Moparts
Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches
Posted By: 4spdana
Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 01:30 PM
friend wants to build a 500" 440, using aluminum heads w/ mild porting,2" headers,3" exhaust,
250@.050/.600 camshaft,and top it with a 6-pack.
some claim that the manifold will be the bottle neck in this build.
what do you think?
didn't Mopar Muscle do a engine challenge with a combination like this?
if so i can't find it
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 02:29 PM
It will be like a governor on it. Also when you are just riding around remember you will be driving that 500 CI on those TWO tiny throttle bores in that center carb--not good imo
I did a back to back on a 600 HP unit like you mention--with a single four it was like a different animal--I am no six pack fan when it comes to the big cube units
Not to mention the long period of time and $$$ it will take to get it running suitable--there will be folks that stand up and say that they can/have made six packs run perfect but......most folks wind up pulling their hair out on those deals.
Posted By: gtx6970
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 02:33 PM
This a customers car.
BUT, it's 493 cu in. 735 something horse
A little to much cam IMO ( I think its near 700" lift ) , but this thing is a brute.
I know the intake had some port work but dont know how much . For that I will foward this to the cars owner and maybe he'll respond with better details.
Posted By: Mr.Yuck
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 04:47 PM
I'd think with some clean up work and a good tune on the carbs he'll be fine. I wouldn't just drop a out of the box unit on and think it will be fine. There are some tricks you can do w/ the outboards that make them run better or he can bite the bullet and get the outboard metering plates. I don't have near the build but I do enjoy getting 15mpg and running mid 11's (low 11's soon)
Posted By: DaytonaTurbo
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 04:51 PM
How is it that nobody makes a good single plane 6 pack intake?
Posted By: Jerry
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 05:14 PM
if I was going to run a six pack I would get the weiand cross ram six pack intake. especially when big cubes are involved.
Posted By: Vert
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 06:00 PM
Easy fix. A real
Six Pack .
Posted By: Cab_Burge
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 09:37 PM
Quote:
friend wants to build a 500" 440, using aluminum heads w/ mild porting,2" headers,3" exhaust, [Email]250@.050/.600[/Email] camshaft,and top it with a 6-pack.
some claim that the manifold will be the bottle neck in this build.
what do you think?
didn't Mopar Muscle do a engine challenge with a combination like this?
if so i can't find it
Don't beleive what you hear, especially from those that do not own or ever used a sixpak 
My 518 C.I. pump gas low deck stroker made a lot of power from day one with a set of mildly ported 906 iron heads, 612 HP @ 5500 RPM and 644 Ft. lbs @ 4500 with 511 C.I. I swapped the heads(CNC ported Eddy RPM 
) and then swapped the crank the next year to bring the dished piston up to zero deck. The last time that motor was on the dyno with the Eddy dual plane low deck sixpak intake and stock type OEM 440 six pak carbs jetted fatter it made 720 HP and 710 Ft lbs. on 10% Ethanol Oregon pump swill 
Are there better intakes and carbs, yes there are Will his sixpak make good power, YOU BET it will My 3450 lb (with me in it) Duster ran a best of 10.15 at 132 MPH with the six pak, it ran 9.993 at 134.6 MPH with a set of Indy SR M.W. ports and a 1050 Holley Dominator on a Indy 400-3 intake on non ethanol Oregon pump swill with the exhaust and air cleaners on The sixpak carbs need tuning to get them perfect, have him jet the outboard carbs up to around .089 on the fuel inlet holes and leave the center carb. stock on the jetting, he will need to work on the vacume pod springs to get the carbs to open the way he likes them 
Have him adjust the idle mixture screws on the outboard carbs all the way in (gently) until the bottom out and then open them no more than 1/2 turn out and then start the motor up and adjust the center carb. idle mixture screws and idle speed screw to get it where he likes BB Mopars like air, the more the better 
Let us know what you guys do and how it runs
Posted By: lewtot184
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 09:52 PM
"alum heads/mild porting", the intake will probably flow more than the heads. go for it!
Posted By: VincentVega
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 10:11 PM
Doesn't the 6 pack setup ultimately flow around 1350cfm? hard to imagine the carbs being the limiting factor on horsepower, especially when you consider how fast people are going on a single dominator.
Tunnel ram intake with removable top and and a 6 bbl adapter would be neat. anyone ever done anything like that?
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 10:52 PM
Quote:
Doesn't the 6 pack setup ultimately flow around 1350cfm? hard to imagine the carbs being the limiting factor on horsepower, especially when you consider how fast people are going on a single dominator.
Tunnel ram intake with removable top and and a 6 bbl adapter would be neat. anyone ever done anything like that?
No it really only flows about 950cfm
Posted By: VincentVega
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 10:56 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Doesn't the 6 pack setup ultimately flow around 1350cfm? hard to imagine the carbs being the limiting factor on horsepower, especially when you consider how fast people are going on a single dominator.
Tunnel ram intake with removable top and and a 6 bbl adapter would be neat. anyone ever done anything like that?
No it really only flows about 950cfm
I will not dispute you, however I have seen the 1350 figure from multiple sources, including Hot Rod
http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/mopp-0801-mopar-six-pack-tuning/
Where did you find 950?
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 11:00 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Doesn't the 6 pack setup ultimately flow around 1350cfm? hard to imagine the carbs being the limiting factor on horsepower, especially when you consider how fast people are going on a single dominator.
Tunnel ram intake with removable top and and a 6 bbl adapter would be neat. anyone ever done anything like that?
No it really only flows about 950cfm
I will not dispute you, however I have seen the 1350 figure from multiple sources, including Hot Rod
http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/mopp-0801-mopar-six-pack-tuning/
Where did you find 950?
Now I see 1030? the outboards are considered a 500 cfm carbs but they're really not.
https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Number=7515387
Posted By: Mr.Yuck
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 11:04 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Doesn't the 6 pack setup ultimately flow around 1350cfm? hard to imagine the carbs being the limiting factor on horsepower, especially when you consider how fast people are going on a single dominator.
Tunnel ram intake with removable top and and a 6 bbl adapter would be neat. anyone ever done anything like that?
No it really only flows about 950cfm
I will not dispute you, however I have seen the 1350 figure from multiple sources, including Hot Rod
http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/mopp-0801-mopar-six-pack-tuning/
Where did you find 950?
Now I see 1030? the outboards are considered a 500 cfm carbs but they're really not.
https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Number=7515387
John just wishes he had one..
Posted By: VincentVega
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/16/15 11:06 PM
I had always figured 2 x 500 + 350.
although, that is a pretty healthy figure for the end carbs.
I have one of those aluminum high rise 6 bbl intakes for small block, along with a set of reproduction Holley carbs for it. was a christmas present probably 15 years ago, maybe longer. never used it on anything yet!
in fact, here is my intake
I love that manifold. Would love to EFI it with 3 throttle bodies
Posted By: dogdays
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 12:04 AM
So we go through this again: Twice in the same thread!
Two barrel carbs are rated at a 3 inch pressure drop across the carb. Four barrel carbs are rated at 1.5 inches of pressure drop. To convert from a two barrel rating to a four barrel rating you DIVIDE BY THE SQUARE ROOT OF TWO!!!
That's 1.414... for those who don't have a calculator with a square root key.
1350 / SQRT2 = 955cfm.
1150 / SQRT2 = 813cfm.
etc.
R.
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 12:50 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Doesn't the 6 pack setup ultimately flow around 1350cfm? hard to imagine the carbs being the limiting factor on horsepower, especially when you consider how fast people are going on a single dominator.
Tunnel ram intake with removable top and and a 6 bbl adapter would be neat. anyone ever done anything like that?
No it really only flows about 950cfm
I will not dispute you, however I have seen the 1350 figure from multiple sources, including Hot Rod
http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/mopp-0801-mopar-six-pack-tuning/
Where did you find 950?
Now I see 1030? the outboards are considered a 500 cfm carbs but they're really not.
https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Number=7515387
John just wishes he had one..
I did at one point , my first 69 RR had a 440-6pk ...
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 12:52 AM
Quote:
So we go through this again: Twice in the same thread!
Two barrel carbs are rated at a 3 inch pressure drop across the carb. Four barrel carbs are rated at 1.5 inches of pressure drop. To convert from a two barrel rating to a four barrel rating you DIVIDE BY THE SQUARE ROOT OF TWO!!!
That's 1.414... for those who don't have a calculator with a square root key.
1350 / SQRT2 = 955cfm.
1150 / SQRT2 = 813cfm.
etc.
R.
The thread is not done yet , we will probably go thru it a few more times.
Posted By: AndyF
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 12:52 AM
The six pack intake will kill off some top end power on a big motor like that but if that is what the guy wants then who cares.
A good single plane intake with a big 4150 carb will make more power on the dyno than a six pack setup but it might not matter depending on who the guy is and how he drives the car.
I'm going to put a six pack on my low deck 512 even though it will kill some top end power. I just like the way it looks. I'm assuming that I'll be able to tune it but I'm sure it will take some work.
Posted By: VincentVega
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 01:18 AM
Quote:
So we go through this again: Twice in the same thread!
Two barrel carbs are rated at a 3 inch pressure drop across the carb. Four barrel carbs are rated at 1.5 inches of pressure drop. To convert from a two barrel rating to a four barrel rating you DIVIDE BY THE SQUARE ROOT OF TWO!!!
That's 1.414... for those who don't have a calculator with a square root key.
1350 / SQRT2 = 955cfm.
1150 / SQRT2 = 813cfm.
etc.
R.
I never knew this. Is this a holley thing only? But I don't believe it is that simple, as an engine will have a vacuum reading (draw) all over the place.
On a large enough engine, with a big enough draw, who is to say it won't pull 3 inches? or even more? If it does that, then the 1350 capacity is now reality. I would say on a big enough engine, with cam, and high rpm, it should be possible.
So what is the point of the discussion? to talk theory, or application?
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 01:19 AM
Quote:
So what is the point of the discussion? to talk theory, or application?
Posted By: lewtot184
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 01:25 AM
6pak discussions on moparts are amusing,...sometimes.
Posted By: cudaman1969
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 01:27 AM
Quote:
How is it that nobody makes a good single plane 6 pack intake?
Try a Weiand S/S intake, tunnel ram-single plane type. End carbs are like the size of a 800 dp and i guess the middle should be close to a 600. So 800 + 300 = 1100 would be more likely, unless those four barrels don't flow what they advertize either. I would say six barrels should flow a lot more than any four barrel except the dominator. Good test for you flow bench guys, just flow half of a four barrel, say an 850 then the six pac two barrel at the same rate to clear the air.
,
Posted By: feets
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 01:33 AM
Quote:
On a large enough engine, with a big enough draw, who is to say it won't pull 3 inches? or even more? If it does that, then the 1350 capacity is now reality. I would say on a big enough engine, with cam, and high rpm, it should be possible.
So what is the point of the discussion? to talk theory, or application?
It doesn't work that way.
The carbs are rated for flow using specific pressure differences across the throttle. A high vacuum below the throttle will draw more air.
The 2 bbl got its rating with a higher draw. That means you can't compare the numbers directly with a 4bbl.
If tested like a 2 bbl, a 750 CFL carb would get a 1050 rating.
Posted By: forphorty
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 01:52 AM
On a large enough engine, with a big enough draw, who is to say it won't pull 3 inches? or even more? If it does that, then the 1350 capacity is now reality. I would say on a big enough engine, with cam, and high rpm, it should be possible.
If you are pulling 3 inches at WOT, your carb is too small and it is costing you power.
Posted By: fourgearsavoy
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 03:55 AM
Posted By: AndyF
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 04:16 AM
Understanding the 6 pack CFM is one of the hardest things for Mopar guys. A really big percentage of them will never figure out the whole 2bbl flow rating thing. I gave up correcting people a few years back but I'm glad to see that you're still putting up the good fight!
The equiv flow rating of 900+ cfm is enough to make really good power, it is the twists and turns inside of the stock intake that kills the combo. Especially at high rpm and/or lots of cubic inches. But the setup can easily make 600 hp on a healthy short block so it does work really well up to a point. And that point is more power than what 99% of the folks need on a street car anyway.
Posted By: Dunnuck Racing
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 05:09 AM
Here is an easy way to TRY and explain it. I am building a hot street 440 with a six pack. The carbs are here now.
The venturi and butterfly measurements of the two 500 cfm two barrels carburetors is exactly the same as the customers current 850 four barrels.
So whatever the 350 carburetor would flow compared to a four barrels is the only gain.
I will make a post later about the intake, porting, etc
Keith
Posted By: ademon
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 05:33 AM
Quote:
Here is an easy way to TRY and explain it. I am building a hot street 440 with a six pack. The carbs are here now.
The venturi and butterfly measurements of the two 500 cfm two barrels carburetors is exactly the same as the customers current 850 four barrels.
So whatever the 350 carburetor would flow compared to a four barrels is the only gain.
I will make a post later about the intake, porting, etc
Keith
But isn't the 850dp slabbed throttle shaft with thin throttle blades? And original 6 pack carbs full shafts with thicker throttle plates sandwiched in the middle?
Posted By: BSB67
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 02:18 PM
Quote:
Understanding the 6 pack CFM is one of the hardest things for Mopar guys. A really big percentage of them will never figure out the whole 2bbl flow rating thing. I gave up correcting people a few years back but I'm glad to see that you're still putting up the good fight!
The equiv flow rating of 900+ cfm is enough to make really good power, it is the twists and turns inside of the stock intake that kills the combo. Especially at high rpm and/or lots of cubic inches. But the setup can easily make 600 hp on a healthy short block so it does work really well up to a point. And that point is more power than what 99% of the folks need on a street car anyway.
These comments bundle it up pretty nicely. My limited testing show that a stock 6bbl intake starts to give way to other manifolds above 550 peak hp, and average power not much after that. I'm not suggestion that I won't go 650 hp.
I'm really surprised that carb manufactures have not started to give air flow curves at multiple pressure drops, say from .4" to 2.0" Hg., not that guys like me lower on the food chain would need to know anything much above 1.0" Hg.
Posted By: FASTBACK340
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 03:02 PM
Posted By: lewtot184
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 04:50 PM
the 6pak/6bbl needs to be thought of as a vacuum secondary 4bbl with 2bbls added. those carbs should never be thought of as three independent carbs; which is the way holley currently rates the air flow. 1350cfm is a bogus marketing ploy. if i remember correctly the original flow rating was 1030cfm. cfm ratings have become a manipulated marketing ploy. i don't know why people take them seriously.
Posted By: DPelletier
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 07:37 PM
Quote:
Understanding the 6 pack CFM is one of the hardest things for Mopar guys. A really big percentage of them will never figure out the whole 2bbl flow rating thing. I gave up correcting people a few years back but I'm glad to see that you're still putting up the good fight!
The equiv flow rating of 900+ cfm is enough to make really good power, it is the twists and turns inside of the stock intake that kills the combo. Especially at high rpm and/or lots of cubic inches. But the setup can easily make 600 hp on a healthy short block so it does work really well up to a point. And that point is more power than what 99% of the folks need on a street car anyway.
Well said.
Another way of looking at it is this;
- at the 450 - 500hp level the stock six pack setup is one of the best setups available and makes more average power and torque than all but a couple of the best aftermarket intakes and 4bbls. It's far superior to the factory 4bbl manifold and carb yet people always want to compare the stock 6 pack set up to and aftermarket 4bbl.
- After that level, you are giving something up to run the 6 pack but that doesn't mean you can't make 650 or 700 hp with one as evidenced in this thread. It's kinda like headers; at this HP level, you'd be able to make more power with a good 4bbl intake and carb but it depends on how you view it: do you want max power for your particular engine or do you want to make your target hp (whatever that is) using a 6 pack.
Dave
Posted By: 70BigBlockSE
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/17/15 10:46 PM
this 493 was 595hp and 650ftlbs with a shop 950 and Performer RPM. I'm going to run the sixpack because I already have the intake and carbs
Posted By: FASTBACK340
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/18/15 08:06 AM
Quote:
I'd think with some clean up work and a good tune on the carbs he'll be fine. I wouldn't just drop a out of the box unit on and think it will be fine. There are some tricks you can do w/ the outboards that make them run better or he can bite the bullet and get the outboard metering plates. I don't have near the build but I do enjoy getting 15mpg and running mid 11's (low 11's soon)
I have the ProMax metering plate in my center carb
and the jet-able metering plates for the end carbs
I also have the splayed-idle screw base plate for the rear carb
All I know is it pulls like a freight train and drives great. I have a mild cam, 10:0-1, Edlebrock RPM heads, MSD ignition, and TTI exhaust. 4 spd and 4:10 gears.
Fun doesn't begin to describe it 
Posted By: 383man
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/18/15 09:34 PM
Quote:
Quote:
How is it that nobody makes a good single plane 6 pack intake?
Try a Weiand S/S intake, tunnel ram-single plane type. End carbs are like the size of a 800 dp and i guess the middle should be close to a 600. So 800 + 300 = 1100 would be more likely, unless those four barrels don't flow what they advertize either. I would say six barrels should flow a lot more than any four barrel except the dominator. Good test for you flow bench guys, just flow half of a four barrel, say an 850 then the six pac two barrel at the same rate to clear the air.
,
I know a guy who runs the Mod Man six pack setup on an Indy headed 440 stroker in a 69 Bee. I have seen him run 10.50's but I really dont know alot about his eng build other then it has Indy parts. I wonder how the Mod Man 6 pk compares up to the stock intake ? Ron
Posted By: KillerBee
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 01/18/15 10:52 PM
Member Dennis Grossman (aka 6bblflash) has his big block Six Pack 'Cuda running 9.80's.
I believe he's using what started as a stock aluminum dual plane Six Pack intake that he modified.
Posted By: 68cuda440
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 02/01/15 01:27 AM
Quote:
this 493 was 595hp and 650ftlbs with a shop 950 and Performer RPM. I'm going to run the sixpack because I already have the intake and carbs
That is a thing of beauty. I would love to see a dyno comparison of the Weiand you have with the carbs to the Performer RPM. Not entirely Apples to Apples for me, I have a little 446ci engine. Is the intake modified? I hear they have idle fuel mixture issue. I think I have a way around that problem.
Posted By: 383man
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 02/01/15 03:45 AM
I know I have seen a few 440 dyno runs on engines making about 60 hp where the six pack was within 10 hp of the single plane and a 950 carb. On a street car the 6 pk will work pretty good if setup right as I would run one if I had a car that could have had the 6 pk option. I run this Indy dual plane intake with just an 850 DP on my 493 and I am very happy with it. With the dual plane and the DP carb it has great driveability and any rpm. I can hit it driving on the street in any gear at any rpm and it goes. Sure it may be a tad faster at the track with a single plane but this setup got me in the 10's that I was shooting for and has such good driveability that on my street car it may be giving up a tenth or so at the track but I have no complaints with the dual plane. Ron
Posted By: GTX MATT
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 02/01/15 04:01 AM
I usually think of it this way; if the build would be a good fit for a performer rpm it'd be good for the 6 pack. The Eddy 6 pack intake works/worked really well for something designed in 1969.
A buddy has a stock stroke 440 with a 260 @ .050 cam, Super Comps, Indy SRs, etc. 601 horse on the dyno with the 6 pack. He was worried about the engine when he bought the car but it has been reliable as can be. I'd like to see what it'd do with a Victor and an 850 on it.
Posted By: BiomedTechGuy
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/19/22 11:31 PM
HOLY THREAD RESURRECTION BATMAN!
Yes, but I'm doing it for an important reason: I have a Bill Mitchell aluminum RB block that I'm having built as a 4.50 x 4.50 572 going in my 70 V-code Roadrunner. I insist on a 6bbl feeding it. I'm also very attached to my N96 Air Grabber hood, so I am going to start out with the Indy ModMan intake CNC'd for Max Wedge ports for the TrickFlow 270 heads. My Holley carbs are modded by Promax. It seems to be the ONLY choice for the combination of low profile to keep the Air Grabber, 6bbl, and nitrous.
If I can ever "get over" letting go of the Air Grabber and hood, my next move would be the aftermarket (slightly taller) 69½ A12 scoop.
Also I emailed the company that has the 2bbl "Dominator" carbs just to see if they have any info on using 3 in a 6bbl configuration.
Posted By: XXHEMI
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/20/22 09:05 PM
The engine was highly modified but intake was un touched stock .
Carbs where new holleys from summit with very little modifications. Car ran like a Swizz watch. Nothing looks better then a Six Pack.
10.71 thru exhaust manifolds and a six inch bias ply
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/20/22 10:53 PM
The engine was highly modified but intake was un touched stock .
Carbs where new holleys from summit with very little modifications. Car ran like a Swizz watch. Nothing looks better then a Six Pack.
10.71 thru exhaust manifolds and a six inch bias ply
Hey, I recognize that car from back when it was in So Cal.
Posted By: BiomedTechGuy
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/20/22 11:09 PM
The engine was highly modified but intake was un touched stock .
Carbs where new holleys from summit with very little modifications. Car ran like a Swizz watch. Nothing looks better then a Six Pack.
10.71 thru exhaust manifolds and a six inch bias ply
I'm not sure if you are just commenting on the car in your post or responding to another post? Regardless, YES! That Roadrunner in your post , dressed as an A12, running that kind of intake manifold and carbs, and exhaust manifolds, and tires, absolutely quite the accomplishment. I would have SO LOVED a car like that, back then, running those 1/4 mile times dressed like that!!
It would have been an absolute ATM !!
Posted By: XXHEMI
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/21/22 02:05 AM
The engine was highly modified but intake was un touched stock .
Carbs where new holleys from summit with very little modifications. Car ran like a Swizz watch. Nothing looks better then a Six Pack.
10.71 thru exhaust manifolds and a six inch bias ply
I'm not sure if you are just commenting on the car in your post or responding to another post? Regardless, YES! That Roadrunner in your post , dressed as an A12, running that kind of intake manifold and carbs, and exhaust manifolds, and tires, absolutely quite the accomplishment. I would have SO LOVED a car like that, back then, running those 1/4 mile times dressed like that!!
It would have been an absolute ATM !!
Just expressing my opinion on the stock intake. I don't think there as bad as people think. And yes Troy from SO CA restored the car before I bought it. He did a great job one
of my favorites
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/21/22 08:59 PM
The engine was highly modified but intake was un touched stock .
Carbs where new holleys from summit with very little modifications. Car ran like a Swizz watch. Nothing looks better then a Six Pack.
10.71 thru exhaust manifolds and a six inch bias ply
I'm not sure if you are just commenting on the car in your post or responding to another post? Regardless, YES! That Roadrunner in your post , dressed as an A12, running that kind of intake manifold and carbs, and exhaust manifolds, and tires, absolutely quite the accomplishment. I would have SO LOVED a car like that, back then, running those 1/4 mile times dressed like that!!
It would have been an absolute ATM !!
Just expressing my opinion on the stock intake. I don't think there as bad as people think. And yes Troy from SO CA restored the car before I bought it. He did a great job one
of my favorites
Troy builds a quality car. @Steve70 in MA owns his old 70 T/A that he restored.
This is his latest. He just made a slight adjustment to the clutch height to his preference
Posted By: R/T1968R/T
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/21/22 09:37 PM
You would need the Weiand manifold to make more power and a set of mechanical carbs. It doesnt run great on the street unless you do the DC mods.
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/22/22 12:17 AM
You would need the Weiand manifold to make more power and a set of mechanical carbs. It doesnt run great on the street unless you do the DC mods.
Tests done
for DC and mods
Posted By: cudaman1969
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/22/22 01:45 PM
How is it that nobody makes a good single plane 6 pack intake?
Try a Weiand S/S intake, tunnel ram-single plane type. End carbs are like the size of a 800 dp and i guess the middle should be close to a 600. So 800 + 300 = 1100 would be more likely, unless those four barrels don't flow what they advertize either. I would say six barrels should flow a lot more than any four barrel except the dominator. Good test for you flow bench guys, just flow half of a four barrel, say an 850 then the six pac two barrel at the same rate to clear the air.
,
My thoughts too,
Posted By: cudaman1969
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/22/22 02:01 PM
You would need the Weiand manifold to make more power and a set of mechanical carbs. It doesnt run great on the street unless you do the DC mods.
I’ll be modding up a two four barrel top for that bottom, two AVS carbs
Posted By: A727Tflite
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/22/22 02:47 PM
You would need the Weiand manifold to make more power and a set of mechanical carbs. It doesnt run great on the street unless you do the DC mods.
I’ll be modding up a two four barrel top for that bottom, two AVS carbs
I think there was at least one car back in the late 70’s using the Weiand bass with the 2 x 4 lid on a 343horse 383, I can’t remember who raced it.
Posted By: Twostick
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/22/22 03:58 PM
You would need the Weiand manifold to make more power and a set of mechanical carbs. It doesnt run great on the street unless you do the DC mods.
I’ll be modding up a two four barrel top for that bottom, two AVS carbs
Drifting off topic here a bit but Don Dulmage did that. It was good for 1.5 MPH on a 4150 lb car.
Based on his testing I'd have to conclude it would be the best multi carb manifold with the added bonus of it will still fit under a factory type hood scoop.
Not sure if the OP's idea of 6 pak induction would include an aftermarket intake or not.
http://www3.sympatico.ca/big-d/2X4.htmKevin
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/22/22 07:49 PM
You would need the Weiand manifold to make more power and a set of mechanical carbs. It doesnt run great on the street unless you do the DC mods.
Here’s a pic of one of the prototype/development intakes for that Weiand.
I believe from Keith Black’s dyno.
Tom Hoover’s intake concept i believe too. Fabbed in sheet aluminum
Posted By: Droop69
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/23/22 01:04 PM
You would need the Weiand manifold to make more power and a set of mechanical carbs. It doesnt run great on the street unless you do the DC mods.
I’ll be modding up a two four barrel top for that bottom, two AVS carbs
I thought Weiand had a 2 x 4 top for that intake? I know the Edelbrock STR did.
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/23/22 08:41 PM
HOLY THREAD RESURRECTION BATMAN!
Yes, but I'm doing it for an important reason: I have a Bill Mitchell aluminum RB block that I'm having built as a 4.50 x 4.50 572 going in my 70 V-code Roadrunner. I insist on a 6bbl feeding it. I'm also very attached to my N96 Air Grabber hood, so I am going to start out with the Indy ModMan intake CNC'd for Max Wedge ports for the TrickFlow 270 heads. My Holley carbs are modded by Promax. It seems to be the ONLY choice for the combination of low profile to keep the Air Grabber, 6bbl, and nitrous.
If I can ever "get over" letting go of the Air Grabber and hood, my next move would be the aftermarket (slightly taller) 69½ A12 scoop.
Also I emailed the company that has the 2bbl "Dominator" carbs just to see if they have any info on using 3 in a 6bbl configuration.
Do the trickflow 270's have a raised intake port location and what is the height difference between the indy intake and a stock ebrock 6pack? the answers to these 2 questions will tell you if you caan keep the hood , assuming you can get an air cleaner on it assuming this is going to be a street car .
Posted By: GomangoCuda
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/23/22 08:47 PM
I think there was at least one car back in the late 70’s using the Weiand bass with the 2 x 4 lid on a 343horse 383, I can’t remember who raced it.
Back in the 70's Keith Black modified some for dual quad 383 superstockers. Unfortunately I could not find any pics. Years later Dulmage made the lid for his 440 shown in the Simpatico article above.
I thought Weiand had a 2 x 4 top for that intake? I know the Edelbrock STR did.
Nope. Sixpack and single dominator were the only lids weiand made. If I remember correctly, the dominator lid was created so that Paul Rossi could play in an AHRA single four barrel HotRod class just by swapping the lid and carbs.
Posted By: autoxcuda
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/23/22 10:22 PM
I think there was at least one car back in the late 70’s using the Weiand bass with the 2 x 4 lid on a 343horse 383, I can’t remember who raced it.
Back in the 70's Keith Black modified some for dual quad 383 superstockers. Unfortunately I could not find any pics. Years later Dulmage made the lid for his 440 shown in the Simpatico article above.
I thought Weiand had a 2 x 4 top for that intake? I know the Edelbrock STR did.
Nope. Sixpack and single dominator were the only lids weiand made. If I remember correctly, the dominator lid was created so that Paul Rossi could play in an AHRA single four barrel HotRod class just by swapping the lid and carbs.
Here’s a prototype 383 base. (only cause it's written "383" on it)
Posted By: cudaman1969
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/23/22 10:28 PM
You would need the Weiand manifold to make more power and a set of mechanical carbs. It doesnt run great on the street unless you do the DC mods.
I’ll be modding up a two four barrel top for that bottom, two AVS carbs
Drifting off topic here a bit but Don Dulmage did that. It was good for 1.5 MPH on a 4150 lb car.
Based on his testing I'd have to conclude it would be the best multi carb manifold with the added bonus of it will still fit under a factory type hood scoop.
Not sure if the OP's idea of 6 pak induction would include an aftermarket intake or not.
http://www3.sympatico.ca/big-d/2X4.htmKevin
This article is what got me on to it. The end 2 bbl carbs front bolts allow the 4 bbl carbs to sit in same place so only the inside bolts-holes need to be fabbed up. Wood first then maybe a carbon fiber top. Just thought of sitting my Hemi 2x4 base on it to see if spacing is right.
Doing this so I don’t have to break up the stock intake-carbs set I want to use on another engine.
Posted By: A727Tflite
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/23/22 10:29 PM
Lids look factory to me.
Posted By: cudaman1969
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/23/22 10:35 PM
I bet he used that 4 bbl lid with hole plugged for the mold, lost wax process
Posted By: R/T1968R/T
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/24/22 02:35 AM
Posted By: cudaman1969
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/24/22 03:44 AM
I’d say 90% sure that lid was not cast from that plyboard lid, holes are in the lid with 1/2” spacers used to get linkage up off the lid.
Posted By: R/T1968R/T
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/24/22 05:19 PM
I’d say 90% sure that lid was not cast from that plyboard lid, holes are in the lid with 1/2” spacers used to get linkage up off the lid.
The first attempt was the plywood. Then a mold was made for cast aluminum. two different animals
Posted By: cudaman1969
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 05/24/22 09:50 PM
I’d say 90% sure that lid was not cast from that plyboard lid, holes are in the lid with 1/2” spacers used to get linkage up off the lid.
The first attempt was the plywood. Then a mold was made for cast aluminum. two different animals
Yes, I read the article too.
Posted By: BiomedTechGuy
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 09/05/22 11:43 AM
I actually have what I consider one of the finest examples of the Weiand P3690982 6bbl intakes available. It is completely stock other than the intake runners have already been nicely radiused to remove the sharp 90° corners where they meet the floor of the plenum.
I would do the mods 6BBL FLASH did that are pictured and explained in the Victory Library post by him.
The problems with me using that on my BMP 572 as I see them are:
I'm trying to keep my N96 hood, and it definitely won't fit.
I'd have to get someone like Wilson Manifolds to mod the runners to match the Max Wedge port size of the TF270s.
From what Rossi said, that intake is over at 6,500 RPMs, not that that would be the biggest problem.
Posted By: BiomedTechGuy
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 09/05/22 11:48 AM
You would need the Weiand manifold to make more power and a set of mechanical carbs. It doesnt run great on the street unless you do the DC mods.
Tests done
for DC and mods
I have the Chrysler Performance book that details the specs and mods for both the Weiand and the Edelbrock 6bbl aftermarket intakes.
I've never seen the jet recommendations drawing or some of the details in the docs you posted. Thanks.
Posted By: BiomedTechGuy
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 09/05/22 11:56 AM
I won't know how it fits until it's in my 70 V-code Roadrunner.
I'm going with the Indy ModMan intake, CNC'd to MW port size by Indy, and my Promax modded Holley carbs, which I will rejet (I have 2 kits with 2 jets each size per kit from the #60s into the #90s). The rejet will be a best guess so the builder can run it before I pick it up or have it shipped to me. Once I have it installed, I have an Innovate Motorsports dual wideband O2 sensor system that I can fine tune with.
Posted By: jbc426
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 09/06/22 04:35 PM
This 6bbl set up spun out 684hp on my 493" RB and fit under the factory Shaker. The build and dyno run are still on Hughes website. I'm switching over to the Wilson ported EFI intake on the left in the photo. My shaker hides it anyway.
https://www.hughesengines.com/TechArticles/1dynotest684hp500cid6pack4bbljcross012007.php
Posted By: sogtx
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 09/07/22 10:30 AM
I did about the same with stroker 6 pack
Posted By: BiomedTechGuy
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 09/09/22 12:24 PM
Thanks
Posted By: jbc426
Re: Maxium Power Through 6-Pack Induction w/500 inches - 09/09/22 03:58 PM
Hughes spent over a week porting the intake to the limit of their abilities. Dave Hughes said its the most flow and port equalization they have gotten out of one yet. If anyone is interested in the intake and carbs, let me know.
