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Re: Holley tuning help [Re: 451Mopar] #962270
04/02/11 04:45 PM
04/02/11 04:45 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,221
Branson, Mo.
J
joedust451 Offline
super gas
joedust451  Offline
super gas
J

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,221
Branson, Mo.
Quote:

I think you will have to richen up the transition circuit to cover up the hole between the accelerator pump shot and transition into the main circuit. Usually enlarging the idle restriction and maybe the power valve restriction in the metering plate by a few thousandth should help.




This is where i would tune for a richer transition.

Last edited by joedust451; 04/02/11 04:47 PM.

75 Duster, 451 10.87 @ 123.58 NA 97 Z28 6sp., 12.01 @ 115 on a 100 shot 71 Swinger. 360 magnum. 12.58 @ 105 78 cutlass, 469 BBC. 12.70 @ 108 on street tires. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2kqNmMfheU
Re: Holley tuning help [Re: joedust451] #962271
04/02/11 10:23 PM
04/02/11 10:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,100
Fort Lauderdale
Dave440 Offline
super stock
Dave440  Offline
super stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,100
Fort Lauderdale
Quote:


I think you will have to richen up the transition circuit to cover up the hole between the accelerator pump shot and transition into the main circuit. Usually enlarging the idle restriction and maybe the power valve restriction in the metering plate by a few thousandth should help




I would agree with those mods...EXCEPT...this isn't the motor that carb is going to end up on...(assuming the 650dp is goin on the 340 when its done? I could be wrong in ASSuming there) ...plus its a one way street if you drill the PVCR larger and it doesnt fix the problem or worse...end up drilling too large and it results in a rich condition. Or ends up fixin the problem on the 318 and it doesnt run right on the next motor it goes on. Then your stuffing bent pieces of wire in the pvcr to try to reduce the flow thru an oversized hole or buying a new metering block...etc...

I always like to start with external easily reversible changes like accel pump adjustments, plastic cam changes and engine timing FIRST.

Its also possible the PVCR size is fine but it needs a power valve that opens sooner than the stock 6.5. Maybe an 8.5 or 10.5 depending on engine vacuum at idle and cruise. Its all trial and error....and can get expensive parts wise but if youre stickin with Holley carbs then you end up with a collection of parts you can use to experiment with on most 4150 series carbs in the future (power valves do eventually get hard though- ive got a collection of petrified valves).

As for drilling...I only go drilling idle bleeds, fuel bleeds and PVCRs as a last resort...and its usually bcus the carb selection was wrong.

I'm also guilty of the "spending lots of time tryin to make carbs and manifolds you have lying around work right" scenario than I'll ever admit too. Oh mannnnn I just did.... DOH!!!!

Make adjustments, change parts...or drill baby drill... I guess it all depends how much time, money and patience you have

As always.....YMMV

Re: Holley tuning help [Re: Dave440] #962272
04/03/11 01:47 AM
04/03/11 01:47 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
I have a billit metering block with the screw-in restrictions. I used it to tune may carb, then used that as a guide for modifying the stock metering block.
This was after making all the standard tuning adjustments.

Re: Holley tuning help [Re: 451Mopar] #962273
04/03/11 02:27 AM
04/03/11 02:27 AM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,025
Las Vegas, NV
dodgeboy11 Offline
super stock
dodgeboy11  Offline
super stock

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,025
Las Vegas, NV
I tried the larger squirters with limited success. To start, jet that puppy bigger 2 to 4 sizes per jet (primary and secondary) if the problem gets less, you need more fuel from the accelerator pumps. I believe the 650 comes with 31 nozzles standard. Going bigger doesn't help as the 30 cc pumps don't have enough volume per stroke to spray the fuel in as it is needed. I put dual 50 cc pumps on mine with 31 nozzles and I used the brown pump cam, turned it so it was about to push the accelerator pump lever, marked it and drilled my own hole. Hesitation went away for me.
You need more fuel, the manifold is fairly big for that combo, it has no exhaust crossover to heat anything so it needs more fuel.
This is all assuming the engine is happy and the carb is as well.

Re: Holley tuning help [Re: 73cuda340] #962274
04/03/11 03:38 AM
04/03/11 03:38 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 450
Texas
6
6packattk Offline
mopar
6packattk  Offline
mopar
6

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 450
Texas
I ran a 650 double pumper on a .040 over 360 in my 4x4 in 80`s,it had 12-1 jahns pistons,strip dominator manifold,13/4 headers,2.02 int valves.First thing I thought was maybe a little over carbed on 318.But reading thru replys they are good with fix tips.Mine was 75 white sweptline express with keystones and 12/33 15 tires.Twisted yokes on transfer case pulling wrecker and mobile home out of mud with both burried.I did not lack for power.....lol

Re: Holley tuning help [Re: 6packattk] #962275
04/03/11 10:46 AM
04/03/11 10:46 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,221
Branson, Mo.
J
joedust451 Offline
super gas
joedust451  Offline
super gas
J

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,221
Branson, Mo.
The 650dp comes with 28 squirters F&R.


75 Duster, 451 10.87 @ 123.58 NA 97 Z28 6sp., 12.01 @ 115 on a 100 shot 71 Swinger. 360 magnum. 12.58 @ 105 78 cutlass, 469 BBC. 12.70 @ 108 on street tires. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2kqNmMfheU
Re: Holley tuning help [Re: joedust451] #962276
04/03/11 01:03 PM
04/03/11 01:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 538
PA
M
maxwedge1 Offline
mopar
maxwedge1  Offline
mopar
M

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 538
PA
having been down this road before putting a hirise dual plane and vac secondary 600 on a previous stock 2bbl with 2.76 gear.
It killed the off idle and bottom end.

assuming the carb is ok..my cure was alot of time experimenting on initial timing the idle mixture and timing curve. getting a clean idle with alot of initial and lighter spring for quicker advance was the fix but you have to deal with pump gas and pinging issues also if your to agressive.

need to limit total advance also since alot of initial and the lite springs will put total to high.

more gear would help if you are running "hiway" gears now.

Last edited by maxwedge1; 04/03/11 01:11 PM.
Re: Holley tuning help [Re: maxwedge1] #962277
04/08/11 11:00 PM
04/08/11 11:00 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,184
clarks summit pa
73cuda340 Offline OP
super stock
73cuda340  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,184
clarks summit pa
Havnt had a chance to work on the truck for a while but I found out that the miss and hesitation up top was from when I found out that I forgot to hook up the vacuum advance back up and then after hooking it up I checked the timing again and the total was at 52 degrees. Guess Ill have to lower the initial a little to get it back down.


1973 Cuda 528 all aluminum Hemi, 4 speed, 3.23 Sure-Grip, (JA5) Silver Frost Metallic 1973 Challenger Rallye 340 1985 W150 Power Ram prospector 1986 Camaro IROC-Z 305 tpi
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