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833 4-speed limitations #2874545
01/14/21 11:48 PM
01/14/21 11:48 PM
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junction city oregon
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viperblue72 Offline OP
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I’m sure I could do a search and get a satisfactory answer to the question.
As some of you may know I have a 511” TF270 650+hp build going in my cuda with a 4-speed.
My question isn’t will it hold up to abuse. Because I know with hard driving it wouldn’t.
But if I don’t power shift it and/or launch it too hard, could I get a decent life out of one?
If not what would be recommended for a street/strip manual trans?! I also don’t know what clutch to get.
What are your thoughts and experiences? Thanks

Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: viperblue72] #2874551
01/15/21 12:08 AM
01/15/21 12:08 AM
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Pgh, PA
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Bull1tt Offline
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I’ve heard 550 ft lbs torque to a 23 spline and 650 to an 18 spline.

Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: Bull1tt] #2874563
01/15/21 01:40 AM
01/15/21 01:40 AM
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junction city oregon
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viperblue72 Offline OP
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I have a 18 spline that needs rebuilt and has a bad cluster if I remember right. Not sure it would be worth it. Are all internal parts available through aftermarket?

Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: viperblue72] #2874571
01/15/21 02:23 AM
01/15/21 02:23 AM
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Missouri
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jwb123 Offline
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Brewers would be who I call when needing parts to overhaul any A-833 transmission. I have also used Zumbrota Gear as well, they have lots of manual transmission parts.

http://www.brewersperformance.com/

https://www.zumbrotadrivetrain.com/

Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: viperblue72] #2874603
01/15/21 06:49 AM
01/15/21 06:49 AM
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N/E, Michigan
RATTRAP Offline
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Soft-lok Clutch, Get a Blowproof bell housing with a window to adjust the springs.
Get a hold of Hyatt Racing they can provide the Bellhousing and set the clutch up for you.
Hyatt racing

Last edited by RATTRAP; 01/15/21 06:52 AM.
Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: RATTRAP] #2874618
01/15/21 08:52 AM
01/15/21 08:52 AM
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junction city oregon
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viperblue72 Offline OP
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I already have. QuickTime Bellhousing. I’ll check out the soft lock clutch.
I looked up the brewers site. I had no idea this stuff was available. That is great. 👍

Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: viperblue72] #2874705
01/15/21 01:13 PM
01/15/21 01:13 PM
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South San Francisco, Ca
70sixpkrt Offline
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Herb's GTX (RIP) has a 548 Hemi with 650+hp and was running an 18 spline with a Mcleod Street Twin clutch.


[img]http://www.imgur.com/hxlGUJt.gif[/img]
4-speed
3:54 Dana
13.01 @107.93 with street tires (not hooking up)
Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: 70sixpkrt] #2874750
01/15/21 02:37 PM
01/15/21 02:37 PM
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junction city oregon
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viperblue72 Offline OP
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Do you know if there is any tricks to strengthen them?

Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: viperblue72] #2874881
01/15/21 07:49 PM
01/15/21 07:49 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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Cab_Burge Offline
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High HP and high traction is what usually damages drivetrain part, if your tires spin easy your good up grin


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: viperblue72] #2874899
01/15/21 08:57 PM
01/15/21 08:57 PM
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Rittman Ohio
fourgearsavoy Offline
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Originally Posted by viperblue72
Do you know if there is any tricks to strengthen them?

Something has to slip at your power level twocents
If this thing has traction and torque along with weight it will strip the teeth off third gear. The HEMI box can take a beating but it does have it's limitations and can be broken. Look into a clutch with an adjustable base pressure and a sintered iron disc that will allow slippage and still last a long time.
I have a Richmond 5-speed that I race with a street HEMI box that I used last year just to cruise with and I whoop on it too but with street rubber that spins when the torque is applied.
Gus beer

my richmond.JPG

64 Plymouth Savoy
493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow
5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box
Dana 60
Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: fourgearsavoy] #2874926
01/15/21 10:16 PM
01/15/21 10:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
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South San Francisco, Ca
70sixpkrt Offline
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Wow!! That is gorgeous. punkrocka


[img]http://www.imgur.com/hxlGUJt.gif[/img]
4-speed
3:54 Dana
13.01 @107.93 with street tires (not hooking up)
Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: 70sixpkrt] #2875112
01/16/21 02:35 PM
01/16/21 02:35 PM
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Los Osos, Ca
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CKessel Offline
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For many years, Liberty was the go to for upgrades on oe transmissions. They are still around. Until the Lenco's, G-Force,Nash and others came about, including Liberty's own unit, all you had were oe units. The Hemi trans and the Ford Top Loader were used quite a bit for upgrades. Muncies could not take the abuse so they got swapped.


Carl Kessel
Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: 70sixpkrt] #2875283
01/16/21 10:02 PM
01/16/21 10:02 PM
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Rittman Ohio
fourgearsavoy Offline
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Originally Posted by 70sixpkrt
Wow!! That is gorgeous. punkrocka


Thanks it shifts like lightning at full throttle and I haven't broken it yet . I'm putting it back in for next season and hopefully we can get some passes.

Gus beer


64 Plymouth Savoy
493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow
5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box
Dana 60
Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: fourgearsavoy] #2876254
01/18/21 07:39 PM
01/18/21 07:39 PM
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junction city oregon
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viperblue72 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by fourgearsavoy
Originally Posted by 70sixpkrt
Wow!! That is gorgeous. punkrocka


Thanks it shifts like lightning at full throttle and I haven't broken it yet . I'm putting it back in for next season and hopefully we can get some passes.

Gus beer



Can I pm you?

Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: viperblue72] #2876258
01/18/21 07:46 PM
01/18/21 07:46 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,550
Rittman Ohio
fourgearsavoy Offline
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Rittman Ohio
Sure I answer any questions .

Gus beer


64 Plymouth Savoy
493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow
5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box
Dana 60
Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: Cab_Burge] #2877634
01/21/21 12:39 AM
01/21/21 12:39 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 243
Cranberry Twp PA (North of Pit...
rumblefish72 Offline
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I'm going to agree with Mr Cab ... tires that hook will be what kills the tranny. On the average street surface, it's hard to get enough hook to break things. I'm running the MT ET Street R Bias 32x17.5-15LT with a Dana and 4.56's and even on fresh pavement, it hardly hooks. If I dump the clutch and shock the tires on the street, it just blows the tires away. If I'm playing around with another car on the street from a standstill, I will soft release the clutch to try not to blow them away then I have to slowly get into the loud pedal to have any hope of getting a good street 60 ft. I'm sure I would break parts at the track if the surface was well prepped. One time, I dumped the clutch at National Trail and when I got to the timeslip shack, they told me I left parts on the starting line. I walked over there and they handed my the bumper from my pinion snubber wink

I too wonder where the limits are for the 18-spline 833. I asked Jamie from Passon and he said that things break on the 2 to 3rd shift so don't power shift that one at the track with a high-torque car. And use a "clutch tamer" http://clutchtamer.com/ device to soft engage the clutch off the line. Or, I've read about the using sintered iron or sintered bronze clutch disks with the clutch tamer at the track and then adjusting the clutch tamer to apply the squeeze just slow enough keep the tires from breaking loose. Those disks are probably hard to live with on the street. I think that when in 4th gear, the transmission is strongest since it's straight through. I wonder if it makes sense to keep a numerically high gear in the rear and then short-shift into 4th. 4th in my car is way too high, I top out in the 1/4 mile at like 6500 RPM in 3rd ... no way I could I get into 4th in the quarter mile at my HP level!

What would I buy if I was willing to spend stupid money: https://www.6xdgearbox.com/

BellhousingTransCuda.jpg
Last edited by rumblefish72; 01/21/21 12:55 AM. Reason: Addition of link to sequential 6 speed

1972 Pro-Street 'Cuda, 500" Eagle stoker B Block, Eddy RPM heads, Victor Manifold, 850 Mighty Demon, Hemi 4 Speed, Dana 60 w/4.88 gears - Built by Hansen Racing Middlesex - NJ
Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: rumblefish72] #2879086
01/23/21 06:12 PM
01/23/21 06:12 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
DrCharles Offline
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Originally Posted by rumblefish72
What would I buy if I was willing to spend stupid money: https://www.6xdgearbox.com/


I looked around the site and didn't even see a price. I think it falls into the "if you have to ask, you can't afford it" category whistling

Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: DrCharles] #2879115
01/23/21 07:01 PM
01/23/21 07:01 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,550
Rittman Ohio
fourgearsavoy Offline
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Rittman Ohio
A good fast shifting manual transmission that will take a whoopin is built of the finest materials available that doesn't come cheap. 10 years ago my Richmond was $2500 and the faceplate mods were just under a grand for the parts and cryo-treatment to the gears .
Liberty makes a nice Nash style transmission for around $5000 and G-Force also offers many different style transmissions for any application. It's really all in the clutch setup because you can put an 18 spline A833 transmission in a street/strip car with a good adjustable clutch and have it live a reasonable situation. Car weight ,traction ,and torque need slip somewhere and if it aint the clutch it has to be the tires. My car isn't that fast and I run a 9" tire with a sintered bronze disc with an old school Hays adjustable plate and my Richmond is still in one piece with about 160 passes on it.

Gus beer


64 Plymouth Savoy
493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow
5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box
Dana 60
Re: 833 4-speed limitations [Re: DrCharles] #2879130
01/23/21 07:25 PM
01/23/21 07:25 PM
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The Pale Blue Dot
Skeptic Offline
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Originally Posted by DrCharles
Originally Posted by rumblefish72
What would I buy if I was willing to spend stupid money: https://www.6xdgearbox.com/


I looked around the site and didn't even see a price. I think it falls into the "if you have to ask, you can't afford it" category whistling

Looks like they don't sell direct, one of their distributors shows a starting price of 19K, so yes, if you have to ask...







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