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Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: HotRodDave] #3037349
04/26/22 08:01 PM
04/26/22 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by HotRodDave
Originally Posted by IMGTX
Originally Posted by cudaman1969
Plenty of water in the ocean but that takes POWER to take the salt out. The need for oil is still prevalent to do that job.


I always wondered why they don't pipe that seawater through the Rockies into some Arizona/Utah/New Mexico deserts or into the Cali deserts and into large sealed retention ponds.

Let the sun do the work and ship the salt back to the ocean or sell it.


Salt is way too plentiful and cheap to need to do that, it is very cheaply mined or evaporated near oceans to bother with that.


He's talking about evaporating out the water in a sealed system to collect it for freshwater use and selling the salt as a byproduct.

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: Sniper] #3037378
04/26/22 09:38 PM
04/26/22 09:38 PM
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Freeport IL USA
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Originally Posted by Sniper
Originally Posted by HotRodDave
Originally Posted by IMGTX
Originally Posted by cudaman1969
Plenty of water in the ocean but that takes POWER to take the salt out. The need for oil is still prevalent to do that job.


I always wondered why they don't pipe that seawater through the Rockies into some Arizona/Utah/New Mexico deserts or into the Cali deserts and into large sealed retention ponds.

Let the sun do the work and ship the salt back to the ocean or sell it.


Salt is way too plentiful and cheap to need to do that, it is very cheaply mined or evaporated near oceans to bother with that.


He's talking about evaporating out the water in a sealed system to collect it for freshwater use and selling the salt as a byproduct.


You do understand that if you dig a depression for a pond in the desert, and fill it with salt water from the ocean, that the water will evaporate from the heat and dry air, and you will be left with a depression that used to be a pond that will be full of salt with little or no water, right?

The concept of removing the salt from ocean water is to provide fresh water for the cities along the ocean. If they did just that, and capped off the locations where they are currently pulling the water from the Colorado river basin to supply fresh water to those cities, it would probably solve both problems in a few of years.

Not building cities in the desert in the first place would have been the best correct response, but we are way past that point now.

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: poorboy] #3037381
04/26/22 09:42 PM
04/26/22 09:42 PM
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Looking for a way out of Middl...
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I was thinking more about capturing the water. Sealing / Covering the ponds to catch the evaporated water but using the sun as power for the desalination process.

I guess I wasn't too clear. Sorry about that.

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: IMGTX] #3037388
04/26/22 09:48 PM
04/26/22 09:48 PM
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Actually….. here’s your salt answer smile

https://californiawithyou.com/2021/01/10/amboy-salt-flats-amboy-california/

I’ve spent many a day exploring in the Mojave smile

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: J_BODY] #3037420
04/26/22 10:41 PM
04/26/22 10:41 PM
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Originally Posted by poorboy
Originally Posted by Sniper




He's talking about evaporating out the water in a sealed system to collect it for freshwater use and selling the salt as a byproduct.


You do understand that if you dig a depression for a pond in the desert, and fill it with salt water from the ocean, that the water will evaporate from the heat and dry air, and you will be left with a depression that used to be a pond that will be full of salt with little or no water, right?

The concept of removing the salt from ocean water is to provide fresh water for the cities along the ocean. If they did just that, and capped off the locations where they are currently pulling the water from the Colorado river basin to supply fresh water to those cities, it would probably solve both problems in a few of years.

Not building cities in the desert in the first place would have been the best correct response, but we are way past that point now.

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: 360view] #3037500
04/27/22 07:36 AM
04/27/22 07:36 AM
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A large prize should be offered for the best idea or new invention on how to get more fresh water into the Colorado watershed.

Big prize, $ Billion or more.

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: 360view] #3037520
04/27/22 08:52 AM
04/27/22 08:52 AM
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Western Colorado High Desert
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I started going to Powell in 1971. I was there in 1980 when it was filled. I was there in 1983 when they over filler it. It has been dropping ever since. I was there last year. Here is a shot of the Bullfrog boat ramp. This ramp is over 1/4 mile long. As of right now no boats in or out of the water.
The Colorado River goes through my town and I don't think Powell or Mead will ever be full again.
In the 2nd pic you can see where the water should be.

123951.jpg123_1.jpg

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Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: moparmarks] #3037522
04/27/22 08:55 AM
04/27/22 08:55 AM
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Western Colorado High Desert
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I don't think that people realize just how bad it is. It is going to get really ugly soon.


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Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: moparmarks] #3037605
04/27/22 01:31 PM
04/27/22 01:31 PM
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Calgary, Alberta Canada
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Hence my question about desalination plants along the west coast to provide the water that is being drawn out of Colorado river . . .

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: 360view] #3037669
04/27/22 04:37 PM
04/27/22 04:37 PM
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Kalispell Mt.
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The natural flow of the Colorado river should be around 20,000 cubic feet per second

The Columbia river dumps 265,000 cubic feet per second of fresh water into the ocean! Over 10 times what the un-interrupted flow of the Colorado should be!

My idea is the best and everyone else's is terrible! (just kidding) but honestly they do not need to pump much, just dump a small portion of the Columbia into a pipe near Portland, lay 1000 miles of pipe on the ocean floor to LA with no tunneling needed and very minimal disturbance to any ecosystems and if there is a leak big stinking deal as that fresh water was just about to end up in the ocean anyhow. The only pumping needed would be to pump it out of the southern end of the pipe into the LA water plant or a reservoir or something. If you try to get it from the other side of the Rockies you will need at least 1500 miles of pipe, drilling through mountains and under or over roads, securing right of ways, pumping it up hill several thousand feet takes a lot of energy, that's how we make so much energy damming it up and letting it fall a couple hundred feet. This plan frees up the portion of Colorado river water going to southern California cities so Phoenix and Vegas can have more, heck we could probably get Mexico to chip in some of the cost if we let some more of the Colorado flow into Mexico.


I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!



Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: HotRodDave] #3037792
04/27/22 10:05 PM
04/27/22 10:05 PM
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How deep are water wells out there. Do many use well water for survival. I haven’t paid a water bill since 1984.


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Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: pittsburghracer] #3037809
04/27/22 10:57 PM
04/27/22 10:57 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 12,493
Western Colorado High Desert
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There are wells just depends where you are. Take Nevada. Las Vegas get pretty much all their drinking water from Lake Mead. 60 miles to the west in Pahrump it is 100% ground water. Most all the farm land in the California Center Valley is feed with ground water. Been sucking the aquifer dry for decades. Guess they are down to 2500' there now. Now the ground is settling 10-20 feet.
They are wanting to drill more aqua ducts to take even more water from the west side to the east side to feed Denver and the Front Range. Here in the Colorado River District we are fighting with both Denver and all the states down stream for water.


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Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: HotRodDave] #3037814
04/27/22 11:28 PM
04/27/22 11:28 PM
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Western Colorado High Desert
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Originally Posted by HotRodDave
The natural flow of the Colorado river should be around 20,000 cubic feet per second

The Columbia river dumps 265,000 cubic feet per second of fresh water into the ocean! Over 10 times what the un-interrupted flow of the Colorado should be!

My idea is the best and everyone else's is terrible! (just kidding) but honestly they do not need to pump much, just dump a small portion of the Columbia into a pipe near Portland, lay 1000 miles of pipe on the ocean floor to LA with no tunneling needed and very minimal disturbance to any ecosystems and if there is a leak big stinking deal as that fresh water was just about to end up in the ocean anyhow. The only pumping needed would be to pump it out of the southern end of the pipe into the LA water plant or a reservoir or something. If you try to get it from the other side of the Rockies you will need at least 1500 miles of pipe, drilling through mountains and under or over roads, securing right of ways, pumping it up hill several thousand feet takes a lot of energy, that's how we make so much energy damming it up and letting it fall a couple hundred feet. This plan frees up the portion of Colorado river water going to southern California cities so Phoenix and Vegas can have more, heck we could probably get Mexico to chip in some of the cost if we let some more of the Colorado flow into Mexico.


This actually one of the best ideas that I've heard.


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Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: moparmarks] #3037827
04/27/22 11:56 PM
04/27/22 11:56 PM
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Red Deer, Alberta
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I remember reading, back in the mid-80's, an article that quoted an engineer from the Bureau of Reclamation. This was only a few years after Powell had reached full pool, which took a remarkable 17 years. His position was that Lake Powell was going to be the death knell for Lake Mead, because Powell would lose such a large quantity of water to evaporation. It's now believed that Powell loses 860,000 acre/ft per year to evaporation, far more than was previously thought.
Now, up here in Canada, we have a band of usual suspects that like to blather on that the Americans want to take our water. The usual tale is that they want to pump it out of the Great Lakes and ship it to the dry Southwest. These people are usually geographically challenged. Most of where the water needs to go is not only a couple thousand miles away from the Great Lakes, it's a couple thousand feet up. Meanwhile, Canada sends about 200,000 cu/ft per second of clean fresh water across the border via the Columbia. If the need was really serious, you could pull 25-50,000 cu/ft per second out of the Columbia, east of Umatilla, and pump it downhill to the Salton Sea. Use that strictly for irrigation for a decade, and the Salton would be cleaned up dramatically. But, we're talking huge dollars.

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: moparmarks] #3037869
04/28/22 07:46 AM
04/28/22 07:46 AM
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I wonder if there is a map somewhere showing the aquifers underground in the Western USA?

Is there a soft, easy to bore through, rock layer aquifer
that is both underneath the main channel of the Missouri River and outcrops somewhere inside the Colorado River watershed?

There are volcanic ash layers in the West that stretch over vast areas, from Yellowstone and other volcanoes.
Some ash layers contain “rare earth metals” that are needed for today’s high output DC motors.

I wonder if you could “kill two birds with one stone”
by mining a layer of rare earth ore from the Missouri to Colorado watersheds.

In the 1990s I bought pure samples of each of the Rare Earth metals from the Mountain Pass, CA mine near the NV border.
The rocks there at Mountain Pass also contain Uranium and Thorium.

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: bigdad] #3038082
04/28/22 11:21 PM
04/28/22 11:21 PM
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What needs to happen is population control. Too many people, too much demand on the existing water supply.


'67 is an abbreviation of 1967
67' is an abbreviation of 67 feet
They are not interchangeable.
Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: HotRodDave] #3038085
04/28/22 11:44 PM
04/28/22 11:44 PM
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Originally Posted by HotRodDave
The natural flow of the Colorado river should be around 20,000 cubic feet per second

The Columbia river dumps 265,000 cubic feet per second of fresh water into the ocean! Over 10 times what the un-interrupted flow of the Colorado should be!

My idea is the best and everyone else's is terrible! (just kidding) but honestly they do not need to pump much, just dump a small portion of the Columbia into a pipe near Portland, lay 1000 miles of pipe on the ocean floor to LA with no tunneling needed and very minimal disturbance to any ecosystems and if there is a leak big stinking deal as that fresh water was just about to end up in the ocean anyhow. The only pumping needed would be to pump it out of the southern end of the pipe into the LA water plant or a reservoir or something. If you try to get it from the other side of the Rockies you will need at least 1500 miles of pipe, drilling through mountains and under or over roads, securing right of ways, pumping it up hill several thousand feet takes a lot of energy, that's how we make so much energy damming it up and letting it fall a couple hundred feet. This plan frees up the portion of Colorado river water going to southern California cities so Phoenix and Vegas can have more, heck we could probably get Mexico to chip in some of the cost if we let some more of the Colorado flow into Mexico.


It’s not your idea, it’s been talked about for many years.
https://www.sandiegouniontribune.co...california-columbia-2015apr10-story.html

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: lilcuda] #3038087
04/28/22 11:51 PM
04/28/22 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by lilcuda

What needs to happen is population control. Too many people, too much demand on the existing water supply.


This viewpoint is always spoken by people that could pull the plug on themselves and get the trend moving.
They never do. They often think that they are the superior ones and that others should just die off.
Bill Gates is one of these assclowns.

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: Kern Dog] #3038092
04/29/22 12:04 AM
04/29/22 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Kern Dog
Originally Posted by lilcuda

What needs to happen is population control. Too many people, too much demand on the existing water supply.


This viewpoint is always spoken by people that could pull the plug on themselves and get the trend moving.
They never do. They often think that they are the superior ones and that others should just die off.
Bill Gates is one of these assclowns.


You can't have a planet with all land used for living/working/industry/food production.
If diseases/famine/wars/disasters were all eliminated, human population would grow like algae in a stagnant pond,.
The Well-Off survive nicely because the Not-So-Well-Off don't: it's a balancing act.

Re: Lake Powell is 70% empty [Re: 360view] #3038143
04/29/22 08:14 AM
04/29/22 08:14 AM
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How many humans can the earth support?
Will water, food, space or warfare be the limiting factor?

How much crude oil, natural gas, or coal can humans extract from the earth at reasonable cost?

Algae store Omega-3 oils to use as food when the sun is not shining.
There is A LOT of algae in the oceans, lakes and rivers.
What percent of the total algae would humans have to collect and squeeze to provide enough oil to power all of human civilization?
What should be done with the non oil leftover body parts of that fraction of the algae?

Long long ago blue-green algae started turning sunlight into food,
left solid wastes as distinctly looking rock (Stromatolites)
and let loose a gaseous waste (Oxygen) too,
which started a whopper of “climate change”.

Has human caused “climate change”
got any where close to algae caused climate change?

Algae creating stromatolites rock mounds are still alive today,
but just in spotty unique places.
Should we search these algae out,
and kill them for their past climate “sins” ?

Hmmmm - could algae be tricked into transferring water to the Colorado watershed?

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