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Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers

Posted By: Meangreen68

Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 02:22 AM

These big block rockers are brand new from 2004. 1321-16.

I'd like to get them bushed.

I want to avoid any problems relating to galling.

The shafts that came with the rockers have drilled oil supply holes, no banana grooves.

Does Dan at Performance Only bush these rockers?

If not, any suggestions?

Thanks

Attached picture 7441885-Rockers1.jpg
Posted By: 451Mopar

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 02:55 AM

Not sure who does them, but a good idea. My friend had his seize on a big block.
Posted By: Meangreen68

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 03:10 AM

In another thread about the newer "Ultra Pros" it was mentioned that Comp Cams uses a "narrow rolled Teflon coated bushing."

I'm going to call Comp Cams tomorrow to see if they'll supply me the bushings?

Can't hurt to ask.

Attached picture 7441996-UltraPro1.jpg
Posted By: Meangreen68

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 03:31 AM

I want to distance myself from this...

Attached picture 7442028-ProMagnum1.jpg
Posted By: Azzkikrcuda

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 03:34 AM

RAS can Bush them for you. What cam and spring pressure are you running? Unless you are running high spring pressure they usually work ok. http://www.rockerarms.com/
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 03:40 AM

Quote:

RAS can Bush them for you. What cam and spring pressure are you running? Unless you are running high spring pressure they usually work ok. http://www.rockerarms.com/



While I agree RAS is the guys you'd like to do your rockers lately they haven't been getting much work out the door.. I know guys that have been using them for over 25 years that can't get a returned call or their parts back so if you choose to send them to RAS expect it to take years....
Posted By: Meangreen68

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 03:50 AM

I read that about RAS. That ain't happening.

The cost of the newer rockers is around $700.

The risk of not having them bushed could cost much more.

The cost of having them bushed??? even less, if Comp Cams cuts me a deal for the bushings.

I want longevity and peace of mind.
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 04:48 AM

Quote:

I want to distance myself from this...



What pressure are your springs open and closed? What they of cam are you going to use them with ?

I believe that picture you attached is from someone that used them over their rated value .
Posted By: Meangreen68

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 06:18 AM

John, I'm not sure of the spring pressures.

Engle K60/62 Hyd (.534"/.540") 108 lobe center. Reworked Edelbrock heads.

3.9" stroke quench motor ~10-3/4 to 1 cr.



Attached picture 7442204-Engine25.jpg
Posted By: Meangreen68

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 06:34 AM

The shafts from Hughes Engines look to have more than just "banana" grooves.

Maybe this is the ticket?



Attached picture 7442217-Shafts1.jpg
Posted By: 64Post

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 06:45 AM

You really should find out what spring pressure you're running. Whoever you call is going to ask you.

You may be throwing your money away on something you don't need.
Posted By: Meangreen68

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 06:56 AM

You're probably right Dave, it's just bothered me ever since the word "galling" was associated with these rockers.
Posted By: autoxcuda

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 07:12 AM

Quote:

In another thread about the newer "Ultra Pros" it was mentioned that Comp Cams uses a "narrow rolled Teflon coated bushing."

I'm going to call Comp Cams tomorrow to see if they'll supply me the bushings?

Can't hurt to ask.



Yes. The new one I bought last year have bronze sleeves in them. The centers are open to allow lots of oiling. No need for bananna groves.

Attached picture 7442252-1_20_11Sm03.JPG
Posted By: 64Post

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 07:19 AM

I ran those rockers with double springs at 350# open and 140# on the seat. Comp claims they're good to 500#. I wouldn't bet my motor on it. Consensus seems to be around 400# max open OOTB.

Ultimately, it's your money, your motor, your comfort level.
Posted By: Meangreen68

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 04:21 PM

I spoke with Comp Cams moments ago (800-999-0853).

They aren't willing to help.

No bushings, a trade-in, or a credit towards the purchase of a new set.

They did say if they fail, they'll give me a new set, excluding labor
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 11:15 PM

Quote:

I spoke with Comp Cams moments ago (800-999-0853).

They aren't willing to help.

No bushings, a trade-in, or a credit towards the purchase of a new set.

They did say if they fail, they'll give me a new set, excluding labor



Well if they fail you'll get a bushed set in return.

Is your cam a soild Flat tappet , Hyd. flat tappet, solid Roller, or a Hyd. roller ?

Should be easy to find the spring specs by looking up your springs on the manufacturer website .

Unless you are running a solid roller I don't think you'll have an issue , the picture you posted above was from someone using a solid roller , if solid roller is your cam choice you really want to run a set of Harland Sharps .

I feel that hughes shaft you added above has too much critical load area removed , a bananna groove would be better and easy to do with the shafts you have if that are not grooved.
Posted By: Meangreen68

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 10/31/12 11:27 PM

Thanks Autoxcuda for that photo of your Ultra Pro rockers.

Looking at the rocker in your right hand, that looks like a metal-backed sleeve bushing, sintered bronze and PTFE.

Notice the parting line in the bearing.

They look these: http://www.asbbearings.com/steel_backed_bearings.html

And John, you're probably right about those Hughes shafts. Light banana grooves in my shafts is all I probably need to do. It's a hydraulic cam.
Posted By: ahy

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 11/01/12 12:49 AM

I'm running the 2004 vintage Comp rockers and Comp shafts at about .55 lift. No problems. I believe galling gets to be an issue at around .6 lift and associated spring pressures. Unless you have unusual spring pressures, I believe you will be fine with the rockers as supplied in your application.
Posted By: Meangreen68

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 11/01/12 08:59 PM

I spoke with Engle Racing Cams today.

The recommended spring pressures of my K60/62H cam would be 130-145 closed and 300-320 open.

I read the invoice for the engine build and the original valve springs in the Edelbrock heads were swapped out for 1.560" double springs/cups and chromoly dual spring retainers.

I'm going to have the Comp Cams rocker shafts "banana" grooved, add ARP studs to the aluminum hold-downs, and run 'em.

Thanks guys

Attached picture 7444722-EngleRacingCams.jpg
Posted By: 64Post

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 11/01/12 09:28 PM

Quote:

I spoke with Engle Racing Cams today.

The recommended spring pressures of my K60/62H cam would be 130-145 closed and 300-320 open.

I read the invoice for the engine build and the original Edelbrock head's valve springs were swapped out for 1.560" double springs/cups and chromoly dual spring retainers.

I'm going to have the Comp Cams rocker shafts "banana" grooved, add ARP studs to the aluminum hold-downs, and run 'em.

Thanks guys



That’s very close to what I ran. You should be fine.
Posted By: JohnRR

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 11/02/12 03:44 AM

Quote:

Thanks Autoxcuda for that photo of your Ultra Pro rockers.

Looking at the rocker in your right hand, that looks like a metal-backed sleeve bushing, sintered bronze and PTFE.

Notice the parting line in the bearing.

They look these: http://www.asbbearings.com/steel_backed_bearings.html

And John, you're probably right about those Hughes shafts. Light banana grooves in my shafts is all I probably need to do. It's a hydraulic cam.



My opinion , bananna groove your shafts and run them , you are worrying about nothing if you have a hyd. cam .

edit ... I see that is what you are going to do
Posted By: AndyF

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 11/02/12 03:55 AM

You should be okay at 300 lbs spring pressure. Make sure that you have plenty of oil pressure as well as oil flow to the top end.

For a lower speed street engine you might consider grooving the #5 cam journal to provide full time oiling to the top end. You don't want to fill the valve covers up with oil on a race engine, but on a weekend cruiser that doesn't get wound to the redline very often the extra oil can be a good idea.
Posted By: Meangreen68

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 11/02/12 06:30 AM

Thanks Andy.

Having had the lifter bores bushed (bushings drilled w/oil holes), I wonder what difference that makes in regards to the grooving of the cam journal? I imagine it makes available more oil at the mains?

I read a thread where Cab Burge mentions how he meters the oil flow to the heads through carb jets/plugs tapped into the block after he grooves the cam's journal.

Mike at CRE did some oil mods and the cam bearings are installed.

I'm guessing the block will be providing plenty of oil to the heads as it is, without any cam journal grooving.

I deburred the block and smoothed the valley area before shipping it off for machining.

The block came back with the interior painted/coated.

The block is out of the crate, but not on a stand yet

Attached picture 7445540-LifterBush1.jpg
Posted By: ZIPPY

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 11/02/12 03:46 PM

At the spring pressure posted...you won't have any problems without banana grooves or rocker bushings.

They will work fine steel on steel, as long as you do not use any thick, paste-consistancy lubes on the rocker and shaft assy during assembly and do not overtorque (crush) the rocker shafts. Use a liquid type assembly lube only and mind the torque on the hold downs....more is not better....more torque causes galling because it deforms the shaft.

(I have used those rockers at 500lbs open pressure for several years for whatever that's worth, but I have not really put tons of miles on them either)
Posted By: 64Post

Re: Bushing the Comp Cams Pro Magnum Rockers - 11/02/12 04:29 PM

Quote:

(I have used those rockers at 500lbs open pressure for several years for whatever that's worth, but I have not really put tons of miles on them either)



Comfort levels vary. I wouldn’t be comfortable running that much pressure on a weekend street car — at least with the luck I have.
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