked the snap ring depth and it's okay. The problem is the distance from the snap ring to the top of the bearing is where I'm getting the extra .025". Now I'm not allowing for gasket crush, but that can't be more than .003 approx. I just want to make sure that I'm not overtightening the bearing causing premature failure. It's just a retainer not a load bearing part.
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 02:00 PM

Quote:

I got the parts from a transmission specialty supply house who deals in nothing but transmissions.




But did they give you the RIGHT bearing ? there is a specific bearing for the 833 , there are also others that are the same number , but the wrong suffix and that could cause the problem you see , plus most of the bearings are now sourced from china and it would not surprise if they made it wrong.
Posted By: 62maxwgn

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 02:10 PM

I have three complete sets of new bearings.Two are Timken,one is Bower.Snap ring grooves are the same.The snap ring on the Timkin's are half the thickness of the Bower and its probably close to your .025 .
Posted By: Supercuda

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 02:12 PM

So, you are saying the bearaing sits flush to the case but sticks out too much?

i had a sorta similar problem once when I installed an oil slinger in a case that wasn;t originally equipped with one, but I can't remember the exact details, been about 6 years.
Posted By: 64dodge572

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 02:44 PM

Quote:

Most times when this happens its the large snap ring that comes with the bearing, its to thick. If you still have the old one, try it.



I agree, most likely the snap ring
Posted By: moparrush

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/25/09 11:28 PM

A buddy of mine called today and he has the factory setup for the snap ring and bearing. I'm going to take it over there tomorrow and measure the differences to see where the descrepany lies. Thanks for the info, and post what I find.
Posted By: moparrush

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/28/09 02:27 AM

Ok, the resolution to my own problem update. I went over to a buddy's house who had multiple four speeds sitting around and it turns out that I had the right 307 bearing, but the snap ring the manufacturer of the bearing had put on it was too wide. Possibly a snap ring for an overdrive tranny, but the one that came with the bearing was too big. So after swapping with the original snap ring, the bearing retainer went right on and no more interference issues. Yea! So don't throw out that old snap ring when you go to buy a new bearing as you just may need it. Thanks for the replies.
Posted By: tecmopar

Re: 4 speed guru's please read! - 02/28/09 09:04 AM

Glad you got it fixed, thats why after all these years I never tossed the snap rings, just the bearings.
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