727 experts, a question

Posted By: hp383

727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 04:31 AM

Driving home today my trans got stuck in first gear after coming to a stop at an intersection.

I tried manual shifting, coasting in N and dropping back into gear, checked fluid,tried all I could it just wouldn't up shift. Reverse was fine.

I sat at the truck stop 30 miles from home stumped. It was then I remembered a like situation in my first car back in about 88.

I got onto the service road, brought my speed up to about 35mph, then slipped the shifter up into park for a couple seconds. Then back to drive. Bingo I was in third gear and had no more trouble the rest of the drive.

Question is what does this do? Back in 88 I did this at the recomendation of a trans tech. He said it causes a back flow condition in the valvebody and will clear a small partical or stuck check ball. Is this correct?

Other question is what got stuck? Trans is new but sat for around a year. Has maybe 300 miles use. This was first sign of trouble. Fluid is perfectly clean and on the full mark.

Posted By: Evil Spirit

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 05:02 AM

Stuck governor weights.

Posted By: JohnRR

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 05:34 AM

You put it into park at 35mph ???

Posted By: POS Dakota

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 03:08 PM

hehe

Posted By: bboogieart

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 03:14 PM

Quote:

You put it into park at 35mph ???

Lucky you didn't break off the pawl that holds the car in place when parked. I did this when I was about 14 and we had to replace the trans. Still might have caused stress cracks. Hope it don't let go later.

Posted By: JohnRR

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 03:38 PM

Quote:

Quote:

You put it into park at 35mph ???

Lucky you didn't break off the pawl that holds the car in place when parked. I did this when I was about 14 and we had to replace the trans. Still might have caused stress cracks. Hope it don't let go later.

I missed drive and hit reverse when I first got my license at about that same speed , years later when I disassembled the trans the outer race and a few pieces of the case fell out when I flipped the empty trans case bellhousing side down ... yikes ...

Posted By: stumpy

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 05:30 PM

Whoever told you to throw the trans in park while moving is nuts. I am sure he meant reverse. That was a trick I learned, while working in a trans shop, to get fords to shift. You just do a very quick in and out of reverse. Don't let it grab good or you will be rebuilding a trans and possibly other driveline repairs.

Posted By: hp383

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 06:15 PM

No it was park, and a search on yahoo resulting in several topics mentioning the same thing.

Here is one such, with the advice to do this given by a Chrysler tech...

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=435310

Quote:

I got some info from a chrysler service tech, He agreed that it sounds like a sticking governor valve. He said to take the truck up to about 30 mph and put it in PARK for a few seconds while in motion then back to drive. since the governor is bolted to the parking gear this will be the same as tapping on it.
Sounds crazy but it worked!! Hopefully the crud will get washed into the filter.
I think I'll put a side stream filtration sytem in.

A few more:

Quote:

Done it a hundred times.. LOL not something I would tell some to do that is for sure..but it prove the point.. need to take the gov apart and clean and polish the pistons and bores..when you put it in park like that the parking pawl ratted the gov and shake it loose.

hey it a mopar trans..it can take it... just don't do it to a chevy trans LOL

Quote:

I was informed by some transmission buliders that I can go 55 mph and try to jam the car into park for a second, then back down into gear to unstick governor. Supposedly the ratcheting of the parking pawl dislodges dirt from the governor. I don't think this is correct. Any help?

I was very skeptical back in 88 when I first did this, and was sweating bullets as I was just about to do the procedure. But a short one second(ish) shift to park, some rattling of the parking pawl, and the transmission never gave me any other trouble.

Last night I was to the point of "I don't care" with the RC, as this is now the umpteenth time it has left, or nearly left, me stranded and/or had to be limped, or towed home.

In my original post I said "a few seconds" in actuality is was closer to one, or less.

As to ripping the pawl out, I cant say since I have never had an issue with a failed PARK gear. And this is after severely abusing a 74 Fury over several years, and "Racing" in park.

To "Race" in park, a pair of cars line up at one edge of an empty parking lot, both cars accelerate to 20mph, then on the signal shift into park, holding the gear until the car actually engages into park, and skids to a stop. The car that locks up first is the loser. My 74 Fury and I were never beaten. And I never had a single transmission issue with that car. After all the racing in park, and first gear smokey burnouts, forced down shifts to first to make the tires chirp...

Stupid, yes, but when you are 18, have a $300 car, and cant afford to go fast, you find something else to win at.

That said, I don't make a habit of this now. I am older and wiser, but sometimes the really off the wall tip or trick does prove to be valid.

On a more serious note, if this was a stuck governor weight, rather than the 2-3 valve in valve body, is the governor serviceable with the transmission installed? And can it be inspected by a reputable shop? Do I need to have it looked at, or just let it be unless there are more issues.

My issue last night happened after about 30 miles of interstate travel, and then the no shift was after I had stopped, and turned from the off ramp.

Posted By: b54406barrel

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 06:25 PM

Quote:

On a more serious note, if this was a stuck governor weight, rather than the 2-3 valve in valve body, is the governor serviceable with the transmission installed? And can it be inspected by a reputable shop?

Yup.

Posted By: stumpy

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 06:32 PM

Still it's bad info I don't care where it came from. I was a chrysler tech for a long time and I would never give that kind of advice.

Posted By: hp383

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 06:46 PM

I wasn't and still not debating weather it is good or bad advice. Only that this advice is not uncommon, and seems to come from several different service, transmission repair, and other sources. Not just localized to my location, but through out the country.

It had to come from somewhere originally, and if it was unfounded, it would seem it would die off. But for the advice I got in 1988 to be still given in 2010, there must be something to it.

Posted By: JohnRR

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/19/12 07:58 PM

Quote:

Quote:

On a more serious note, if this was a stuck governor weight, rather than the 2-3 valve in valve body, is the governor serviceable with the transmission installed? And can it be inspected by a reputable shop?

Yup.

It is if you want to try and do it thru the speedo adaptor hole. It really requires removal of the tailshaft housing .

Posted By: 383man

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/20/12 12:05 AM

I used to do this on some problem jobs but it is REVERSE you put it in at 35 mph not Park. As John said you really need to remove the tail housing to service the gov in the car. Just out of curosity what kind and year car or truck is it ? Ron

Posted By: hp383

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/20/12 12:24 AM

it is 78 drivetrain, installed in a 93 Ramcharger.

Transmission is supposed to be a completely rebuilt unit, but there are a few things I wonder about the builder. He forgot to install the front seal the first time around, then installed the seal it was supposed to get, which had been riding around on his 4x4 shifter for a year. It seems to be leaking a bit from the front, my guess is that the time, and exposure didn't do the rubber seal anygood.

So It would seem that the transmission, and transfer case will need to be removed for the third time. I am a bit disappointed in the attention to detail that this project has seen. I really wish I could have done or been able to help with most of it. Unfortunately I wasn't.

Posted By: John_Kunkel

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/20/12 12:30 AM

There's nothing insane about the "shove it in Park" advice, at 35 mph there's no chance that it will actually engage the pawl and the vibration will likely free a stuck governor. (nothing to do with "backflow", just simple vibration)

It's possible that the problem isn't a stuck governor but might be a governor that has tossed its guts into the tailhousing...this often happens when the "E" clip holding the cross shaft comes off.

Posted By: BRONZEBEE

Re: 727 experts, a question - 01/20/12 04:36 AM

It is like taking a small hammer and hitting the governor support housing to free up the governor.The park pawl is the hammer at that point