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Re: 2010 5.7 valves ? [Re: Wailin D] #2931570
06/09/21 11:13 AM
06/09/21 11:13 AM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 8,235
Central Florida
larrymopar360 Offline
I'm tired...Very tired.
larrymopar360  Offline
I'm tired...Very tired.

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 8,235
Central Florida
VERY helpful info HotRodDave! Thank you.

I've had very good luck I guess with several Gen3's I've owned and help others procure.

I do like to to be prepared for IF I have this issue. I print stuff out from here and put in a file folder. Say I do have issues with my 2010 Charger 5.7 and would prefer all new parts instead of machining heads and prefer upgrading material quality instead of OEM.

New heads: what heads would be best?

Camshaft, lifters, valves and springs, etc.

What brand?

I wouldn't mind performance upgrade too but it really doesn't need it and I want to maintain smooth idle and no codes so I'm wondering about question WailinD asked "Since the Apache head flows more than the Eagle head, would the ports be too big for a stock displacement 5.7"?

Also, I'm sure this has been asked but how easily would a 6.1 or 6.4 go into a 2010 Charger? Would it be nightmare of codes and harness issues? I know there would be other future upgrades needed such as axles etc.

Thanks for any help!


Facts are stubborn things.
Re: 2010 5.7 valves ? [Re: larrymopar360] #2931651
06/09/21 02:27 PM
06/09/21 02:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 10,775
Kalispell Mt.
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HotRodDave Offline
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Kalispell Mt.
If your 2010 charger is a 5.7 than a 6.4 long block bolts right in and runs awesome. If you get a complete engine you will need to switch the manifolds and if you use a truck 6.4 you will have to switch the pan, pickup tube and timing cover also.

The best heads depends on what you want the end result to be and what bottom end you are gonna run, the 6.4 BGE truck heads are the best but will lower your compression and your engine will want to turn more RPM so to take advantage of them you will need a tune, on a stock build I would probably just buy some new eagle heads, they are not a slouch in the flow department at all, if you want a little extra performance and you just replacing heads get em milled .030. Some of the mass rebuilder heads I have seen from fleabay have big steps in the machine work from where the seats are pressed in. OEM heads can easily last well past 200,000 miles so if your doing a stock type build there is not much point in upgrading for better material, I don't see much back to back real world comparisons of aftermarket stuff. The roller lifters are a concern in 2010, if you just want to spend money upgrading something that would be the very first place I would start, get a set of hellcat lifters from your dealer (I think all the new lifters are upgraded to these now, they have bigger needle bearings, I can spot em when I see em but don't know the part number), by far the most common issue in these engines is the lifter, more so than all the other failures combined.. You can also upgrade the springs to 6.4 springs, they also now use the same part number so get em from the dealer, they are cheap, I have seen an occasional broken spring starting around 150,000 miles.

With new 6.4 springs and hellcat lifters the vast majority of people would never have to touch one of these engine for well over 200,000 miles, assuming they never overheat it, those 3 issues cover 99.9% of the engines problems, alegedly (I have never personally seen one)there are timing chain issues in a handful of engines and I seen one hydrolock and bend rods when he drove in deep water, one dropped valve seats but it had gotten so hot the intake was melting. Tons of wiped out cams from roller lifters going bad.


I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!



Re: 2010 5.7 valves ? [Re: HotRodDave] #2931773
06/09/21 08:21 PM
06/09/21 08:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 8,235
Central Florida
larrymopar360 Offline
I'm tired...Very tired.
larrymopar360  Offline
I'm tired...Very tired.

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 8,235
Central Florida
Thanks Dave. I printed out this info. I like the idea of new eagle heads on my 5.7 if bottom end is fine and hellcat lifters and springs and not adding to list with the 6.4 block. I am very satisfied with the stock power despite more power always better. I'm super on top of preventative maintenance (coolant/distilled water and watching temps, new hoses, thermostat, tensioner and idler pullies) so I don't foresee ever overheating. I hate waiting until something does happen. Much rather have a file with info so that I'm not starting at zero if I do have a problem and car is down for months. up


Facts are stubborn things.
Re: 2010 5.7 valves ? [Re: larrymopar360] #2931818
06/09/21 10:40 PM
06/09/21 10:40 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 863
south louisiana
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lowell66dart Offline
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south louisiana
You should have been a Boy Scout...our motto was Be Prepared.


2017 Dodge 2500 4WD 6.4 Hemi
1972 Dodge W-200 Crewcab 5.9 Magnum
2016 Challenger Shaker Plus

Re: 2010 5.7 valves ? [Re: lowell66dart] #2931824
06/09/21 11:13 PM
06/09/21 11:13 PM
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 112
Southern Missouri
Wailin D Offline
member
Wailin D  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 112
Southern Missouri
I have researched the lifter issue for some time. I wondered if anyone has tried to remedy this problem with aftermarket lifters. Lifters that appear to be good alternatives include:

Johnson Lifters with axle oiling - #2356
Johnson Hylift with Direct Shot oiling - B-2335SE (16)
Crower EDM axle oiling - 66323PH-16
Isky HPx lifters - 3577-HYRT (needle bearing) - 3575-HYRT (bushing)

I have not bought into this being a lack of oiling issue, but the added oil to the needle bearings and axle can't hurt. I wonder if the Isky bushed lifters would take care of the problem (Isky modifies Johnson lifters). Anybody with experience using any of these lifters?

Re: 2010 5.7 valves ? [Re: lowell66dart] #2932224
06/11/21 10:10 AM
06/11/21 10:10 AM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 8,235
Central Florida
larrymopar360 Offline
I'm tired...Very tired.
larrymopar360  Offline
I'm tired...Very tired.

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 8,235
Central Florida
Originally Posted by lowell66dart
You should have been a Boy Scout...our motto was Be Prepared.
Lol. Seriously though it's great when a problem rears it's ugly head and you can pull out a file from THIS forum and have all kinds of answers ready!


Facts are stubborn things.
Re: 2010 5.7 valves ? [Re: Wailin D] #2932226
06/11/21 10:13 AM
06/11/21 10:13 AM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 8,235
Central Florida
larrymopar360 Offline
I'm tired...Very tired.
larrymopar360  Offline
I'm tired...Very tired.

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 8,235
Central Florida
Originally Posted by Wailin D
I have researched the lifter issue for some time. I wondered if anyone has tried to remedy this problem with aftermarket lifters. Lifters that appear to be good alternatives include:

Johnson Lifters with axle oiling - #2356
Johnson Hylift with Direct Shot oiling - B-2335SE (16)
Crower EDM axle oiling - 66323PH-16
Isky HPx lifters - 3577-HYRT (needle bearing) - 3575-HYRT (bushing)

I have not bought into this being a lack of oiling issue, but the added oil to the needle bearings and axle can't hurt. I wonder if the Isky bushed lifters would take care of the problem (Isky modifies Johnson lifters). Anybody with experience using any of these lifters?
Very good info and I haven't bought into the oiling issue either because aren't at least some of the others if not all same design; 6.1, 6.2, 6.4? Not all these experience same issue. I know there's different oil to piston at top of stroke I believe but concerning lifters?


Facts are stubborn things.
Re: 2010 5.7 valves ? [Re: larrymopar360] #2932289
06/11/21 02:52 PM
06/11/21 02:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 10,775
Kalispell Mt.
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HotRodDave Offline
I Live Here
HotRodDave  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 10,775
Kalispell Mt.
I wish I could capture this in pictures for you butt ever since the formum "updated" last time I have not been able to get pics to load.

The lifter issue is very simple, it appears to me they tried to add more small needle bearings in about 09 with the eagle redesign but it resulted in the rollers not lasting nearly as long, you can't put the older ones in the newer engines without deleting MDS (you can put the new ones in the old engines though) witch in my opinion is stupid as I have never seen any MDS lifter fail and plenty of lifters in completely NON MDS engines fail so you can't even blame it on the system. Around 2013 or so they switched to a larger needle bearing in the roller, it is very easy to see in person the larger needles and it seems to have eliminated the issue as the only ones I have seen fail all had the smaller needle bearings in them, lube can get in the larger bearing easier and they seem to carry the load better because they are larger. Now the lifter the dealer sells all have a unified part number for all gen III hemis and it has the larger bearings and seems to last much better. The aftermarket ones I have had my hands on (I've not played with all of them for sure) feel sloppier and I wouldn't trust them as far as I can throw them, I have a set of brand new no name chinese aftermarket ones (supposedly an upgrade) on the shelf right now and would use a set of large bearing used lifters before I would use these, I am tempted to throw them in the scrap metal bin like I do with all the small bearing lifters I find.

If you get the right stock lifter they are good enough for almost any engine out there. Unless you are running some exotic very high lift very high RPM engine I would not waste any time or money on any aftermarket lifter. The big needle bearing lifters handle as much lift as the stock heads can handle and are good to at least 7000 RPM and I have never seen the ones with those big needle bearing stop rolling and eat a cam.


I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!



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