motor gurus, I need help

Beautiful warm day here today and I decided to drive my old car. It has a 360 with a whiplash cam. I started it up and it was making a loud tapping/banging noise from the left side valve cover area. I pulled the VC and everything looked OK but I'm thinking I might have a stuck lifter. It's sat all winter but I've never had this happen before. Anybody have insights? Thanks in advance.

agreed, a lifters innards may have become stuck. You might press straight down on each rocker (lifter side) with a wooden hammer handle & the problem child will change tone when you are on it. (eng idling). EDIT If you pin it down to (1) then you could pull it with the long claw tool & clean it.

OK. Do you think I could get the lifter out with a magnet? I have one of those that stretches out to make the reach easier. I'm thinking it's worth a try.

Yes. I just recently pulled one of mine w/a magnet

Sounds like I have a plan of attack. Thanks guys!

Let us know what you found....

Did you let it warm up before stopping the motor? If not go drive it for a while, 20 + minutes to see if it will unstick and pump up

No I didn't. While I'm pretty sure it's a lifter, what if it isn't? I've never heard one this loud. It's not a tick or tap, it sounds like a rod bearing is out, only on top. Kinda creeped me out. It ran fine when I parked it for winter so I can't think of anything else but I want to tear it down first. Going out now.

OK, since I wa fairly sure it is a lifter I started it up again. I got it warmed up and noticed a miss but the clank never went away. I pulled the VC and checked the push rods for slop, nothing that screamed here's the problem. I spun each rod and the 5th rod from the front would not spin. I pulled the rockers out and pushed down on the 5th rod, spongy. All the rest are tight, like they're sitting on iron. I pushed the rod down several times and felt the spring pushing back. I'm going to put everything back and see what I get.

Sometimes an exhaust leak can sound mechanical.
What ever you find, let us know and good luck to you.

I just put everything back together and it's no better. For what ever reason the 5th lifter isn't pumping up. My biggest hope is that I've not damaged the cam. I'm going to have to pull the intake next friday afternoon. (my first 8hr day) What sucks the most is, it's an AC car, lots of extra stuff to pull off. I hope it's just a bad lifter and not a wiped out lobe. I'm more of a body/paint guy than a mechanic so I'm out of my element. Wish me luck.

If the face of that lifter looked good then the cam should be fine.

Replace that lifter. I had the same problem on a 318 years ago and a new lifter fixed it.

I have high hopes that it's just the lifter. The fact that the others will not compress when I press on the push rods, but this one feels springy, is my hope. The fact that it's making so much noise and is consistent says that something is moving a lot and moving consistent, hopefully because a cam lobe is moving stuff. I'll know when I know.
Can I pick up a new lifter from advance or will I need to go back to Hughes wheer I bought the cam, springs, and lifters?

wouldn't hurt to talk to Dave & pick his brain, he's an easy guy to talk to. Offhand I'd say any lifter would work fine & you do need to go thru the cam breakin procedure again just like if it was a completely new cam/lifter breakin. EDIT I would open up the bad lifter & see if anything you see is wrong especially since you will be swapping it without removing the intake & an easy solution would be nice. what would be real good is if you had an identical new or used lifter (some are different inside) & could compare its innards to the bad one & depending on what I found I might even swap some of those pieces cuz a cam breakin is a bit of a pain & it is the outer lifter bottom to lobe contact that is critical but you might just want to be done with it. Actually I think it has a bit of dirt in there & cleaning will fix it. Holler how it turns out.

I bought 2 new lifters from Hughes Engines.(1 spare) I bought new break in oil and a pair of filters. I plan to swap it out sat, break it in, do an oil change back to reg oil and swap out a leaking PS pump and hose. I will tear down the lifter just to see if I can determine why it failed.

Just for chitz & giggles check the converter bolts.I had one loosen up,,,,,,,,,,,,,I thought it was a rod bearing.

Go drive the car for more than enough time to get the oil temps up above 150 F to see that hot oil will fix that lifter.
Motors absorb water by condensation into their inside when sitting in cold weather, no matter where you live I saw that happen in the Mojave desert in late March and April when it was no lower than 60F outside air temps at night
Water and other things will stick in the little valve inside the lifter causing what your experiencing, trust me on that
Run it down the road at a steady cruising speed of above 2100 RPM for enough time to get the oil hot and that should help it get better
I quit buying The Mopar brand Purple Shaft cam kits due to their low quality lifters sticking and ticking like your is doing now
We lived in the Mojave desert where it would be 105 F in the day and drop down to the upper 60s F at night, we lived in one of the better spots in SO CA in the Mojave desert, north 30 miles it got up to 117 F during the days and 85 F at night, the further east, north and south you went in that desert the hotter it got
Good luck

Lifters rarely(as in very rarely) go bad(fail) from sitting.

I would have run it for quite a while before changing any parts.

If the lifter simply refused to pump up, it's almost certain there is a tiny piece of debris in the lifter.

Take it out, take it apart, spread all the pieces out on a clean white paper towel....you'll probably be able to find the reason it won't pump up.
Remove debris, reassemble, submerge in a cup of oil, pump plunger up and down a few times.......it should pump right up.

Obviously, while it's out...... Inspect the face for abnormal wear.

I had a brand X that had a "stuck" lifter clattering. Even after it was warmed up it was still banging away. I put it on fast idle and started pouring a quart of ATF in it and it magically pumped up before the quart was empty and never clattered again as long as I had it.

Beats taking it apart if it works.

Kevin

OK. Broke it down today. PS was making no noise but I found #2 push rod bent and #1 rocker broken. So, I'm going to replace all the lifters, push rods, and rockers. Down till parts arrive. LA Poop!

How do you get a bent push rod and a broken rocker from sitting all winter? Did you spank the car before putting it away?

I don't know what happened but I had thought the banging and clanging started after I had backed the car out of the garage. I had convinced myself it was there all along. My guess is the rocker was nearly broken when I parked it last winter. When I started it up the rocker let go and got under the rocker beside it and caused the bent push rod. What this has to do with a bad lifter on the other side I don't know. I'm just glad it happened when and where it did. The cam looks fine. Parts should be here early this week and hopefully back up and running later in the week. Just part of owning old cars.

The last time I put new lifters on a used cam, I wiped out two lobes on the cam. Lobes and lifters have wear patterns that match. I'm sure some will say don't worry about it, but it bit me.

I talked to Hughes about it, the recommended using their new lifters and go through the break in procedure again. I have break in oil too and an extra filter for a regular OC later. They think this will be my best bet. Hope so.

My first course of action would still be to pull the soft lifter apart, clean all the parts, reassemble, pump it back up, and if that went well, reinstall it.
Then replace the broken rocker/pushrod stuff as req'd.

What rockers and pushrods were/are you using?

That's what I did. I didn't want to go through the break in again. The rockers and pushrods were stock, new ones are sealed power from summit. I have all that stuff done but I'm having problems with my back and knees so I'm waiting for help to put the iron intake back on. After working 12 hrs I don't much want to work on it. I'll get it though.

Agreed, I would try to reuse the offending lifter to avoid a rebreakin procedure. As you said I would clean it & then see how it acts & if you have another lifter even a used one with the same innards you could change out some inner parts tho I would try to keep the same main plunger as those clearances are very tight & see how it goes & even later change the plunger if need be. compare the innards of the bad and a good lifter to see if anything looks damaged. I wish you a speedy recovery & post the outcome when the time comes.

OK. I know it's been a long time coming but here's the scoop. After contacting Hughes Engines I decided on new lifters and a new break in. But, I was afraid of their lifters so at the recommendation of a mechanic friend I bought Comp Cams Pro Magnum lifters. That was a mistake and I'll get back to why. I changed the lifters, pushrods, and rockers, Did a break in, and while the car ran great, it had no lope. After calling Hughes again I learned that the lifters I bought were Comps version of a Rhoads lifter and they don't pump up until higher RPMs. So, I ordered the 5001 lifters recommended by Hughes and tore everything back down and did another break in. The end result is I now have what I had before the broken rocker and I'm happy.
OK, here's what I think happened. I broke a stock rocker due to being 42 yrs old and not liking high lift springs. While I'm a good mechanic I lack experience and took what I thought was the high road and way over thought things. None of what I did was wrong but some was unnecessary. However, I've learned a lot and had a lot of fun doing my own wrenching. All said and done, I'm a happy camper. Thanks to everyone who helped.

Comp Cam pro magnums require an adjustable valve train. You have to preload them slightly. Either way on your deal they were not correct and I am happy you have found your happy spot. Todd

At this point, since the motor is all back together and running, you should pull the soft lifter apart and see if you can figure out why it wouldn't pump up.

Might be a learning experience for next time.

Yes, the adjustable rockers was part of it too. I forgot that. Thanks.

I did break it down but found nothing wrong. I don't know why it never pumped up. It was not where I had the broken rocker. The flat lifter was on #5 and the broken rocker was on #2. I think I just way over thought stuff. That's where experience comes in. I'm getting there.