Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
#2892654
02/24/21 12:27 PM
02/24/21 12:27 PM
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Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 15 Ohio
Old buddy
OP
member
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OP
member
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 15
Ohio
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I have a 69 road runner that is going to be a street/strip car that I plan on running on 93 octane pump gas with the addition of a little race fuel at the track. I have no intentions of making it a cruiser...I want it more oriented toward drag strip performance. I have been out of Mopars for the past 12-13 years, at that time I had a 68 road runner that had a 440 recipe that was for a low 12 car. I know that technology had came a long way with cylinder heads, suspension, camshafts, etc since I built that 440 in 2000. I havent decided on a lot yet, but I have decided on Cal Trac Mono leaf springs, Cal Trac bars, Cal Trac rear shocks. The rear end is a Dana 60 with 4.10 gears. The trans will be a 727...no idea on stall speed or converter brand yet. Ill be running a 28-29" tall tire in the rear. I plan on adding torque boxes and frame connectors, and possibly a 6 point bar if the car runs quick enough. Itll have an A12 hood for fresh air.
Since ive been out of this hobby for so long, what would you guys recommend running to get me there? I have access to a 440 and the original 383 thats in the car. I was thinking something along the lines of Trick Flow 240 heads, roller solid camshaft, lightweight pistons, H beam rods, M1 Single plane, 950hp Holley or AED, all MSD ignition, TTI 2" step headers, fuel cell with -8 line to the regulator with -6 going to the float bowls. Will a stock stroke 440 get me to mid 11s and lower if I decided I wanted to go quicker? I really dont want to shift this car much over 62-6400 if that helps.
I appreciate any advice
Last edited by Old buddy; 02/24/21 12:30 PM.
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: Old buddy]
#2892658
02/24/21 12:40 PM
02/24/21 12:40 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,664 Wichita
GY3
master
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master
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,664
Wichita
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We do what you're wanting to albeit with a much higher gear, 3.54's, 2800 stall, pump gas and through the mufflers. It is a little bigger at 505". Really don't need big headers or large fuel line to get it done, either. The TF240's are a good choice. See my build in the Member Projects and Survivor pics section for more details. https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/428197/11.html
Last edited by GY3; 02/24/21 12:42 PM.
'63 Dodge 330 11.19 @ 121 mph Pump gas, n/a, through the mufflers on street tires with 3.54's. 3,600 lbs. 10.01 @ 133mph with a 250 shot of nitrous an a splash of race gas. 1.36 60 ft. 3,700 lbs.
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: Old buddy]
#2892661
02/24/21 12:49 PM
02/24/21 12:49 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,492 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,492
So. Burlington, Vt.
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Your plans look fine.
I’d suggest building a 505 out of the 440 block for some easy 10’s.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: Old buddy]
#2892677
02/24/21 01:41 PM
02/24/21 01:41 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,098 Massillon, Ohio
cudatom
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,098
Massillon, Ohio
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Did just what you want with my 67 wagon but used LD stroker. Like others said go 505 with your 440. No need for a roller cam. I also like the dominator vs the 4150 carb. They can be very streetable, just takes some time to get them squared away.
I'm at 4100lbs plus and have no problem running 11"0s with less head(edelbrock performers)than you are looking at. Good luck and keep us posted.
Ok
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: fast68plymouth]
#2892678
02/24/21 01:42 PM
02/24/21 01:42 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA
StealthWedge67
master
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master
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319
Puyallup, WA
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Your recipe should get you to where you want to be, as long as the chassis is up to the task, with room to spare. My Satellite sits right where you want to be with CNC’d Stealths and a mid-sized solid flat tappet. 28” tires and 4.10’s work real well together, should have you at about 6400 at the stripe depending on your converter.
I would think TF240’s and a solid roller in the range of 250-256 at .050 on the intake side really should have you knocking on the 10 second door, if not barging right through it.
LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: one bad fish]
#2892687
02/24/21 02:05 PM
02/24/21 02:05 PM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,069 Michigan
A727Tflite
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,069
Michigan
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A12, 4.56 axle, 9” converter, stock blueprinted short block and heads with old cheater cam, .440” / .470” hydraulic, through flowmasters. 3725 pounds on the starting line, last time out (2005) 11.28. I drive it on the street as it is.
For you, change the axle ratio, use a good 10” converter, lose some et. Use a better cam and heads and get more back than you lost.
Boom.
Last edited by Transman; 02/24/21 02:16 PM.
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: fast68plymouth]
#2892699
02/24/21 02:23 PM
02/24/21 02:23 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,985 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,985
Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
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Since the rotating assembly is pretty much the same price from 440 540 cubes , IMHO the bigger you can go the better. I am betting Fast68 suggested the 505 due to it probably working with an internal oil system. If you are willing to go external pickup, I would chose a 535 combo, 4.5 stroke and 4.350 bore. 10/1 compression, good flowing small port heads and a solid cam similar to the 590 mopar cam. A 950 will leave power on the table. I had good luck with a ported tunnelram with a pair of 800 holley dps on my 535 with 906 heads. Those carbs may not have been ideal, but the point is a big motor needs air! It went 10.50s at 3400 lbs and there was a fair amount wrong with some of my choices in that build 40 years ago. I ran those numbers with 4.10 gears and 33x15 slicks. Shifted at 5700. If i were to do it again it would get fuel injection on that tunnelram.
8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: gregsdart]
#2892717
02/24/21 02:52 PM
02/24/21 02:52 PM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 511 Temperance, MI
68 HEMI GTS
mopar
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mopar
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 511
Temperance, MI
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Build a 500 ci engine. My 69 rr runs 11.0-10.90’s @ 4000# race weight, on pump gas, driving to the track. 10.5:1 400/511, nothing trick, just a full interior, heater working, street car.
Last edited by 68 HEMI GTS; 02/24/21 02:53 PM.
68 Dart GTS "HEMI" 10.30 @ 131 pump gas street car 3780# 69 Roadrunner 511 six pack 10.92 drive to track street car
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: Old buddy]
#2892731
02/24/21 03:12 PM
02/24/21 03:12 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,354 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,354
Marion, South Carolina [><]
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A stock stroke 440 w/ some Trick Flow 240s and a decent cam will get you mid 11s easily. You just need to know what you have currently (decent crank and rods, etc.) and do the homework to compare what it'll cost to rebuild what you have versus building a stroker. The stroker is great, but will add a bunch of money to the project. A decent carb is way cheaper than going EFI. Reading things nowadays it's amazing these cars ever ran at all w/ carburetors on them, lol.
For what you're wanting, a stock crank, stock LY rods w/ some ARP bolts, and some $450 Wiseco Pro True Street pistons will work just fine. I'd get Dwayne to spec you a cam...but even a shelf hydraulic flat tappet (something comparable to the old MP 509/292) will work. Some Trick Flow 240s, a decent single plane manifold, 850 holley, etc.
Not knocking anyone's recommendations thus far, but mid 11s can be done cheap. You'll have $2500+ in just the stroker kit (if buying new parts). You should be able to do a stock style rotating assembly w/ a freshly turned stock crank, resized stock rods, and new pistons for $1k or so.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: an8sec70cuda]
#2892737
02/24/21 03:25 PM
02/24/21 03:25 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,296 Chicago, IL
TonyS451
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,296
Chicago, IL
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A stock stroke 440 w/ some Trick Flow 240s and a decent cam will get you mid 11s easily. You just need to know what you have currently (decent crank and rods, etc.) and do the homework to compare what it'll cost to rebuild what you have versus building a stroker. The stroker is great, but will add a bunch of money to the project. A decent carb is way cheaper than going EFI. Reading things nowadays it's amazing these cars ever ran at all w/ carburetors on them, lol.
For what you're wanting, a stock crank, stock LY rods w/ some ARP bolts, and some $450 Wiseco Pro True Street pistons will work just fine. I'd get Dwayne to spec you a cam...but even a shelf hydraulic flat tappet (something comparable to the old MP 509/292) will work. Some Trick Flow 240s, a decent single plane manifold, 850 holley, etc.
Not knocking anyone's recommendations thus far, but mid 11s can be done cheap. You'll have $2500+ in just the stroker kit (if buying new parts). You should be able to do a stock style rotating assembly w/ a freshly turned stock crank, resized stock rods, and new pistons for $1k or so.
I agree with Chip on this. Stock stroke 440 w decent pistons and rods, TF 240's and a mild solid flat tappet or even HFT, 850 holley, 4.10 and 3500 stall should slam dunk into the mid 11's. A 505 will do it easier if money isnt an issue, but if mid 11's is your goal, stroker is not necessary.
2 kids and a dog
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: TonyS451]
#2892740
02/24/21 03:32 PM
02/24/21 03:32 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,534 bronx n.y
one bad fish
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,534
bronx n.y
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A stock stroke 440 w/ some Trick Flow 240s and a decent cam will get you mid 11s easily. You just need to know what you have currently (decent crank and rods, etc.) and do the homework to compare what it'll cost to rebuild what you have versus building a stroker. The stroker is great, but will add a bunch of money to the project. A decent carb is way cheaper than going EFI. Reading things nowadays it's amazing these cars ever ran at all w/ carburetors on them, lol.
For what you're wanting, a stock crank, stock LY rods w/ some ARP bolts, and some $450 Wiseco Pro True Street pistons will work just fine. I'd get Dwayne to spec you a cam...but even a shelf hydraulic flat tappet (something comparable to the old MP 509/292) will work. Some Trick Flow 240s, a decent single plane manifold, 850 holley, etc.
Not knocking anyone's recommendations thus far, but mid 11s can be done cheap. You'll have $2500+ in just the stroker kit (if buying new parts). You should be able to do a stock style rotating assembly w/ a freshly turned stock crank, resized stock rods, and new pistons for $1k or so.
I agree with Chip on this. Stock stroke 440 w decent pistons and rods, TF 240's and a mild solid flat tappet or even HFT, 850 holley, 4.10 and 3500 stall should slam dunk into the mid 11's. A 505 will do it easier if money isnt an issue, but if mid 11's is your goal, stroker is not necessary. thats what my car goes
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: one bad fish]
#2892751
02/24/21 03:56 PM
02/24/21 03:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,492 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,492
So. Burlington, Vt.
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If you read all the stuff the OP is already planing on(for both the engine and the car)....... adding the 4.25 crank and 50+ cubes is a no brainer. If there’s any chance an upgrade to the stroker would be a part of the future plans, by far the cheapest point in time to make that upgrade is........ when the motor is built the first time around. And then there’s always: Will a stock stroke 440 get me to mid 11s and lower if I decided I wanted to go quicker? I really dont want to shift this car much over 62-6400 if that helps The frequency of builds based on ET’s at the track....... where the owner doesn’t end up wanting to go quicker........ is almost zero.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: fast68plymouth]
#2892753
02/24/21 03:59 PM
02/24/21 03:59 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,354 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,354
Marion, South Carolina [><]
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Well, I guess he didn't mention a budget...so spend away.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: an8sec70cuda]
#2892772
02/24/21 05:04 PM
02/24/21 05:04 PM
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,457 Sydney,Australia
tex013
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,457
Sydney,Australia
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My small , 440RB , 10.75:1 , 9 1/2" 5000 stall , 4.1 gear , 28" Pro Bracket radial , solid flat tappett , 0.520 lift / 258@050 , CNC stealths ,HP1000 holley , Victor 440 ,1 7/8 hooker headers+ exhaust to diff , pump gas . Best of 10.88@125ish mostly 10.90s. 3690lbs 68 Satellite . Same short motor , TF270 , Super Victor , 4500 1050 , 30" Pro bracket radial , 6000 stall *" , 10.70@127ish. Went to 2" Dougs D452 with the 505 and used them on the 440/TF270 motor . 505RB with 11:1 , same top end as 440 (Stealth / HP1000) , solid flat tappet .600 nett lift 272@050 ,10.50@127ish , 28" radial 505 with TF270, 4500 etc 10.25@129ish Then split block Heck i went 11.20(?) with a 509 cam in that 440 This is my daily driver , in fact i am driving it interstate in a couple weeks to race . 11/12 hrs 1050kilometers(650 miles) each way Tex
Last edited by tex013; 02/24/21 05:07 PM.
New best ET 10.259@129.65 . New best MPH 130.32 Finally fitted a solid cam, stepped it up a bit more 3690lbs through the mufflers New World block 3780lbs 10.278@130.80 . Wowser 10.253@130.24 footbraking from 1500rpm Power by Tex's Automotive
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Re: Mid to low 11s on pump gas?
[Re: Old buddy]
#2892799
02/24/21 06:19 PM
02/24/21 06:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,923 NC
440Jim
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,923
NC
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I was thinking something along the lines of Trick Flow 240 heads, roller solid camshaft, lightweight pistons, H beam rods, M1 Single plane, 950hp Holley or AED, all MSD ignition, TTI 2" step headers, fuel cell with -8 line to the regulator with -6 going to the float bowls. Will a stock stroke 440 get me to mid 11s and lower if I decided I wanted to go quicker? I really dont want to shift this car much over 62-6400 if that helps.
I appreciate any advice Yes, your basic combo will get you there. Don't be afraid of some converter stall speed to improve track performance, ~3800-4200 rpm. But since you are putting new H-beam rods and good pistons in the build, adding the 4.250" stroke crankshaft won't cost much more. Then you have a base for a 10 second "street" car. With the stroker, I would suggest the Trick Flow 270 vs the 240 heads. Now finding a new pair of Trick Flow heads right now will be tough...
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