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Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: DPelletier] #903823
01/13/11 10:56 PM
01/13/11 10:56 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,496
Sask, Can.
7
72demon416 Offline
pro stock
72demon416  Offline
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Sask, Can.
Quote:

It's a NOM 340 car; build a stock appearing 360 stroker (because a 360 block is far cheaper) and call it a day.


Dave





Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: 471Magnum] #903824
01/13/11 11:01 PM
01/13/11 11:01 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 253
Orange County, CA
M
Mike H Offline
enthusiast
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Orange County, CA
From what I have read, you may be being a bit optimistic even on the $4 gas. I've read reports that predict $5 by years end. In any event $5 gas is coming soon.

So it depends how much and how hard you intend to drive it. At 12 mpg and 5000 miles per year, you'll spend an additional $400+/yr on petrol($4 vs. $5)
It sounds like money is definitely an issue for you. At 8 mpg (maybe more realistic?) we're talking $625/yr. That's $ to Shell Oil instead of Comp Cams.

I guess what I'm saying is gas prices (and the mileage you get in your rig) will likely blow your engine budget out of the water over the course of just a couple of years.

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: Mr340] #903825
01/13/11 11:10 PM
01/13/11 11:10 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 606
Montana
Y
Yancy Derringer Offline
mopar
Yancy Derringer  Offline
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Posts: 606
Montana
Quote:

Quote:



Explain to me how a 340 block is so much different from a 360 block "to maintain appearance."





The 340 cast into the right side of the block




Yeah, well, I knew that. Not many people are gonna scrutinize the block no's. It's not like, say, a BB versus RB where you can tell at a glance.

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: Yancy Derringer] #903826
01/13/11 11:30 PM
01/13/11 11:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
ScottSmith_Harms Offline
Mr Wizzard
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Spokane Washington
The difference in the cost will be the block itself, so short of your initial 340 block cost there's no difference.

A stock 340 (or 360 for that matter) block can handle around 500HP reliably, beyond that you risk breaking the block (Sure, some have lasted a long time pushing 600HP but that's a dice roll big time). For what you are shooting for you should be just fine building up a stock block.

You can play down a 340 all you want, if the time comes to sell the car, NOM or not, IT WILL make a difference to some buyers (quite a few of them IMO).


Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: 471Magnum] #903827
01/14/11 12:13 AM
01/14/11 12:13 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,122
Grand Haven, MI
patrick Offline
I Live Here
patrick  Offline
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Posts: 16,122
Grand Haven, MI
Quote:

The Magnum based thing adds cost quickly unless you find a complete motor to drop in. Cam, lifters, rockers all cost more than LA stuff (most of which I already have). It will mean head work and the whole budget is based on reusing the heads as is.

BTW, just got a call from the machine shop. My 360 block checked out okay, so I'm clear to proceed in that direction if I so choose.




reground roller cam is $200 from hughes. reuse stock magnum rockers, or use SBC rollers (much cheaper than comparable quality LA rockers)....roller lifters can be reused...

but if you're on an extreme budget, keep the stock stroke 360, redo the stock rods with ARP bolts, hang some KB107's on them and set up at 0 deck (for future head upgrades) and run a lunati voodoo 60403. if the heads are good, should be an honest 360-390hp....

Last edited by patrick; 01/14/11 12:16 AM.

1976 Spinnaker White Plymouth Duster, /6 A833OD
1986 Silver/Twilight Blue Chrysler 5th Ave HotRod **SOLD!***
2011 Toxic Orange Dodge Charger R/T
2017 Grand Cherokee Overland
2014 Jeep Cherokee Latitude (holy crap, my daughter is driving)
Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: ScottSmith_Harms] #903828
01/14/11 12:25 AM
01/14/11 12:25 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,664
IN
A
ahy Offline
master
ahy  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,664
IN
From the standpoint of budget and keeping the air grabber intact, it seems like 340 or 360 CI is the best. If you build a stroker, you'll want better heads and bigger manifold. Likley more carb also.

Then there is the question of how the 340 looks inside... what's going on with the balance? If rods or crank are questionable that could impact the budget a lot. If the 360 you have is a complete shortblock with re-usable crank and rods, I'd just built that using heads and other parts from the 340... or get a good complete 360 core. A performance rebuild with good valve job, correct compression and a decent cam should really wake the car up.

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: ahy] #903829
01/14/11 01:10 AM
01/14/11 01:10 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,719
Space Station #5
471Magnum Offline OP
master
471Magnum  Offline OP
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Space Station #5
360 is just a block at this point. It was missing a piston/rod. Crank was pretty messed-up, so it went into the scrap bin, but I can get another complete 360 for 100 bucks if I wanted. A 360 just doesn't have the exotic appeal though. If I'm going to deviate from a 340, I'm going all the way with a stroker motor.

We talk budget, but I have to consider what saving today could cost me tomorrow in terms of resale. I think installing a 360 (no matter how potent) would definitely hurt the value of the car, much more than the additional cost of rebuilding a 340. It's just numbers, but we all know how the market works on these cars. If I'm trying to sell a NOM car, I can push the merits of a "408-inch stroker motor" much easier than I can a "360 replacing the original 340".

The difference between stroking the 360, and rebuilding the 340 (w/new rods and pistons) is the cost of a crank minus the price difference on the blocks. I've done the math and basically, it's a near wash. It's not until I start upgrading things on the top end to feed the additional displacement that things start getting expensive on the stroker.

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: 471Magnum] #903830
01/14/11 01:49 AM
01/14/11 01:49 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
ScottSmith_Harms Offline
Mr Wizzard
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Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
Quote:

It's not until I start upgrading things on the top end to feed the additional displacement that things start getting expensive on the stroker.






And the cost of going to a stroker is the same with either a 340 or a 360 as well.

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: 471Magnum] #903831
01/14/11 02:04 AM
01/14/11 02:04 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert Offline
Circle Track
Happy Birthday RapidRobert  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
Quote:

It's not until I start upgrading things on the top end to feed the additional displacement that things start getting expensive on the stroker.


& if you dont upgrade the top end but do stroke it, as is the stroker will give you much more power until you do max out the top ends' breathing capacity which'll happen sooner(at a lower RPM) but on the street torque is always king. Then later on you can choose to add better heads/intake/carb etc


live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: 471Magnum] #903832
01/14/11 09:20 AM
01/14/11 09:20 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,122
Grand Haven, MI
patrick Offline
I Live Here
patrick  Offline
I Live Here

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Posts: 16,122
Grand Haven, MI
Quote:

360 is just a block at this point. It was missing a piston/rod. Crank was pretty messed-up, so it went into the scrap bin, but I can get another complete 360 for 100 bucks if I wanted. A 360 just doesn't have the exotic appeal though. If I'm going to deviate from a 340, I'm going all the way with a stroker motor.

We talk budget, but I have to consider what saving today could cost me tomorrow in terms of resale. I think installing a 360 (no matter how potent) would definitely hurt the value of the car, much more than the additional cost of rebuilding a 340. It's just numbers, but we all know how the market works on these cars. If I'm trying to sell a NOM car, I can push the merits of a "408-inch stroker motor" much easier than I can a "360 replacing the original 340".

The difference between stroking the 360, and rebuilding the 340 (w/new rods and pistons) is the cost of a crank minus the price difference on the blocks. I've done the math and basically, it's a near wash. It's not until I start upgrading things on the top end to feed the additional displacement that things start getting expensive on the stroker.




well, value is going to suffer if it's not the numbers matching block even if you don't go 340...I'd keep the original (broken) block to go with the car, personally.

sounds like you've made up your mind, but if it were me, I'd put the money into the top end before the bottom end, since that's where you'll see your greatest power increase.


1976 Spinnaker White Plymouth Duster, /6 A833OD
1986 Silver/Twilight Blue Chrysler 5th Ave HotRod **SOLD!***
2011 Toxic Orange Dodge Charger R/T
2017 Grand Cherokee Overland
2014 Jeep Cherokee Latitude (holy crap, my daughter is driving)
Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: patrick] #903833
01/14/11 09:58 AM
01/14/11 09:58 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,719
Space Station #5
471Magnum Offline OP
master
471Magnum  Offline OP
master

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Posts: 3,719
Space Station #5
Original motor is long gone. Never had it. Current motor is date code correct, but not original. I wouldn't keep the paperweight if it were. It's a 340, not a hemi. I trip over enough crap in my garage already. Moot point anyway.

Top end upgrades are a whole lot easier to do down the road than bottom end ones.


-Jim

I can fix it... my old man is a television repairman.
He's got the ultimate set of tools... I can fix it.

Currently Mopar-less
Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: 471Magnum] #903834
01/14/11 11:41 AM
01/14/11 11:41 AM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,678
W. Kentucky
justinp61 Offline
I Live Here
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,678
W. Kentucky
My , build a 408 with the 360 block. Buy a cast Scat crank and rods, a decent set of light pistons, internally balsnce it, do a little clean up in the bowls of your heads along with a GOOD valve job. Call Dave Hughes at Hughes engines and have him spec you a cam to go along with the rest of your combo. It won't be huge by any means but it needs to work with everything you have, ci, intake, heads, carb, converter, manifolds/headers, gears and weight. His cams make great power .

Most B bodys with 340s were anemic to say the least, a 408 will wake it up. Small block strokers think they're big blocks .

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: justinp61] #903835
01/14/11 12:09 PM
01/14/11 12:09 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 11,179
Atco NJ
DJVCuda Offline
I Live Here
DJVCuda  Offline
I Live Here

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Posts: 11,179
Atco NJ
I vote stroke it!

https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/show...e=1#Post5728574

Rod has the best bang for the buck and if you call him he will have even better news regarding the 4.125" cranks.

that B body will move just fine with a stroked small block.

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: justinp61] #903836
01/14/11 02:39 PM
01/14/11 02:39 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,061
New Mexico
D
dmerc Offline
super stock
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New Mexico



Quote:

My , build a 408 with the 360 block. Buy a cast Scat crank and rods, a decent set of light pistons, internally balsnce it, do a little clean up in the bowls of your heads along with a GOOD valve job. Call Dave Hughes at Hughes engines and have him spec you a cam to go along with the rest of your combo. It won't be huge by any means but it needs to work with everything you have, ci, intake, heads, carb, converter, manifolds/headers, gears and weight. His cams make great power .

Most B bodys with 340s were anemic to say the least, a 408 will wake it up. Small block strokers think they're big blocks .





Yup, a 408 will put a smile on your face, no doubt!

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: 471Magnum] #903837
01/14/11 02:59 PM
01/14/11 02:59 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 599
Spartanburg SC
MoparDan Offline
mopar
MoparDan  Offline
mopar

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 599
Spartanburg SC
I rebuilt my NOM 340 71rr to a 416in stroker. BEST money I spent! I went with a Comp nostalga grind- 236/242@50 484 lift cam; bowl cleanup/good valve job; factory intake with a 'Demon Sizzler' rebuilt thermo...the car runs great- real BB++ power but the car doesnot handle like a nose heavy BB 71b...the car is quite nimble with rebuilt frontend and monroe gas shocks (painted semi-gloss black). Go stroker you'll be glad you did.

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: dmerc] #903838
01/14/11 03:04 PM
01/14/11 03:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck  Offline
Not enough dumb comments...yet

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Quote:




Quote:

My , build a 408 with the 360 block. Buy a cast Scat crank and rods, a decent set of light pistons, internally balsnce it, do a little clean up in the bowls of your heads along with a GOOD valve job. Call Dave Hughes at Hughes engines and have him spec you a cam to go along with the rest of your combo. It won't be huge by any means but it needs to work with everything you have, ci, intake, heads, carb, converter, manifolds/headers, gears and weight. His cams make great power .

Most B bodys with 340s were anemic to say the least, a 408 will wake it up. Small block strokers think they're big blocks .





Yup, a 408 will put a smile on your face, no doubt!




in a A-body maybe. No need to go thru all that work. If all you want is a nice running 14 second engine and keep it close to stock appearance I'd go with the cheapest set-up. That would be a roller 360 w/ ported magnum heads and toss on a M1 and be done. Magnum 360 blocks can be had for around 2k. I've seen them as low as $1899 on Amazon. This one is $2299.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/89-90-91-...=item518d1bc13a

Since it is a SB car and since he already has all the SB stuff inplace and since he doesn't want to go fast I won't recommend a BB at this time.


[IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/pui5j.jpg[/IMG]
Coming soon!!!!
Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: Mr.Yuck] #903839
01/14/11 03:06 PM
01/14/11 03:06 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,884
Grand Prairie,Texas
stumpy Offline
I Win
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Posts: 32,884
Grand Prairie,Texas
My 408 moves my 74 D100 along pretty quickly. I turned a 14.20 with a 4400lb brick. It should move your car a lot faster.

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: stumpy] #903840
01/14/11 03:15 PM
01/14/11 03:15 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 524
J
Jamey Offline
mopar
Jamey  Offline
mopar
J

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 524
I'd build the best short block you can, and change heads later down the road when you have the money.

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: 471Magnum] #903841
01/14/11 03:22 PM
01/14/11 03:22 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 11,543
chicagoland,usa
B
buildanother Offline
I Live Here
buildanother  Offline
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B

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 11,543
chicagoland,usa
Stroker if you can. That thing should scoot right along while carrying no extra weight to boot.

Re: To stroke or not to stroke (small block) [Re: buildanother] #903842
01/15/11 09:57 AM
01/15/11 09:57 AM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,411
Southern Michigan
Dartman440 Offline
pro stock
Happy Birthday Dartman440  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,411
Southern Michigan
It is your car build it to your liking. I have built a lot of strokers small and big block. They are a ton of fun.The kits are way down than what they were. Scat makes nice kits. I am getting ready to do a 72 Demon 340 4 speed. I am going to make it a stroker. If you have a nice 360 block go ahead if you are worried about cost. I agree with Scott. Always think long term down the road if you decide to sell it sounds better to say it is a stroked 340 than a 360. If you are not worried about that then use what you have.

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