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1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro?

Posted By: MadMatt

1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/10/14 09:57 PM

I'm installing a new R-134a A/C system from Bouchillon. I'm fine with flushing the old evaporator (the only factory part retained) and installing the new components, but I've never charged an A/C system before. I usually operate on the principle that if I can acquire the tools and the knowledge for around what it would cost me to have someone else do it I'll do it myself. But I'm not likely to be doing a lot more A/C work and I don't want to screw up the new system. Any thoughts or suggestions from those with more experience would be most appreciated.
Posted By: Challenger 1

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/10/14 10:13 PM

Quote:

I'm installing a new R-134a A/C system from Bouchillon. I'm fine with flushing the old evaporator (the only factory part retained) and installing the new components, but I've never charged an A/C system before. I usually operate on the principle that if I can acquire the tools and the knowledge for around what it would cost me to have someone else do it I'll do it myself. But I'm not likely to be doing a lot more A/C work and I don't want to screw up the new system. Any thoughts or suggestions from those with more experience would be most appreciated.





Take it to a pro if you don't want to invest in the equipment for next time.
Posted By: MadMatt

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/10/14 10:15 PM

Quote:


Take it to a pro if you don't want to invest in the equipment for next time.




It's not so much about the investment, it's more a question of how difficult it is for a first-timer to get it right on a new system.
Posted By: nomore65BelvJim

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/10/14 10:27 PM

Quote:

I usually operate on the principle that if I can acquire the tools and the knowledge for around what it would cost me to have someone else do it I'll do it myself.




Take it to a pro. It'll cost a fraction of what the equipment will.

I'm big on DIY, especially when it gets me new tools, but A/C "tools" are not cheap.
Posted By: Challenger 1

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/10/14 10:45 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I usually operate on the principle that if I can acquire the tools and the knowledge for around what it would cost me to have someone else do it I'll do it myself.




Take it to a pro. It'll cost a fraction of what the equipment will.

I'm big on DIY, especially when it gets me new tools, but A/C "tools" are not cheap.




Years ago I bought gauges, didn't know how to read them for 10 years or more.

Then did what you did put AC on one of my classic cars from bouchillon. I bought a vacuum pump to pull a vacuum.

I still didn't have what I needed to do it right, need a scale to put in the right amount.

Then found a recycling machine on Craigs list from a old retired guy closing up shop near my home. Cost me 600 bucks for a recycling machine, hand held electronic Mac sniffer and Mac dye injector and black light. Since then I have used it a lot at home and at work since I do mechanical work at work for a small fleet. I learned to use it on my own, trial and error and reading the instruction manual that came with it.
I installed AC on my second classic car since.

Should have never bought the gauges and vacuum pump, they were a waste of money. Even with a scale those 3 tools are not enough to work on AC because you need a way to remove the gas for repairs. It's too expensive to blow into the air like I did 20 year ago when I needed to open a system.

It's not hard to do on our old cars, pull a vacuum of 30HG, my machine runs for 15 minutes to pull out air and moisture, most times I run 2-15 minutes vacuum cycles and then leave it sit under vacuum for 15 minutes to check for leaks. Then tell it to inject 2.0 pounds in my challenger systems and in 15 seconds it put's in the freon(R134A) Your done. Gauge readings varies depending outside temps.

I did go to a Car Quest sponsored AC seminar after getting my old machine. Learned some stuff, mainly today's recyclers are more accurate as far as how much gas goes in. Today's AC systems use less gas and it's more critical getting the right amount into the car after repairs.
I have used my machine on new pickup trucks with no problem, worked fine.
Posted By: John_Kunkel

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/10/14 11:09 PM


If you use their 20% coupon, you can get a Harbor Freight gauge set and vacuum pump for around $150 and you'll have them for life.
Posted By: gtx6970

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/10/14 11:21 PM

That is a lot more to understanding an A/C system than just charging it.

Imo take it to someone who does.

Plus buying the equipment for a one time job is not wise....Unless of course you plan to do multiple a/c jobs a year,,,
Posted By: Challenger 1

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/10/14 11:31 PM

Quote:

That is a lot more to understanding an A/C system than just charging it.

Imo take it to someone who does.

Plus buying the equipment for a one time job is not wise....Unless of course you plan to do multiple a/c jobs a year,,,




Bill, did you know the guy in Mt Healthy who ran a repair shop for many years, but he also specializes in alloy rim repair. I can't think of his name right now, on the tip of my tongue.
He told me he was still going to repair wheels but was getting out of the general repair business. That's who I bought my machine from.
Posted By: gdonovan

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/11/14 12:34 AM

Retired tech here- Aside from a vacuum pump very little in the way of tools is required.

Vac the system for a 1/2 hour, blow in 1 to 2 cans of R-134 gas using a cheap kit from Autozone (make sure you have oil in the system first) and pop a temp gauge in one of the a/c vent. Start trickling in gas in 15 second shots and watch the outlet temp. Let stabilize.

Keep adding in 10 to 15 second shots till the temp levels off. Done.
Posted By: gdonovan

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/11/14 12:50 AM

Neon system was filled this way, freeze the balls off a brass monkey.

Been doing a/c work since '84, DIY I say.

Attached picture 8172109-600x450.jpg
Posted By: MileHighDart

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/11/14 01:18 AM

Quote:

(make sure you have oil in the system first)




This part always confused me. Is there actually oil in the lines? or you just talking about oil in the compressor?
Posted By: gdonovan

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/11/14 01:36 AM

Quote:

Quote:

(make sure you have oil in the system first)




This part always confused me. Is there actually oil in the lines? or you just talking about oil in the compressor?




Oil is carried through the system with the refrigerant, when off it settles in the low spots of the system.

Most systems have a spec for total oil amount and its not unusual to have a spec for amounts in individual components.

If changing out one item (compressor lets say) its usually recommended to drain it out and note how much oil was drained.

Install the new compressor and add the same amount in new oil.

Other times it boils down to a WAG depending on how compromised the system was. Really crapped up systems (Caravan's with bad compressors and dual evap's anyone?) are best left to the pros.
Posted By: ahy

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/11/14 04:10 AM

I've done it both ways. With the Bouchillon kit on my classic, I set it up and took it to a shop to evacuate/charge.

Last fall I did compressor replacement on my/my daughters '98 Neon myself. My local Autozone had a vac pump on loan a tool. I fabricated an evacuate/charge manifold with a couple of old charge kits, barb fittings and a valve. It worked and the AC is good.

Also it was a bit of a chore to round all the stuff and use it. Labor of love as the saying goes.

In your situation, I'd get it roughed in and take it to a shop to leak test, evacuate and charge.
Posted By: MadMatt

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/11/14 04:35 AM

Thanks to everyone for all the advice and input! After weighing the cost, the time involved to gather everything, and my own learning curve I've decided to take it to a shop and have it done. Don't know if it is the absolute best decision, but at least I'll likely have cold air this weekend. Thanks again to everyone.
Posted By: John_Kunkel

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/11/14 08:55 PM

Quote:


I'm big on DIY, especially when it gets me new tools, but A/C "tools" are not cheap.




When the OP gets back from taking it to a pro I hope he posts what it cost him. I'll wager that it's close to the equipment price.
Posted By: TurboMike

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/11/14 09:06 PM

I'll take that bet
Posted By: BDW

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/11/14 09:43 PM

When I converted to the Sanden compressor it cost me $100 for the shop to charge it.
Wouldn't want to buy all that's needed and then have it laying around to use once every 5yrs.
Posted By: gdonovan

Re: 1st charge new A/C - DIY or take it to a pro? - 06/11/14 09:57 PM

Quote:

Quote:


I'm big on DIY, especially when it gets me new tools, but A/C "tools" are not cheap.




When the OP gets back from taking it to a pro I hope he posts what it cost him. I'll wager that it's close to the equipment price.




If you are clever, some the equipment costs are close to nothing. I setup a vacuum pump once from 5000 BTU house a/c someone poked a hole in the condenser.

The fill kits from Autozone are cheap, I have been using one for years and don't even bother getting out manifold set and hoses.

Around here in CT, a/c shops are NOT cheap, $200-$300 min bill.

I have several cars and you never know when someone will need a repair on the weekend ($$$), I keep cans on hand and even have a few 30 pounders of R-12
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