Quote:

---

I've never seen production numbers for a 1970 3 speed 383 4bbl E hardtop or conv.



I would guess that 5 bh27's were N code and the other 31 were L code 330hp.

There were 17 BH27's built in '70 with 4bbl and 4 speed. I would guess 2 were N code, the other 15 L code.

FYI: The "L" code cars were only available in automatic, no standard transmissions, three or four speed exist whether BH or BP cars.

Quote:

---

Looks to me like you are not reading Dan's posts.They are not confusing.An L Code car is a 2bbl ...not a 4 bbl.Galens production figures are taken from the 1970 SG 30's...an option and accesories report printed every year that breaks down all the options by percentage points.As stated ..the N code cars could have either the 330 or 335 horse 4 bbl engine....the SG30's do not differentiate between the two.I've seen 3 N code converts come up for sale in the last 3 years...only one had AC,one had the 335 horse eng with the 355 perf axle package and one had no fender tag.The actual production figure for these cars is probably closer to 50 as the 36 figure is for US cars only....does not include Canadian cars or Export Cars.

---

Exactly!! There were 59 total N code converts built in 70-6 3 speeds, 17 4 speeds, and 36 automatics. There are NO color breakdowns so 1 of 1's have to be verified only by known examples. I know of a guy around here who owns a JH23N0 Challenger that he was going to put all the stuff on a R/T body, but I told him it was rarer than the R/T and to build it as original. I hope he follows that advice. As far as the L vs N codes the L is for 2bbl and nothing else,not blue 4bbl or orange 4bbl but 2 bbl plain and simple. Either way you have a nice rare car and should enjoy it as such. I have a 6 cylinder 70 Challenger convert. I am waiting for some$$$ to restore and thats how it will be done

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

snip...the N code cars could have either the 330 or 335 horse 4 bbl engine....the SG30's do not differentiate between the two.I've seen 3 N code converts come up for sale in the last 3 years...only one had AC,one had the 335 horse eng with the 355 perf axle package and one had no fender tag...snip

---

I thought one question was did the buyer of a non 'Cuda or non R/T have the choice between serperate options of a 330hp or a 335hp ?? Or a choice in certain situations?

I understand it didn't show up on the SG report. But was there two seperate options and/or choices?

---

HP was not an option to the buyer. It was part of the assembly proceedure and contingent on other factors such as A/C and tranny.

For example, a 69 Charger with Auto and/or A/C would not get the 335 horse engine but four speed non A/C cars did. The same thing for Road Runners and Super Bees. HP was standard but when equipped with A/C with either tranny, they got the 330 horse engine.

You can put together a matrix and see why it worked out this way. The purpose is to make as few engine assembly variations as possible.

The buyer had no selection in the process. There are no special sales codes for choosing an HP assembly over the 330 HP engine.

Nicholas, I really bit my tounge this AM when I read your first replys had have thought about how to reply for the last 6 hours.....

Intentionally or not, you have insulted one of the most knowledgeable and helpful members of this Board and the Mopar community. If anyone would be able and willing to help you, and provide documentation as to his answers, it would be Dan.

IMHO...it would be in your best interest to make amends and discover a little humility.

Quote:

---

GG had an article in a Mopar mag a few years back wherein he forecast his 'top ten' rarest E body conv's, the moulin rouge auto 318 made the top ten because of its rarity/desireability in color. Pink being more desireable over plain Jane EW1 white anyday of the week. This is off topic.

---

My God, the attitude continues.

Quote:

---

GG had an article in a Mopar mag a few years back wherein he forecast his 'top ten' rarest E body conv's, the moulin rouge auto 318 made the top ten because of its rarity/desireability in color. Pink being more desireable over plain Jane EW1 white anyday of the week. This is off topic.

---

Since when is the hobby based on one mans opinion? Like the old saying,"everyone has one"!

Quote:

---

That's not why I posted this question. The answer to your question has been posted. It's quite obvious its not clear yet , I have read many of the membes say they think, and then concede they think Dan is right, and he may be, GG costs too much to ask personally, he's the expert witness. GG is not the only person qualifed to speak on Mopars. He's just very visible and published. While he's acknowledged as a great source of info and respected for compiling a ton of useful information, his works and statments are know to contain errors.

Now then, I stated, I use the 1970 factory service manual, the 1970 Mopar parts catalog, and 1970 Barracuda owner's manual to find my answers. I have researched for 19 years, maybe not as hard as others here. In this official factory literature, it states, the N code 383 is a HiPo in 5th VIN digit, and all others are L code. This only leaves two versions, the 2bbl and the 4bbl 330hp. This does it for me, the N in the VIN for engine is only used for one engine, the 335hp Road Runner engine from 1968. No one has convinced me otherwise that there are mutiple N code engines, that goes against everything Mopar printed in their factory literature! Why belive anyone but Mother Mopar. The 70 N code is an administrative code that only indicates the car has a 383-4bbl. It does not tell you which version, HP or non HP, engine the car recieved. Only the broadcast sheet, or the tag on a Lynch Road built car, can verify which assembly the car car recieved

All info I've ever seen states the 335hp 383 was standard on 'Cuda and Challenger. What members here are saying is a 'Cuda or R/T with an automatic didn't get a super commando/magnum engine. That's not what has been said. Installation of the HP engine in some models was contingent on tranny. A/C is another component that affects whether or not the car got an HP engine. Wrong. For one, I have an article from a book 'Plymouth Barracuda' full of 1970 road tests by different magazines like Road and Track from Road test magazine June 1970 in where there is an automatic 383 'Cuda being tested and it has a SuperCommando pie tin and did the 1320 in 14.4 seconds @ 98.97 mph. Sounds like a hi po motor to me.

Think about it, why would they not install a HP motor in their two performance models, the Ebodies, just because customer ordered an automatic, that makes no sense. The carb certainly didn't give the extra 5 horses. The auto tranny did not affect which engine a 'Cuda recieved.

Also, break out a 1970 Mopar parts catalog if you have one handy. Fuel - section 14-11. The 383 4bbl automatic cars came with both Holleys and Carter's, it depends on shaker hood option, w/ECS, w/out ECS, a/c, no A/C as well as auto or manual (3 & 4 speeds). So there is another false statement provided by one member that only Carter's were installed on automatics. A 383 4BBL auto w/out A/C and w/out ECS came with either a Holley R4368A or a Carter 4736S, as is in my case, I got the Carter 4736S.

All 4bbl 383's had high compression 10.5 to 1 pistons, unless an export model. The 440HP cam and springs makes the extra 5 horses, not the Holly carb found on most 4 speeds.

So, what carb came on a 383 4bbl with a 3 speed? Depends on above.

My N code 383 does not have an HP stamped next to 383 on the pad near distributor hole. This too may be a clue. Always bothered me, kept me curious. If anything, there is difinitve proof your car is not an HP car and that N does not equal HP

Why am I wrong in quoting Mopar literature directly that all 1970 N codes are HP 383 335hp, & all others (290hp/330hp) are L code? Because that info is incorrect even if it is from Chrysler. Don't blame the messenger! I'll believe my Mopar literature before believing anyone here or anywhere for that fact. Then you will miss out on A LOT of very interesting information on this Board. Mopar issued publications that contain known errors or have been found to not be entirely correct. If you believe everything published by Mopar is absolutly, entirely and without question 100% correct is to do so at your own risk. You'd think that the added weight and power loss of the A/C would dictate the added 5 horses was neccessary.

Also, there were 59 2bbl E convs, but, there are also 59 total 4bbl's w/ 3, 4spd, and auto, combined, do the math, 118 total 383's built. It just so happens that adding 36 + 17 + 6 = 59 = the 59 2bbl as well = 118 total.

---

My suggestion is to relax a little, pop a top on a cold drink, sit back, and read some of the posts by folks like Dan, Nigel and Randy. I think you'll find out how truly amazing some of these members are in their depth and breadth of knowledge and the resources they have at their fingertips. (plus they'll do it for free) There are some of the best e-body guys in the world on this site. You could learn a lot from them if you want...

Quote:

---

Also, there were 59 2bbl E convs, but, there are also 59 total 4bbl's w/ 3, 4spd, and auto, combined, do the math, 118 total 383's built.

---