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Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: Transman] #3052369
06/22/22 11:35 AM
06/22/22 11:35 AM
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Just fixed a 440 that had a marine impeller on the water pump. The impeller was made to spin backwards. Double check the direction its facing. Here's a reverse one!

impeller.jpegpump2.jpeg
Last edited by R/T1968R/T; 06/22/22 12:32 PM.
Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: Transman] #3052371
06/22/22 11:36 AM
06/22/22 11:36 AM
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Take off the radiator cap and start the car and check for flow as it heats up. If the pump is working and the thermostat opens you'll be able to see it easily. If it works with cap off install cap and if flow stops through hose you have an air lock.

Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: R/T1968R/T] #3052383
06/22/22 12:07 PM
06/22/22 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by R/T1968R/T
Just fixed a 440 that had a marine impeller on the water pump. The impeller was made to spin backwards. Double check the direction its facing. Here's a reverse one!

Looks just like the normal one I have

image.jpg
Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: cudaman1969] #3052398
06/22/22 12:36 PM
06/22/22 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by cudaman1969
Originally Posted by R/T1968R/T
Just fixed a 440 that had a marine impeller on the water pump. The impeller was made to spin backwards. Double check the direction its facing. Here's a reverse one!

Looks just like the normal one I have


These are not my pictures of the one I fixed. One of these is a reverse pump for sure.

impeller.jpegpump2.jpeg
Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: R/T1968R/T] #3052419
06/22/22 02:06 PM
06/22/22 02:06 PM
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UPPER MICHIGAN, MARQUETTE COUN...
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Originally Posted by R/T1968R/T
Originally Posted by cudaman1969
Originally Posted by R/T1968R/T
Just fixed a 440 that had a marine impeller on the water pump. The impeller was made to spin backwards. Double check the direction its facing. Here's a reverse one!

Looks just like the normal one I have


These are not my pictures of the one I fixed. One of these is a reverse pump for sure.


I would not count on them being reverse rotation or marine. https://board.moparts.org/ubbthread...-block-oem-water-pumps-for-426-hemi.html

Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: Sniper] #3052472
06/22/22 05:34 PM
06/22/22 05:34 PM
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Sniper -- T/Anks for that information about the spring in the lower hose... I have only found new hoses WITHOUT the internal spring... puzzled me, figured it was a cost factor for the aftermarket replacements.

I recently changed my lower hose (as it was slightly leaking at the water pump neck hose connection.... hose probably 30+ years old!)... and had some overheating issues afterwards... and excessively high radiator and hose pressure. So, after it wanted to explode upon eventually releasing the cap (couple days!), I then ran my engine without the cap, without a thermostat.. and eventually saw big bubbles... blurps... coming out of the radiator... I obviously had some air pockets. IF it made any difference, my radiator is a new aluminum Triple-Flow design from U.S. Radiator.... down-up- down.


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Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: Mopar Mitch] #3052577
06/22/22 10:44 PM
06/22/22 10:44 PM
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I seen this only once, but I found a lower radiator hose was coming apart on the inside. The section that was separating, would act like a flap, and block off the incoming coolant, greatly restricting flow. Not likely your case, but like I say, it has happened once before...

Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: 440_Offroader] #3052694
06/23/22 12:12 PM
06/23/22 12:12 PM
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It there is proper coolant flow through the engine prior to the stat opening, then the heater hoses and bypass hose should be getting hot.

If they’re not warming up fairly quickly, there is likely some sort of water pump problem.


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Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: fast68plymouth] #3052698
06/23/22 12:21 PM
06/23/22 12:21 PM
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Rancho Cordova, CA
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Hi guys, I didn't get a chance to do the flow test last weekend as I had planned. But I will post a new message with what I find hopefully by this weekend.

I grabbed a new water pump from Napa just in case, since that's what my gut said even though it's not leaking as has been my previous experience with failing water pumps. It's promising to see other people have had the same issue and it's been with a non-pumping water pump, which makes total sense since I have a working thermostat yet no movement into the upper hose. And things were working fine in the system even without a hole drilled in the thermostat. Thanks for the inputs.

Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: Exit1965] #3053340
06/25/22 06:48 PM
06/25/22 06:48 PM
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Back when I was in high school I had a '64 Valiant, 225, that developed an intermittent over heat issue.

Turned out that the factory fit plastic impeller was basically free on the pump shaft, but had a little grip, when it felt like messing with me, the impeller would shift just enough in the pump cavity to stop it, fan still turning happily, no belt squeal, but no circulation either.

This didn't happen all the time, but every once in a while I would look at the gauge and the needle would be heading for the high side.

I was so glad when they stopped using those damn plastic impellers ...


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Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: VL21] #3053559
06/26/22 04:14 PM
06/26/22 04:14 PM
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Well I put it back together without thermostat, and indeed the water pump was stirring things up in the radiator. I put a 1/8" hole in the thermostat, put it back in, added coolant mix burping it as I go. Started it up and it's running great. I think I must have been low on coolant and/or air pockets.

Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: Exit1965] #3053622
06/26/22 07:40 PM
06/26/22 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Exit1965
Well I put it back together without thermostat, and indeed the water pump was stirring things up in the radiator. I put a 1/8" hole in the thermostat, put it back in, added coolant mix burping it as I go. Started it up and it's running great. I think I must have been low on coolant and/or air pockets.

Good find, now go drive it in the heat slowly to make sure you fixed it scope luck
Let us know please scope


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Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: R/T1968R/T] #3054056
06/28/22 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by R/T1968R/T
Just fixed a 440 that had a marine impeller on the water pump. The impeller was made to spin backwards. Double check the direction its facing. Here's a reverse one!


FWIW I put a Milodon HV pump on my car recently and it's reversed compared to the one I took off. I then compared the one I took off to two other old ones I had and they are all oriented the same way.

The Milodon part number was clearly marked for CW rotation. I got it from Mancini. https://www.manciniracing.com/brbhigvolwat.html


20220617_160345.jpg

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Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: Cab_Burge] #3054077
06/28/22 12:12 PM
06/28/22 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Cab_Burge
Originally Posted by Exit1965
Well I put it back together without thermostat, and indeed the water pump was stirring things up in the radiator. I put a 1/8" hole in the thermostat, put it back in, added coolant mix burping it as I go. Started it up and it's running great. I think I must have been low on coolant and/or air pockets.

Good find, now go drive it in the heat slowly to make sure you fixed it scope luck
Let us know please scope


Myself, I would change that thermostat out just in case it's flaky. Cheap insurance IMO beer

Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: Bob Stinson] #3054180
06/28/22 06:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Bob Stinson
Originally Posted by R/T1968R/T
Just fixed a 440 that had a marine impeller on the water pump. The impeller was made to spin backwards. Double check the direction its facing. Here's a reverse one!


FWIW I put a Milodon HV pump on my car recently and it's reversed compared to the one I took off. I then compared the one I took off to two other old ones I had and they are all oriented the same way.

The Milodon part number was clearly marked for CW rotation. I got it from Mancini. https://www.manciniracing.com/brbhigvolwat.html



Both of those pumps have the impeller blades at 90° to the centerline of the shaft. They would both perform equally whatever direction they spin. The orientation of the arms holding the impeller blades is irrelevant.


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Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: Hemi_Joel] #3054295
06/29/22 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Hemi_Joel
Originally Posted by Bob Stinson
Originally Posted by R/T1968R/T
Just fixed a 440 that had a marine impeller on the water pump. The impeller was made to spin backwards. Double check the direction its facing. Here's a reverse one!


FWIW I put a Milodon HV pump on my car recently and it's reversed compared to the one I took off. I then compared the one I took off to two other old ones I had and they are all oriented the same way.

The Milodon part number was clearly marked for CW rotation. I got it from Mancini. https://www.manciniracing.com/brbhigvolwat.html



Both of those pumps have the impeller blades at 90° to the centerline of the shaft. They would both perform equally whatever direction they spin. The orientation of the arms holding the impeller blades is irrelevant.


Thanks for the reply. I got a little paranoid because I had been reading a thread on the HAMB that talked about reversed water pumps on GM cars with serpentine systems, so I checked the description on Mancini's website before installing it.

The main difference I noted in the HV pump was longer blades and that plate welded behind them. Some of the old pumps had 6 blades, others had 8, I figure that is A/C vs non A/C.


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Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: Bob Stinson] #3054585
06/30/22 08:02 AM
06/30/22 08:02 AM
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Now I'm totally confused. Why would Mancini state CW rotation if there was no difference? I pulled many boat motors and there was definitely a difference between left and right rotation motors.

Re: engine overheats, upper radiator hose cold, thermostat works [Re: R/T1968R/T] #3054622
06/30/22 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by R/T1968R/T
Now I'm totally confused. Why would Mancini state CW rotation if there was no difference? I pulled many boat motors and there was definitely a difference between left and right rotation motors.


Have you never seen an incorrect description for a part before? Straight vane pumps don't care, especially if you have an anti-cavitation plate on it. Curved vanes do.

From Cardone.

Quote
Impellers must turn in a direction so that the fluid is pushed (not
scooped) through the pump (see sample drawing below). Exceptions
are pumps with straight vane impellers (vanes perpendicular to the
shaft) and shrouded impellers. Straight vane impellers function in
either direction. Shrouded impellers turn so they scoop the fluid.

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