Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: theclutcher]
#46265
10/12/07 12:26 PM
10/12/07 12:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,160 Texas
dannysbee
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,160
Texas
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Duster 3125# with driver 451 cid ross domed pistons stock rods .650 Comp flat tappet OOTB Ebrock heads M1 intake and 950 hp Holley Pro Part Headers 8" 4800 converter 4.56 gear SS springs MP shocks 31" tall tire 10.17 at 130 0n a 1.38 60' The bad part of the mix was the stock rods and when one broke it made a mess. New engine 451 that is in process has Manley rods with Wiseco flatops 0 decked, Eddy's cleaned up to flow 300 at .650 and milled for 72 cc chambers, and a Scott Brown flat tappet cam. I am ancious to see how this one works.
Getting old just means you were smarter than some and luckier than others.
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: dannysbee]
#46266
10/12/07 03:43 PM
10/12/07 03:43 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Car in sig pic, 400 block, 4.375 bore, 3.75 stroke, Wiseco domes 1.3 pin height 13.3 comp, long rod combo. Indy -1's ported w ported intake and 1090 king demon. .695 lift and 286@.050 roller. Best of 9.90 at 136 with a 1.32 60' at 3450#'s and no bottle
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: theclutcher]
#46267
10/12/07 03:57 PM
10/12/07 03:57 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 8,647 ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 8,647
ELYRIA,OH
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Quote:
assembling as we speak, 4.375 x 3.750 0 deck venolia/bme combo. Cam mid 280's @ .050 .700ish lift b1bs flow 350 int 250 exh. 4.88 with 14x32's and 2.93 4 gear. keep you posted maybe this weekend?
YOU ARE GOOD TO GO THIS WEEKEND. may be a new best for ya. are boosted engines counted out of this?
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: camdog440]
#46269
10/13/07 02:32 AM
10/13/07 02:32 AM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 581 Boise Idaho
65coronet500
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 581
Boise Idaho
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3.75 stroke 4.375 bore 440 block 1050 Dominator Indy single plane Manifold 440-1 heads by Dwayne Porter racing heads 11.5 to 1 compression flat tops .005 in the hole 266 @.050 646 lift roller cam 3800 lbs car 5500 stall converter 4.88 gear 30x9x15 hoosier radial slicks 10.31@ 129.4 mph 1.40 60ft time
All steel 3800 lbs with me in it 65 Coronet 451 CID Indy 440-1 heads by Dwayne Porter racing heads . ..... 10.31 @ 129.4 mph 1.40 60 ft ALL MOTOR!!!!
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: 65coronet500]
#46270
10/13/07 10:53 AM
10/13/07 10:53 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,855 Staten Island N.Y.
Dap
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,855
Staten Island N.Y.
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Here is mine -4.350 bore -3.75 stroke eagle crank -Eagle rods -Ross 99501 pistons -Pro-Gram main caps/Studs -Indy SR`s Flow 340.3 @.700 -Indy 440-3 intake manifold(OOTB) -Pro Systems Dominator -13.4CR -HS 1.6 rockers -roller cam, 275/282 @ .050, .700/.700 with 1.6RR, 108lsa -CRT Pro-Race 727 -8" Converter freshened by UCC -4.30 Gear 315/MT Radial -Race weight 3354lbs First time out with this combo the car went 10.22 @ 132 with the mufflers on. During the summer the car was in the 10.30 range. The above times were with the Cowl hood. In back to back passes I have found my unsealed 6 pack hood to be .11 faster. So with an improved 60' I feel I can get into the low 10 teens to 10 ohs in the better air.
PRH446 10.084 @ 135.21 mph N/A through chambered mufflers,3300lbs. Stock stroke wedge
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: Dap]
#46271
10/13/07 12:34 PM
10/13/07 12:34 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,531 Jacksonville, FL
Chris2581
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,531
Jacksonville, FL
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Great idea for a thread Brad,I'm glad you started it.I hope there are more combos posted,I'm looking at ideas for my new 440 to run 10.70's at 3400#'s.
Nautilus Racing- We use Superformance gaskets and Turbo Action converters/products.
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: Chris2581]
#46272
10/13/07 12:47 PM
10/13/07 12:47 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,402 State of Corruption
camdog440
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,402
State of Corruption
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I don't have mine built yet... but I'm watching this thread closely also. .030 over 440 (446) Ross 12.5:1 Pistons Manley rods .5" internal oil pickup Comp .650" Solid cam Ported iron 452's matched M1 with adapter to 1050 Dominator Hooker 1 7/8 Headers I'm hoping for 10.0s at a 2900 lb race weight.
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: camdog440]
#46273
10/13/07 12:57 PM
10/13/07 12:57 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,449 Commerce, Michigan
EasyG
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,449
Commerce, Michigan
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440 block, stock steel crank, edelbrock heads, Ultradyne cam solid flat tappet .609 lift, 267 @.050, Ross Flat top pistons, Manley H-beams, 11.5:1 compression, Victor 440 intake, 1050 dominator, Pro-parts headers, car weighs 3185 with me in it. Running a Dana 60, ladder bar coil over, 4.56 gears, 29" tall tire.
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: BradH]
#46275
10/14/07 03:06 PM
10/14/07 03:06 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 312 illinois
dodgeram1998
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 312
illinois
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.060 440 3.75 stroke sr head 310cfm @.600 indy 4150 single w/1050 adapter 260@.050 .602/.602 roller hs 1.5rockers ross 17cc domes h beams 4.10 dana 29.5*11.5 3525w/driver only as fast as 10.45@128mph1.43 60'
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: dodgeram1998]
#46276
10/14/07 04:20 PM
10/14/07 04:20 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,528 Mansfield, Tx
Jacob Pitt
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,528
Mansfield, Tx
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.055 over 3.75 stroke 440. Indy EZ heads cnc'd by MCH flowed 345 at .600. .643 lift roler cam, BME aluminum rods, Arias domed pistons probably about 14.5 to 1 compression. Indy single plain, 950 Quickfuel on 110 octane. ATI 8" converter foot braking at 3400lbs with4.30gears ran a best 1/8th mile in awesome air 6.15 109. Ran 9.92 at 135 in 94 degree heat before the crank broke. Building a 493 now but will build another 3.75 stroke for backup motor.
2013 NHRA D4 Stock Champ #4 in the World IHRA Stock 2x IHRA Div.4 Stock Champ 14x Track Champ All using a Ultimate Converter Concepts converter. Call Lenny today 704-892-6837
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: dodgeram1998]
#46277
10/14/07 06:57 PM
10/14/07 06:57 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,448 Phoenix, AZ
MoparBilly
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,448
Phoenix, AZ
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I tried to stay away, because I feel my 440 isn't particularly fast, or trick, but Brad wanted as many car details as engine details, and some previous posters...like TJMarcus...seemed to have missed that part.
My engine for six seasons: Hi-filled 71 440 block with aluminum main caps & studs. Edelbrock 84cc RPM heads with light bowl work, and portmatch to a Mopar M-1 standard flange intake. Isky 1.5 ductile iron rockers. Mopar "Trick titanium 2 inch" keepers, and Crower springs. Ultradyne 304-640 Solid Flat-tappet cam. Rotating assembly is stock steel crank, 6.76 BME Aluminum rods and Ross pistons that started as full domes, but were fly cut to resemble the old "11.5 TRW" top...compression with them .005 in the hole and 1009's was 12.2 Single line Milodon system, with dragster pan, and Milodon pump with stock cover. The 1150 Dominator sits on a custom O'malley 2 stage plate nitrous system with crossed spraybars mounted in the typical 2 inch 4150 to Dominator adapter. Headers are 2 inch primary into 3.5 collectors.
The Car: A 70 Challenger with Glass front clip, doors, decklid, bumpers, and rear valence, and all lexan windows. It has a steel floor and firewall, but not the stock ones. Engine set back is about 6 inches. Front suspension is stock, except for R&P steering mounted in the K-member. 2x3 back-half features an 8 3/4 with ladder bars and coil-overs. The car has weighed between 2815 and 2885 depending on my weight (318 at highest, 250 now) and whether or not a N20 bottle is in the trunk, with a 200lb driver and 1 battery it could hit the scale at 2700. Tranny is a Glide. Ignition is 7al3, locked out stock distributor, and homemade crank trigger that came with the car.
I'll try not to bore you, but feel it's necessary to go over the changes in 6 years, and how it has performed with the changes.
For the first 21 passes I had a 1.76 planetary in the Glide, 4.56 gear and a tight 9" Hughes 5100 stall converter. It would run good one pass, then lay over the next 3, we condemned the fuel system, so the 2 holley blues and Fram HPG1 filter got swapped for a Holley Volumax and mallory Comp 5000 filter, the Moroso Fuel log/regulator was retained. That wasn't the problem!! Turns out the sprag was damaged in the converter. Best pass was:
1.435 60' 10.261-129.35
I didn't discover the converter problem right away, instead, I switched to a 1.96 planetary in the Glide, with the bad converter it went:
1.396 60' 10.198-130.17
I replaced the converter with a TCI 8" that stalled 5700, with the 1.96 planetary and 4.56s. This was at Firebird in Phoenix(1300 alt.), in June it ran:
1.443 60' 10.123-132.40
I put in 4.10's to replace the 4.56s in preparation to run N20 at MMW in St Louis, because it seemed to run out on the top end with the looser converter. They seemed to really hurt the car on motor, but the spray loved it:
1.478 60' 10.239-130.51 motor 1.467 60' 9.531-141.68 grabbing one stage at 60ft.
That is, to this day, the best mph ever on one stage, at that jetting, but I promptly broke the 4.10s two passes later, so the trip to Gateway was made with the 4.56's
At St Louis I hit one goal, 8's on spray, and barely missed my other, 9's on motor.
1.382 60' 10.057-121.89 on motor, on the brakes! broke out on 10.10 dial 1.314 60' 8.969-147.26 on both stages, had to lift off 2nd stage at 1100 ft because rpm reached 7500!
At Speedworld Motorplex in Dec. I barely missed the 9 on motor again..on the brakes! I ran 132.44 the pass before:
1.377 60' 10.028-127.30 on a 10.05 dial!
I broke the 1.96 planetary in 2003, and replaced it with a bulletproof 1.76 Note:with that change, I've never seen another 1.3 60ft again on Motor, but everyone says the 1.96 planetaries are prone to breakage, so I live with it.
95% of my racing is 10.90 SuperStreet on the t-stop, so I don't get the chance to chase PR's on motor and juice very often. I raced the entire 03 and 04 Season with the 1.76/TCI 8"/4.56 combination with a best motor run of:
1.432 60' 10.087-132.07
During this time, we dialed in the 1150 Dominator, which is really to big for this combo. The lack of signal by the small engine requires large jets..typically in the 100/101 range, and I still have problems keeping it happy on both ends, go too big, it's dirty down low, to small, it leans out on top. I've tweaked the air bleeds to help, but it's still a problem.. I have 18's in the high speed, 75's in the intermediate and 43's in the idle.
Since maxing the combo out on N20 was impossible with the gear and converter, I began itching to make changes in 2005, I put the 9" 5100 stall back in, this time re-built as a spragless converter, and swapped in 4.30's in the back. On motor, it seemed sluggish. As the season closed down I had a match race set up with EvilB1Dart, and went out to test on n20:
1.366 60' 9.371-146.55
The motor laid over hard at 1000'ft, and was trailing death smoke before the finish. Checking my log book, I realized I had maxed out the first stage at one race in 2004, and had never re-jetted for a 2 stage pass. When I bought this plate used from Mike Gray, he had told me, "Don't try to max it out, it has distribution problems" He was right!!! I ran the engine 25 more passes including the match race with the following reults:
1.429 60' 10.252-130.16 motor 1.393 60' 9.278-144.61 Both stages
The start of the 2006 season required a freshen up of both the car and engine, the car got a new cage (7.50 cert), new brakes, new wheels and tires, and fresh paint. The engine had 493 runs, and got 2 new pistons, 2 sleeves, and a fresh stock steel crank to go with the fresh valve springs, bearings, and rings. 2 other chnges were made, it appeared that .005 in the hole and .039 gasket wasn't enough clearance with aluminum rods, as the piston tops were shiny, so I went with the .052 1039 Gasket, and my engine builder decided the 4 degrees we had the cam advanced wasn't helping, so he put it in straight up.
The first test and tune at Firebird in 2006, on the fresh stuff gave me run I'd been waiting for:
1.404 60' 9.966-133.30 The weather was 58.4, 29.8% humidity, and 28.81 baro for 1564 Density altitude.
It was back to the 10.90 grindstone until Dec., when I decided to license and get legal for 9.90 so I could run at Pinks All Out. Final license pass was:
1.385 60' 9.275-143.68 tickling the 2nd system.
Pinks all out saw a new best on a pass where I lifted out of the 2nd system at 1000' in an attempt to run 9.0:
1.299 60' 8.929-146.50
The next chance to play was MATS '07 First Pass was best ever MPH:
1.346 60' 8.972-149.05 The 3rd pass of the weekend saw me in an overconfident situation, fail to adjust my N20 tuneup for the weather and fuel I was running and promply torch the 1039 head gaskets, blow 5 ground straps off the plugs, and distort the tops of the 2 replacement pistons:
1.321 60' 8.997-141.33
I put on .052 cometics, a fresh set of plugs, and went back to 10.90 racing. I've only had one decent motor pass since then, at Fontana, spinning badly in 60ft:
1.480 60' 10.175-131.45
With the distorted piston tops, my buddies warn against N20 use, but I recently ran a 9.60 index race and squeezed one system just to play:
1.428 60' 9.569-140.32 with the DA at 3848 ft.
The 440 now has 672 passes on it, and I'll probably take it out for some attempts at going quick this winter, maybe a little more squeeze, but it has to last 1 more 10.90 season before the Indy -1 headed stroker will be ready to take over. At this point I don't think it has any more "Bests" left in it.
"Livin' in a powder keg and givin' off sparks"
4 Street cars, 5 Race engines
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: MoparBilly]
#46279
10/16/07 05:27 PM
10/16/07 05:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,623 Ca Registered: Mar-2001
hemiallen
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,623
Ca Registered: Mar-2001
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446- stock 6 pack rods 2295's stock eddy 84 cc's decked .060" Flowed Torker and 2" spacer, 930 cfm Nyutten 750 holley Compression 13.3:1 after notching pistons for 270@5 fast ramp solid cam. Ran our old 66 charger at about 3350 plus 150# driver to 1.48-60', 10.80 @ 123 on 14x33 slicks. Found out when we went to pull the engine to sell the roller that my son was 1/2" shy of being able to open the carb all the way Guess he was too busy to move the seat up 3 inches......like I asked him. Oh well All I know is... it is a good build for a somewhat old school (LOL) build. Allen
'05 Quad cab hemi truck- Flame red- magnaflow exhaust
70-440 cuda-
74-360-4v Challenger- new driver car
EX vehicles:
66 charger Drag car- 10.80 at 123 mph
57 imperial 392 Hemi
1960 Sanger V drive- mondello-built 392 hemi
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Re: Fast 3.75"-stroke 440 combos?
[Re: BradH]
#46281
12/10/08 11:46 AM
12/10/08 11:46 AM
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 6,446 NJ-USA
HPMike
master
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master
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 6,446
NJ-USA
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Quote:
I know there are folks on here who have built some potent low-to-mid 10-sec (and faster) 400/440-based combinations that retain the stock 3.75" stroke. I'd like to know more about them, including the related details of the rest of the car (weight w/ driver, gearing, converter, etc.).
Thanks, Brad
Brad
While it doesn't meet your criteria, Scott McKenzies FAST car is pretty impressive for what it is. I believe he has gone into the 11.80's with the hydraulic cammed, stock stroke 440(446, maybe?)on bias plies with full exhaust. And it's not a gutted liteweight, either. I am impressed with that combo
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