Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR???

Posted By: challenger70

Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/28/09 08:58 PM

I am looking into getting a 4 wheel disc brake system for my Charger, I will do the XV level 1 setup when I do the brakes as well. I want something that can stand up to a track day here and there but it will be 90% street car, and I want a parking brake if that matters. I also plan on running 17-18" wheels most of the time, but would like to be able to fit an 15" slick on the back for trips to the strip. Any advice is appreciated. I would also like to get everything as a kit if possible, once I decide on brakes I wil figure out what master works best with them but really like the hydroboost setup. FYI-It has manual 4 wheel drums now but want to redo the entire system, 4wheel drums=scary in city driving.

Posted By: OzHemi

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/28/09 09:19 PM

I have PBR all around on my Torana...I really like thier stuff. Made in Australia for one

also factory parts on quite alot of cars so you know they are tried and true in day to day type driving.

I got my rear kit with is a Baer setup from DrDiff (it's a PBR caliper with a 13" drilled and slotted rotor) the front setup is right from Oz and uses a PBR caliper as well.

You'll just have to watch your rear rotor diameter if you want to run a 15" wheel at times.

Check with DrDiff when you are ready, he is great to deal with

Posted By: challenger70

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/28/09 09:32 PM

Quote:

I have PBR all around on my Torana...I really like thier stuff. Made in Australia for one also factory parts on quite alot of cars so you know they are tried and true in day to day type driving.

I got my rear kit with is a Baer setup from DrDiff (it's a PBR caliper with a 13" drilled and slotted rotor) the front setup is right from Oz and uses a PBR caliper as well.

You'll just have to watch your rear rotor diameter if you want to run a 15" wheel at times.

Check with DrDiff when you are ready, he is great to deal with

I am leaning towards the XV level 1 brakes cause I am pretty sure it's the same pbr brakes used on the '03-'04 Cobras and maybe vettes so replacement parts should be easy to find in a pinch. Plus they have everything for the swap included. This will be my first time doing something like this (both the suspension rebuild and brakes) so I want stuff that should go together pretty easily/come as a kit. Made in Australia is a plus if I can't find anything made in USA.

Posted By: OzHemi

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/28/09 09:35 PM

My cars are made in Oz, so fitting the brakes are too

The Torana actually came factory with PBR front calipers from the 70's.. The Chargers used them too, but later in the 70's (Mine had the Girlock calipers)

Next Valiant coupe I built will get a big brake setup with PBR calipers too...

They might not be as full on race-type like big Brembo's or AP, etc stuff...but work great for my usasge. And like you said, easy to get pads for them at any local store.

My fronts..

Attached picture 4980586-011.JPG

Posted By: OzHemi

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/28/09 09:39 PM

And rears..

Attached picture 4980600-004(13).JPG

Posted By: challenger70

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/28/09 09:55 PM

Thanks for the advice so far OZ

That setup looks like the same thing as the XV(PBR) Level 1 setup

Front
http://www.xvmotorsports.com/products/detail/index.cfm?nPID=31&cid=3&cdesc=Brakes

Rear
http://www.xvmotorsports.com/products/detail/index.cfm?nPID=32&cid=3&cdesc=Brakes

Does anyone make a similar "kit" for the Baer/Wilwood/Brembo setups? I like that the rear setup also fits a Dana as that may be a future upgrade.

Posted By: OzHemi

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/28/09 09:59 PM

Like I mentioned, check with DrDiff if you want to know what is out there as well..he knows the low down on it and can help steer you in which ever direction you might need to go. I'd check with him before XV,etc

Oh, and those kits do look familiar...my front uses a custom billet hub with an off the shelf Holden HSV Commodore rotor. The rear is a shelf kit with 13" rotors from Baer, via Cass

Posted By: OzHemi

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/28/09 10:01 PM

BTW.. the other cool thing about this setup, is it is basically the same setup front to rear that a bunch of cars (Corvette,Camaro,Commodore,etc) use from the factory, so picking a master cylinder is abit more straight forward I'd say

Posted By: DoctorDiff

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/28/09 10:11 PM

Yes, I make several "similar" front and rear kits using PBR, Varga and Brembo calipers. In fact, that XV Level 1 stuff is a copy of my Mustang Cobra based kit.

Please E-mail me for more information.

Posted By: AndyF

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/28/09 10:30 PM

Unless the car is going to be really fast, a good 13x1.25 front rotor combined with factory rear drum brakes should work just fine. The rear drum saves you a bunch of money, maintains a stock type brake bias, and gives you the e brake.

I always recommend the 13 inch front rotor/rear drum combo but lots of people insist on 4 wheel disc brakes anyway. From what I've see at the track, the car has to be very, very fast before the rear discs are required.

Posted By: AndyF

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/29/09 12:32 AM

I don't see any good reason to use anything other than the 13 inch Viper kit that I designed a few years ago for an A/B/E body street/track car. This setup uses robust factory parts and is quite a bit cheaper to install than the Baer high end stuff.

The OEM's all use Brembo calipers for their high end cars. You won't ever find a Wilwood caliper on any OEM vehicle. The PBR stuff is used on mid-range vehicles such as Mustangs but the top end stuff always gets Brembo.

Posted By: challenger70

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/29/09 12:46 AM

Quote:

I don't see any good reason to use anything other than the 13 inch Viper kit that I designed a few years ago for an A/B/E body street/track car. This setup uses robust factory parts and is quite a bit cheaper to install than the Baer high end stuff.

The OEM's all use Brembo calipers for their high end cars. You won't ever find a Wilwood caliper on any OEM vehicle. The PBR stuff is used on mid-range vehicles such as Mustangs but the top end stuff always gets Brembo.

Where can I get more information on this? Your probably right about the rear drums but I really want discs, can you recommend a rear disk setup to pair w/ this that has a parking brake that a 15" wheel will clear? Also what would you recommend for Master cylinder? I don't mind higher effort but would like some kind of assist as it will be 90% street car. Where can I get all the lines etc to hook it all up? I am trying to weigh the pros and cons of this setup vs. the pbr setups, thanks for the help

Posted By: 71TrakPak

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/29/09 02:01 AM

I too would like the details on the brake kit you designed. I'm not into the over priced kits when home built is as good or better at a fraction of the cost.

Posted By: AndyF

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/29/09 02:23 AM

Kits are available from Mancini Racing. Or Miles Chrysler for a package deal that includes calipers and pads.

http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/caadki.html

Posted By: AndyF

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/29/09 02:41 AM

Quote:

I am trying to weigh the pros and cons of this setup vs. the pbr setups, thanks for the help

The PBR system will be less expensive since it uses a floating two piston caliper rather than a fixed four piston caliper. Also, the PBR system uses a thinner rotor.

If you're not driving the car very hard then the PBR system will work just fine. If you have some power under the hood and have the suspension working then you'll need more heat capacity in your brake system.

There is no one size fits all brake system, you just pick the one that fits your need.

Posted By: challenger70

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/29/09 02:45 AM

Quote:

Kits are available from Mancini Racing. Or Miles Chrysler for a package deal that includes calipers and pads.

http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/caadki.html

would the kits work with the new magnumforce 2" drop spindles?
http://www.magnumforceracing.com/magnumforce_ad.htm

how much are the Viper calipers new? the $995 kits do not include the calipers/pads, correct?

Posted By: DoctorDiff

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/29/09 05:02 AM

Andy's 13" Viper front kit pairs nicely with my 11.7" rear kit.

If you want something larger, I stock 14" Viper front kits and a matching 13" rear.

When you buy new calipers, pads and hoses, the Viper front kits run at least $2000.

Posted By: challenger70

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/29/09 03:15 PM

Quote:

Andy's 13" Viper front kit pairs nicely with my 11.7" rear kit.

If you want something larger, I stock 14" Viper front kits and a matching 13" rear.

When you buy new calipers, pads and hoses, the Viper front kits run at least $2000.

Cool, I like the "coolness" factor of the Viper fronts, do your rear 11.7" kits have a parking brake? Also what does the Viper 14" front and 13" rear setup run$$, does that have a parking brake? I am guessing the Viper 13" rear kit won't clear a 15" wheel? Thanks for the help guys this is all news to me

Posted By: DoctorDiff

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/29/09 03:21 PM

All my kits have parking brake.

New disc brake spindles $200 pair
14" front kit $2000 complete
13" rear kit $800 complete

Must use 18" and larger wheels.

Posted By: AndyF

Re: Good/bad aftermarket brake systems-Wilwood/Baer/PBR??? - 01/29/09 10:01 PM

Quote:

would the kits work with the new magnumforce 2" drop spindles?
http://www.magnumforceracing.com/magnumforce_ad.htm

Heck if I know. If the guys at Magnum Force did their homework then other brake kits should fit their knuckles. I have no idea if they did a good job on those new knuckles or not.