Hopped up 318 questions

Hello moparts,been away for awhile life happens . Im seeking advice on a 318 i built along time ago. I copied the engine masters build " cheep as dirt 318" to the letter (if youve never heard of it google and it pops right up)except engine masters used 360 smog heads and the macine shop that built the engine for me swore up and down 318 heads was what i should use ( keep in mind i am pretty green at this time ) they made a great argument and i gave in they sold me a set of good 318 302 castings smog heads for 50$ and closed off the smog ports for me all the machine work that would have been done to the 360s the 318 heads got stainless 2.02 valves and all i didnt have any issues with the engine except it liked to shove push rods through rocker arms but ill be putting in a set of harland sharps this go around to counter that with all that said my questions are :
(1) was the 318 head swap a good move for making power ?
(2) anything i could do with this combo to make it more powerful?
Thanks in advance ive always found good insight here and as i get back into my toy box i call a shop im sure ill be needing help from more experienced folk .

What car will the engine be used in? Transmission? What gear are you running out back? Need more information?
302 heads are good heads The heart shaped chambers give great combustion.

Got a link to this "Cheap as dirt" deal?

IIRC it was like 2005 2006 and that link dont just pop up for me.

Need alot more info on your combo and really your looking for more power????

Tenners are fun, cute, pretty, words like that, but if you really wanted power why did you go with a 318 base?

Im in the middle of building such a "cute" 318 with simple kb399 slugs, ect and have some new 318 casting as well as some 2.02 J-s and so im interested in your project here.

port the heads. get quench. get a "reasonable" SCR. custom cam for your app. dial in the dist subsystems/AF ratio. EDIT good exhaust manifolds/free flowing ex with mandrel bends. You can use free flowing (louder) muffs up front then a pair of cherry bomb glasspacks alongside the rear springs for addit'l muffling.

Were the heads cut ? there is a reason the pushrods are going threw the rocker arms. Comp 260 cam and set of 1.58 headers and go a set of 3.55s will help too

Found the cheap as dirt like. scroll down a little bit.
http://www.automotiveforums.com/t876812-discuss1967_barracuds_engine_work.html

Ill try to answer every one first it used to be in an 84 swb b150 yes a van and it was fun i think the vans had 3:55 rears and i was running long tubes and 18" glass packs no pipes heres the link to the youtube vid i made of it after i got it mpstly buttoned up https://youtu.be/a9cxNdnAp5I
Keep in mind this was back in 2012 ish ?
Anyways its now going into a 72 scamp it also has long tubes for abody ill be bolting it to a 904 that im gonna have professional built to keep up with the 415 hp this engine is supposed to make maybe a 2000 stall converter it will see the road some so i dont want to get too wild in the stall department the rear is the stock rear with 3:70something that the previous owner told me they put in it after the 360 they were running in it broke some teeth i question how true any of that is .... but ill definitely put something in it better suited for my goals but that another thread for another time

I didnt want to build the same big block everyone else was 318s were mine for the taking and i had a crap load so it just seamed like the thing to do

Glad you asked first i found put the hard way that you cant use the stock push rods with this build and they didnt mention that with that cam and lifter set you have to get trick flow push rods that are like .177 shorter (dont quote me) i called summit ( because i bought the cam from them ) and told them about the rods being too long and they sold me the trick flows ( oil thru the center like chebbys which is kew) so if your thinking about this build keep that in mind as for push rods coming thru rockers summit also told the harland sharps were recommended for this build because the dual coil valve springs generate 910 lbs on the rocker arms compressed and stock stamps cant hold that at high rpm ( obviously) btw ive had it rapped up to 8000 with pedal to go but its the most evil sound ive ever heard from an engine and it scares the crap out of me .

If i was building from scratch id build a 360 stroker 408 because i have a -8 360 on my shop floor but this engine is already built im just going thru it before it gets rehomed into the scamp and while i have it open i wondered what i could do to squeeze a few more torques out of what i already have

thats not the one i did ill try to find it and post a link

Whats the full rundown on your 318 if you can post it, you list pretty wild spring pressures and rpm as well, so what ya working with?

Well i looked for the cheap as dirt build that i did but its not coming up anymore and i cant remember exacts specs of some of this stuff so if something i say sounds off it very well might be lol
Stock block stock crank and rods clevet bearings keith black "pop up" domed pistons set at 0 deck
Comp cam 275hl extream energy 210° duration
502 intake lift ( unsure of exhaust lift but i remember it was close to 502 also duration could be wrong this is all from memory ) flat tappet hydro lifters trick flow push rods hi vol oil pump completed the bottom i also used a stock timing set which i know now was a no no and will be going with a double roller this time
Heads
Stock 318 smog 302 castings 2.02 stainless intake ( i think they were Manley but i know they came from mancini ) exhaust was .1.70something not sure but Swedes machine sayed " biggest you can put in small block heads crane locks and retainers crane springs dont remember the pn but supposed to be 910 lbs im pretty sure stock rockers and shafts ( another no no ) performer air gap intake 1 inch open spacer amd 750 dbl pumper i ran a stock two wire distributor base and msd wires cap rotor and 60,k coil ngk plugs timing was set standard 8 degrees before and it didnt seam to mind
FOR WHAT ITS WORTH
it lopes like a stumbling idiot at about 800 rpm and it will jump to 8000 faster than the dam tach can get there sounded like a pissed banshee from Hades at that rpm and as a novice hot rodder who just dumped 5000 into an engine i didnt bring it that high much as for power ot was definitely more powerful than a stock 318 but i never dynoed it all i can tell you is it pushed a 3500lb van with a best time of 15 flat and like 98 mph with a stock 727 and stock 355s so im hoping it would do much better in my little scamp with a purpose built 904 ( i want that quicker first gear) a 2200 stall and maybe 4:10s in the rear

This one?

http://www.hotrod.com/articles/mopp-0409-318-engine-build/

or this one

http://www.hotrod.com/articles/0810phr-chrysler-318-engine/

The later one reads quite close in parts used but neither is the one i copied

One last one

http://www.hotrod.com/articles/318-small-block-build/

Still not the one i did but specs are close i guess there were lots of versions of this build i found the link but its useless because when you click it it takes you to hot rods web page that sayes what your looking for has been moved or removed

Must be the old PHR article, somewhere I saw it recently, can't remember where though.

I have the print out that i carried like a bible to all these places and shops to show them what i was doing but havent located it uet

When I was doing my 302 heads I discovered that there wasn't a lot of room under the spring retainer. In other words, with an installed height of about 1.600". the springs would be close to co8il bind with a cam with lifts over 0.500. But not to worry because by that time the retainers would be pushing against the valve stem seals. I'd make sure there was enough clearance and the spring was right. The best one as far as fitting in the space seems to be the Hughes 1110. It looked like it would allow the most lift of the single springs.

Steve Dulcich is the man for writing articles on the 318 and he has I think three different 400hp 318 stories out there. He's used 360. Magnum and 302 heads. The 302 heads required a lot of work and reportedly cracked soon after. Look at Steve's article "Junkyard Jewel" for more information. There is a lot of material in the top of the port around the valve guide, and the guide itself. The pushrod pinch is also a choke point and it is pretty thin so be careful.

Before you do anything, though, get a price so you can do some comparisons. ProComp has a cylinder head in the affordable range, Edelbrock and Promaxx have decent heads, higher money. I don't know what the Sidewinder heads will run, between the high and low, I guess.

Dogdays gave the best answer yet IMO.
Also, IMO, the 318 / 302 heads up top the 318 was OK IF well ported. If they were stock, I suggest firing the machinist from any performance work in the future. The 360 out flows the 318/302 head by a lot. It takes a good bit of porting to get the 302 head to
Perform better than the stock 360 head.

As mentioned above, look into a better head made of aluminum. Better flow, lighter weight, better material, larger valves and a better spring selection with greater lifts available to you. All OOTB better for comparable money.

I see and i kinda thought that aswell i had thought about a good set of aluminum heads since every one sayes there better than stock amything anyone know what my best option for heads in bare form ?

If your using the kb399 domed pistons that might limit your choice and as well keep in mind is what your going to gain going to be more then your going to loose with the heat dissipation with the al vs iron head.

Port volume on the al. heads are going to be min. 170cc and thats a good bit for a teener.

The pro comp at 64cc then take away your 6cc dome and your at 58cc.

When I factored all this into my lil 318 I just deceded to use my worked 2.02 J heads.

It is a bit of a catch 22. Spend a comparable amount of money on the iron heads vs aluminum heads that should be checked out before machining (more $$$) or just port the OE head?

A iron 360 head can go pretty far. Ported, it is comparable to the aluminum. But that is about as far as you can go while the aluminum head can still yet be ported!
IMO, there is nothing wrong with a ported 360 head. Let's just say it ports out as well as OOTB Edelbrock heads. Price out the cost vs the Edelbrock head and a few bucks more
For machinist checknup before use.

Catch 22!

Then you got to ask is it all worth it over a 318, I tonight found a snafu in my 318 block thats probably a $300 fix and im not impressed with the 85 truck block it acts as soft as butter.

Ive a older 318 block, do I want to toss 4-500 in machine work in it....not really but I could reing ring it with new bearing and such for next to nothing.

Ive had my ready to bolt on 2.02 J-s with a really good three way vj, surfaced, new ss valves on CL for $600 with zero calls.

Im tempted to sell the nos 318 castings, balance assembly, all 318 related and just toss in the 360 ive here on a stand, I just wanted a 318 back in my duster like it came with.

SOOOOOO when does on give up on a teener for a 360 that can match or beat it with just a simple bump in compression.

You know what they say about a fool and his money (thinking of myself).

One gives up when the fun or challenge stops.