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Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... #3034470
04/17/22 05:48 PM
04/17/22 05:48 PM
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 11,485
Looking for a way out of Middl...
IMGTX Offline OP
I Live Here
IMGTX  Offline OP
I Live Here

Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 11,485
Looking for a way out of Middl...
I am going to replace the HVAC unit in my house soon...

I can install it myself if it is more cost effective/practical but I am going to get some estimates from commercial installers.

I have been looking at units online and they seem to push Goodman Units.

I assume that others like Trane or other name brands sell only to licensed contractor/installers?

Is there a brand to avoid or you endorse?

I expect many brands require a licensed installer to install them for the warranty to be valid, something to take into consideration.
What kind of warranty do most units have?

Any advice?

Some facts if you need them.

I currently have a 2 ton split unit (Condenser outside heater/air handler inside). Gas heat, updraft heat/air handler unit in the basement. I plan on going back with the same but a better size for my house.

My calculations from HVACdirect.com say 3.5 ton A/C and 55,000 BTU heater.

My house is 1200 sq ft upstairs and 600 sq ft in the basement I want to add to the HVAC. Let's call it 1800 sq ft.

Thanks in advance

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: IMGTX] #3034475
04/17/22 06:00 PM
04/17/22 06:00 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,193
Anderson, SC
resqguy Offline
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Anderson, SC
I just put two in my new house. They aren't powered up yet. I've owned Trane before but they are more expensive. I was interested in Carrier but units are not available. I ended up with Goodman (Amana) because my installer says they can always get parts.

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: resqguy] #3034477
04/17/22 06:03 PM
04/17/22 06:03 PM
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,144
upstate western ny
sogtx Offline
master
sogtx  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,144
upstate western ny
Yuk - goodman amana

Trane
American Standard
Ruud
Rheem

They all has 10 year warranty now so…

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: sogtx] #3034495
04/17/22 07:07 PM
04/17/22 07:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,346
North Dakota
6PakBee Offline
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Posts: 9,346
North Dakota
All my HVAC guy has told me is to run, not walk, run fast, run far from Samsung. He will not install them even if the customer insists. He claims the problems after the sale makes his life miserable long after the homeowner forgets it was his idea.


"Only the best and brightest"
Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: 6PakBee] #3034500
04/17/22 07:25 PM
04/17/22 07:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 11,466
Central Florida
larrymopar360 Offline
I'm tired...Very tired.
larrymopar360  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 11,466
Central Florida
Goodman is bottom of barrel as far as reliability but it is low cost. I just finished a lot of researching for reliability so could replace mine and one in a rental home and American Standards are still very high on the list for least problematic.


Facts are stubborn things.
Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: larrymopar360] #3034501
04/17/22 07:37 PM
04/17/22 07:37 PM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 4,116
nowhere
S
Sniper Online content
master
Sniper  Online Content
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Posts: 4,116
nowhere
I have a Trane paid to have it installed. Zero issues for 5 years now. Bills went way down. The old one was 17 years old and starting to nickle and dime me, in addition to the high electric bill, lol. So we decided to preemptively replace it on our schedule rather than have it crap out in the middle of summer and a 2 month waiting list.

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: Sniper] #3034517
04/17/22 08:43 PM
04/17/22 08:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,057
Milford, OH
markz528 Offline
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markz528  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,057
Milford, OH
Originally Posted by Sniper
I have a Trane paid to have it installed. Zero issues for 5 years now. Bills went way down. The old one was 17 years old and starting to nickle and dime me, in addition to the high electric bill, lol. So we decided to preemptively replace it on our schedule rather than have it crap out in the middle of summer and a 2 month waiting list.


I think 3.5 ton is way too big for that house. You will short cycle the AC cycle and not be happy in the summer. My almost 1900 square foot 2 story old house in Cincinnati was very happy with a 2.5 ton unit. It was perfect for the house, but it was a well insulated tight house.

Correct - they won't cover warranty unless professional installer installs it, and then only that installer covers labor. I have had a couple Goodmans and know others that have them - none over 5 years old. They have been solid except the 4 ton I have in my new house. Installed professionally last year by previous owner. It was the top of the line Goodman - very complicated. Stay away from that. Nothing but trouble. It is computer controlled. I had trouble with it from the get go in heat mode. Had a bad outdoor TVX.

I would not hesitate to buy a Goodman from ebay. If it dies, the cost advantage is so large that it makes sense to just buy the parts if you can't sweet talk someone in covering it. Warranty is 10 years if professionally installed and its registered, otherwise 5 years if not registered. But that does not cover everything.

For my new shop I bought a 5 ton from HVAC direct - its an AirQuest. Paid $3650 delivered which I consider cheap. 14 SEER. I do all my HVAC work now.


67 Coronet 500 9.610 @ 139.20 mph
67 Coronet 500 (street car) 13.300 @ 101.75 mph
69 GTX (clone) - build in progress......
Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: markz528] #3034519
04/17/22 08:47 PM
04/17/22 08:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,057
Milford, OH
markz528 Offline
master
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Milford, OH
BTW - I have straight heat pump. No gas heat.

And remember - bigger is not always better in HVAC. Best AC is AC unit that runs all the time worst case.


67 Coronet 500 9.610 @ 139.20 mph
67 Coronet 500 (street car) 13.300 @ 101.75 mph
69 GTX (clone) - build in progress......
Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: IMGTX] #3034520
04/17/22 08:47 PM
04/17/22 08:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 700
MN
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Droop69 Offline
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Posts: 700
MN
Trane or Bryant, they will cost more but better quality controls and parts. It really depends on where you live as far as availability and service support as far as brands go.

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: Droop69] #3034529
04/17/22 09:17 PM
04/17/22 09:17 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,599
WI
Dcuda69 Offline
master
Dcuda69  Offline
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Posts: 4,599
WI
I have Rheem in my house both gas furnace and AC...1900sq ft tri-level...installed by a freind who runs an HVAC business certified /licensed installer. About 9 yrs old now....zero issues. Had him clean and tune up both systems last year just to make sure things were good...they were. Using a Pro1 wifi/programmable stat....works perfect.

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: Dcuda69] #3034547
04/17/22 10:09 PM
04/17/22 10:09 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 706
Central Michigan
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nuthinbutmopar Offline
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 706
Central Michigan
I have an acquaintance that works for one of the local HVAC companies. He worked me a deal for a Rheem system where they dropped it off on Friday, I installed it over the weekend, and they came back on Monday to do the "start-up". I got the full warranty for the system if parts go bad (including labor), but didn't pat the installation labor. If you know anybody in the business, you might be able to work something out...

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: nuthinbutmopar] #3034554
04/17/22 10:36 PM
04/17/22 10:36 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,057
Milford, OH
markz528 Offline
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Milford, OH
Originally Posted by nuthinbutmopar
I have an acquaintance that works for one of the local HVAC companies. He worked me a deal for a Rheem system where they dropped it off on Friday, I installed it over the weekend, and they came back on Monday to do the "start-up". I got the full warranty for the system if parts go bad (including labor), but didn't pat the installation labor. If you know anybody in the business, you might be able to work something out...


Unless your buddy will personally cover the labor, I don’t think you have a labor warranty……. Not based on my experience.


67 Coronet 500 9.610 @ 139.20 mph
67 Coronet 500 (street car) 13.300 @ 101.75 mph
69 GTX (clone) - build in progress......
Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: IMGTX] #3034559
04/17/22 10:52 PM
04/17/22 10:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,032
Highland, MI.
Sunroofcuda Offline
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Highland, MI.
Our house is going to be 17 this Sept. & they installed Goodman gas furnaces & A/C units in all the homes. My HVAC guy said Goodman private labels for other popular brands, and under their own name. They are a major manufacturer of the units. Our furnace is a high-efficiency & I have had 3 problems with it: at about a year old, the igniter rod broke, so my installer replaced it & never another problem. Then at about 10 years, the impeller bearings went out. I replaced the unit - EASY fix & under $100.00 for the part. Most recently (this winter), the collector box began leaking water. Once again, the part was under $100.00 & very easy to replace.

As far as the A/C unit, the capacitor went out last summer. Part was $30.00 & about 20 minutes to install - back in business.


No Man With A Good Car Needs To Be Justified
Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: Sunroofcuda] #3034569
04/17/22 11:54 PM
04/17/22 11:54 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 652
California's Tri-Valley
GB5andGY8 Offline
mopar
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 652
California's Tri-Valley
Originally Posted by Sunroofcuda
Our house is going to be 17 this Sept. & they installed Goodman gas furnaces & A/C units in all the homes. My HVAC guy said Goodman private labels for other popular brands, and under their own name. They are a major manufacturer of the units. Our furnace is a high-efficiency & I have had 3 problems with it: at about a year old, the igniter rod broke, so my installer replaced it & never another problem. Then at about 10 years, the impeller bearings went out. I replaced the unit - EASY fix & under $100.00 for the part. Most recently (this winter), the collector box began leaking water. Once again, the part was under $100.00 & very easy to replace.

As far as the A/C unit, the capacitor went out last summer. Part was $30.00 & about 20 minutes to install - back in business.


I researched Goodman and am upgrading the HVAC at our house with one of their systems. I like that they are US manufactured and have been in the business for a long time. They were taken over by a foreign company (Daikin - Japanese) awhile back that did a lot of the wall mount split systems and industrial systems, so the new management was capitalizing on what Goodman could also bring to the table for them to cover the market for different AC configurations.

As far as reliability, I guess I will get to find out first-hand. Major components are warranted for 10 years and the heat-exchanger has a lifetime warranty.

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: GB5andGY8] #3034582
04/18/22 06:19 AM
04/18/22 06:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,029
Abilene, Texas
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fastmark Offline
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Abilene, Texas
I used Goodman’s years ago in my rental units. They are the cheapest manufacturer out there. I have replaced all of them by now over the years. Switched to Rheem and have never had a problem since . They are a better unit. I’ve git a 4 ton Goodman in my House right now. It was installed by the biggest, most expensive installer in town. It will not cool the house. I’m installing a Rheem 16 seer this fall.

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: fastmark] #3034583
04/18/22 06:41 AM
04/18/22 06:41 AM
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Posts: 447
boston mass-moving to long isl...
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massdaytona Offline
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boston mass-moving to long isl...

and its always better to undersize the unit then to oversize it...

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: massdaytona] #3034707
04/18/22 02:54 PM
04/18/22 02:54 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,567
PA
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70Duster Offline
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PA
I don't think the brand matters as much as the installation and the complexity of the unit as far as longevity is concerned. If installed correctly, and you buy a unit on the lower end of the efficiency spectrum without all the variable speed motors and other complex circuit boards, you'll be fine. There are only a few manufacturers of compressors, condensers, evaporators and the associated fan motors, and they are used throughout all the brands. I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Goodman unit if installed by a reputable dealer.

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: 70Duster] #3034730
04/18/22 03:58 PM
04/18/22 03:58 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,212
New York
rarefish Offline
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Posts: 2,212
New York
Originally Posted by 70Duster
I don't think the brand matters as much as the installation and the complexity of the unit as far as longevity is concerned. If installed correctly, and you buy a unit on the lower end of the efficiency spectrum without all the variable speed motors and other complex circuit boards, you'll be fine. There are only a few manufacturers of compressors, condensers, evaporators and the associated fan motors, and they are used throughout all the brands. I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Goodman unit if installed by a reputable dealer.


Very true...
The systems reliability is often only as good as the installer who puts it in.

Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: rarefish] #3034751
04/18/22 04:43 PM
04/18/22 04:43 PM
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Posts: 5,760
Corpus Christi, TX
shanker Offline
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Corpus Christi, TX
I'm going to agree with everyone who said that the installer is the most important aspect of the performance of the unit.

I had a brand new unit installed in April 2020 after spending the second half of 2019 shopping and evaluating vendors. I live on the gulf coast where humidity control is VERY important to me. I went with a Bryan Evolution (same as the Carrier Infinity system) with a 5 stage VFD compressor, 21 seer system. I have an 1800sqft 2 story house and had all new ductwork installed also.

I am INCREDIBLY happy with my unit and the install of it (I still haven't finished drywall though) I recommend doing as much research as you can set aside time for.

When it comes to goodman, they do make some good units, but think of them as the cheapest version of previous generation/technology levels of A/C systems. I looked at Rheem/Ruud, Trane, Carrier/Bryant, Goodman quotes. I came up with a list of wants such as de-humidification control, filtration, etc, then searched for the best HVAC installer that best designed a system that quoted what I wanted. Half of the companies out of the 14 or so I called, didn't even come thru with a quote or gave me a "go away / we don't want this job" quote as they make more money doing unit swap outs and repairs than they do complete system design & installs.


The Federal Government has not yet learned that you cannot legislate morality 1970 Coronet R/T FF4/FF8/V85/V1G 440/Auto/3.23 1970 Coronet R/T FK5/FK5/V8W/V1W 440/Auto/3.55 1970 Super Bee TX9/TX9/V8W/N96 383/Auto/3.91 1975 Duster 360 VS29L5 Daily Driver
Re: Buying an HVAC Unit. Suggestions.... [Re: shanker] #3034763
04/18/22 05:13 PM
04/18/22 05:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,057
Milford, OH
markz528 Offline
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markz528  Offline
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Posts: 4,057
Milford, OH
And to add to the installer issue, most professional installers do not do what is required for 410A. You are supposed to purge with nitrogen when brazing. Very few do. Some don't even pull a vacuum - they just blow out with Freon. I personally do it right with nitrogen while brazing and pull to at least 50 micron vacuum level. I know professional installers that will call 500 microns good.


67 Coronet 500 9.610 @ 139.20 mph
67 Coronet 500 (street car) 13.300 @ 101.75 mph
69 GTX (clone) - build in progress......
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