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How high do you rev your 440s? #3093022
11/10/22 01:54 AM
11/10/22 01:54 AM
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,072
Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak Offline OP
super stock
Brad_Haak  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,072
Loudoun County, VA
As in 3.75" stroke combos, not 4.15" +

My old build made peak HP at 6300-6400, I shifted at 6500 and went through the traps at 6800+

New combination makes peak HP at 6800 and I expect will go through the traps at 7000+... won't know where it'll want to be shifted until it sees the track again

Thx


2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320 (2022)
100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft)
wheels, tires, air filter: 1.714, 11.833 at 115.80 (DA 310 ft)

1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip (2008)
pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Brad_Haak] #3093030
11/10/22 02:38 AM
11/10/22 02:38 AM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,007
Bend,OR USA
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Cab_Burge Offline
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Bend,OR USA
I would start out shifting it around 6000 RPM for several runs and then try 6500, if it runs quicker and faster at 6500 the try 7000 RPM and go from there. I look at all th enumbers on the time slip, sometimes over revvingit in 1st and 2nd gear make the car faster, some times not shruggy work Not all tach reads exactly the same also
The big head, big cam motors high compression race motors like different shift points than other combinations. Do all your testing based on the time slips and spark plugs up wrench scope


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Brad_Haak] #3093036
11/10/22 03:59 AM
11/10/22 03:59 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 265
Anchorage, Alaska
metallicareload Offline
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metallicareload  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 265
Anchorage, Alaska
Man, good question. I'm trying to keep RPM down, because I got a stock crank with stock rods and swinging TRWs. But the higher I shift the faster it goes


440, 4-Speed, 3.54
1968, when Dinosaurs ruled the Earth
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Brad_Haak] #3093038
11/10/22 05:03 AM
11/10/22 05:03 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,963
Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart Offline
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Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
Originally Posted by Brad_Haak
As in 3.75" stroke combos, not 4.15" +

My old build made peak HP at 6300-6400, I shifted at 6500 and went through the traps at 6800+

New combination makes peak HP at 6800 and I expect will go through the traps at 7000+... won't know where it'll want to be shifted until it sees the track again

Thx

My guess is it will like 6800 shift points, because actual shift point (data logged) is most likely a couple hundred rpm higher than when you shift. So start at 6600 Imho and go up in steps, after getting a base line that is solid info to work from.


8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Brad_Haak] #3093054
11/10/22 08:37 AM
11/10/22 08:37 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,768
Keymar, MD
DusterKid Offline
top fuel
DusterKid  Offline
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Posts: 1,768
Keymar, MD
Most of my 440 combo's which have been fairly mild (under 11:1, hydraulic flat tappet cams in the .530ish range and steel heads reworked) I always shifted at 6,000. My current engine is still mild by most standards, 10:9:1 with TF 240 heads and a .557 solid cam. If I'm running 1/8th mile I shift at 6,000, but if I run 1/4 mile I shift at 6500. Doesn't seem to make a difference, but with the gearing and tire size it seems to be more consistent in the 1/4 if I shift at 6500.

Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: gregsdart] #3093063
11/10/22 09:15 AM
11/10/22 09:15 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 13,182
aZLiViN
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J_BODY Offline
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aZLiViN
Like Greg mentioned….. data recording can definitely make you adjust your shift light. It’s pretty interesting how much “time” can go by from: see shift light, arm moves shifter, trans makes mechanical shift

Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: J_BODY] #3093066
11/10/22 09:25 AM
11/10/22 09:25 AM
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,072
Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak Offline OP
super stock
Brad_Haak  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,072
Loudoun County, VA
I don't have a data logger, but I'll have a playback tach for the first time ever


2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320 (2022)
100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft)
wheels, tires, air filter: 1.714, 11.833 at 115.80 (DA 310 ft)

1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip (2008)
pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Brad_Haak] #3093067
11/10/22 09:26 AM
11/10/22 09:26 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,319
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda Offline
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Marion, South Carolina [><]
My old stock stroke 440 w/ a pretty big roller and Indy SRs (unported) liked 6800. That was the combo that went 10.40s at 128-129 mph at 3700 lbs.
My older mild 509 cammed iron head motor liked 6000-6200...11.40s at 117 mph in the same car.

Brad, I think you'll be in the 6800 ballpark.


CHIP
'70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60
'69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60
'71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75
'73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: J_BODY] #3093068
11/10/22 09:28 AM
11/10/22 09:28 AM
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,913
usa
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lewtot184 Offline
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lewtot184  Offline
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Posts: 3,913
usa
stock 440, shift point 4600rpm;.... drive.

Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: lewtot184] #3093082
11/10/22 10:15 AM
11/10/22 10:15 AM
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,072
Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak Offline OP
super stock
Brad_Haak  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,072
Loudoun County, VA
I suppose I should mention the bottom end has an Eagle crank, Eagle rods, and Ross pistons

The only RPM-related concern might be the oiling system, but the upgrades done to it w/ the last build were targeted at better oil control at high(er) RPM


2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320 (2022)
100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft)
wheels, tires, air filter: 1.714, 11.833 at 115.80 (DA 310 ft)

1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip (2008)
pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Brad_Haak] #3093087
11/10/22 10:56 AM
11/10/22 10:56 AM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570
UK
rb446 Offline
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rb446  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570
UK
In my opinion there's only 1 oiling system for 7k rpm and thats external, I know many have been ok with 1/2" internal and have lived but back in the day when I built my 440SP motor I looked at the oiling system and there was no question about it to me about not using it.

My motor ran to 6800rpm every run NA making just 515-ish fwhp with its stock bottom end and BV 906's and a .650" sft cam, 4.88's/32's, with N20 it trapped@7450, I only did that once!!, that motor is still running today albeit with a smaller cam. My mate with his 600hp 440 and 1/2" internal lasted 2 seasons@6800 and then threw 2 rods.


Last edited by rb446; 11/10/22 10:58 AM.

1969 'Cuda 446ci, best 9.96@133.9 in 1990
1971 340 'Cuda, best 11.01@122.8 in 1987
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: rb446] #3093090
11/10/22 11:03 AM
11/10/22 11:03 AM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 702
Lake Villa Il
INTMD8 Offline
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INTMD8  Offline
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Lake Villa Il
Hemi but almost stock 440 displacement. (3.75 stroke 4.31 bore). 7,600 so far.

Using Milodon 31580 oil pan and internal pickup.


69 Charger. 438ci Gen2 hemi. Flex fuel. Holley HP efi. 650rwhp @7250 510rwtq @5700
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: J_BODY] #3093092
11/10/22 11:05 AM
11/10/22 11:05 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,005
Tulsa OK
Bad340fish Offline
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Bad340fish  Offline
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Tulsa OK
Originally Posted by J_BODY
Like Greg mentioned….. data recording can definitely make you adjust your shift light. It’s pretty interesting how much “time” can go by from: see shift light, arm moves shifter, trans makes mechanical shift


My tach reads a little higher than my EFI does, it works out great, I pull the lever when I see 7000 and the actual shift takes place at 7000 +/- 50RPM or so.


68 Barracuda Formula S 340
87 "Chrysler" Conquest
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Bad340fish] #3093095
11/10/22 11:19 AM
11/10/22 11:19 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,116
PA.
pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
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PA.


Been a long time for me to have a stock stroke 440 but back in the late 1980’s I was shifting my Direct Connection copied build with the old .750 lift roller cams and was shifting from 6700-6900 rpm. Back then 9.80’s was pretty quick with the junk we had available


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Cab_Burge] #3093099
11/10/22 11:51 AM
11/10/22 11:51 AM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 288
Nevada
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merpar Offline
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merpar  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 288
Nevada
I agree with you Cab, 100% It shouldn't need more than 6-8 passes to see what the motor likes. My first build of a 451 with Hilborn stack inj. only took 4 passes found the correct pill and rpm it liked.

Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: merpar] #3093103
11/10/22 11:59 AM
11/10/22 11:59 AM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,644
North Carolina
sasquatch Offline
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sasquatch  Offline
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Posts: 2,644
North Carolina
Well I am working on one that should turn 10000 and live......Pulling truck application and I am tired of hearing that a dodge won't turn that hard and live unless it is a hemi for some reason.....

Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Brad_Haak] #3093124
11/10/22 12:33 PM
11/10/22 12:33 PM
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,072
Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak Offline OP
super stock
Brad_Haak  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,072
Loudoun County, VA
Originally Posted by Brad_Haak
...
My old build made peak HP at 6300-6400, I shifted at 6500 and went through the traps at 6800+

New combination makes peak HP at 6800 and I expect will go through the traps at 7000+... won't know where it'll want to be shifted until it sees the track again

Checked my notes in The Wayback Machine and remembered I used to hit the 1-2 shift at 6200 and the 2-3 at 6500. Sounds comparable to new engine going 1-2 at 6500 and 2-3 at 7000.


2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320 (2022)
100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft)
wheels, tires, air filter: 1.714, 11.833 at 115.80 (DA 310 ft)

1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip (2008)
pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: sasquatch] #3093184
11/10/22 04:29 PM
11/10/22 04:29 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,116
sc
T
tjmarcus1 Offline
top fuel
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,116
sc
I must hear more about this 10grand motor!

Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Brad_Haak] #3093185
11/10/22 04:29 PM
11/10/22 04:29 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 30,947
Oregon
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AndyF Offline
I Win
AndyF  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 30,947
Oregon
You have good heads and a big cam for a stock stroke engine so I wouldn't be surprised that it is still pulling at 7000 rpm. Most strokers lay over well before then, even with MW heads.

We have a low deck 512 street engine on the dyno today. It is all done at 5500 rpm but it makes 600 ft-lbs of torque! Going in a Dart, the owner will be happy the first time he stomps on the pedal!

Re: How high do you rev your 440s? [Re: Brad_Haak] #3093189
11/10/22 05:04 PM
11/10/22 05:04 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 183
WI
mopar873 Offline
member
mopar873  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 183
WI
440 + .030/ Indy 440-1 heads/ Comp .690 lift SS cam/ lots of compression/ single carb......I usually shifted at about 7200. I did exceed that a few times, but the car didn't really E.T. or MPH any quicker.

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